From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Tue Feb 1 00:14:23 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id AAA08900 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Tue, 1 Feb 2000 00:14:23 -0500 From: "Brian Foster" To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com Subject: Wow... thank you re: Series as a daily driver Message-Id: <20000201050721.KQVQ1148.mta05.onebox.com@onebox.com> Date: Mon, 31 Jan 2000 21:07:21 -0800 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org I tried to respond to everyone's input personally and directly. The input was incredible. I am still not out of the running, but I certainly don't want to hog it either if I can place it into a good mendo_recce family member's hands. To see the ad: 1) go to: www.ocautotrader.com 2) enter the site 3) go to "Sport Utility" 4) Change the "Make" to "Land Rover" 5) Change "Ending Year" to "1970's" 6) Press the "Search" button You should get only one result. I've decided to sell the 1976 2002 quickly in case anyone is interested (so I can get closer to the goal of owning the LR). Cheers, Brian Foster Irvine CA ___________________________________________________________________ To get your own FREE ZDNet onebox - FREE voicemail, email, and fax, all in one place - sign up today at http://www.zdnetonebox.com From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Tue Feb 1 00:18:51 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id AAA09267 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Tue, 1 Feb 2000 00:18:51 -0500 From: "Brian Foster" To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com Subject: non-LR: Win2K launch in San Fran 2/15-17? Message-Id: <20000201051116.NPBP12271.mta01.onebox.com@onebox.com> Date: Mon, 31 Jan 2000 21:11:16 -0800 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Anyone planning to attend the Win2K show in San Fran Feb 15-17? I have to go up to work the booth as the Server Product Marketing representative. I am planning on driving up 2/14 and back down 2/18. I am not sure how much time I'll have to be social, but if we want to have an informal mendo_recce gathering in the city one night to quaff a brew or two at a micro brewery... I might be game! Cheers, Brian Foster Irvine CA ___________________________________________________________________ To get your own FREE ZDNet onebox - FREE voicemail, email, and fax, all in one place - sign up today at http://www.zdnetonebox.com From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Tue Feb 1 00:23:31 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id AAA09278 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Tue, 1 Feb 2000 00:23:31 -0500 User-Agent: Microsoft Outlook Express Macintosh Edition - 5.01 (1630) Date: Mon, 31 Jan 2000 21:19:06 -0800 Subject: Re: Water Plugged Air Filter Re: Mud Run From: Jeff Rogers To: Mendo Recce List Message-ID: Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Actually, I'm certain that it isn't functioning. This is was the user error. I plugged the drain to prevent water from entering while wading. I should have created a sump if I was going to do this. Do you know how much water, if any, you take in? I'm surprised at the volume that found its way into the system. > >> I stumbled onto this functionality without knowing and >> turned my air filter into a cork, but I'm almost sure that if the filter >> were removed and a jug were mounted to the drain on the filter canister, >> that five hours on the road would collect about a quart of water. :^) > > Interesting. I've never had such a problem while running the Mantec. Are you > sure the drain is functioning? > > Jeremy From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Tue Feb 1 00:59:11 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id AAA09407 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Tue, 1 Feb 2000 00:59:11 -0500 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <200002010451.UAA06891@proxy4.ba.best.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 31 Jan 2000 21:46:34 -0800 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com From: Russ Wilson Subject: BMW Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org >> >> BMW X5. Bigger than a Freelander and smaller than a Disco > >Actually its a tad bigger than a new Rangie, yet not as tall. I know you said that you drove one but the thing I saw sure didn't look that big..... Is the X5 the only new 4x4 model that BMW has out right now?? Russ and Leslie Wilson "Expertise was best defined in terms not of what the expert already knew, but of how easily the expert could find things out." - Nathaniel Borenstein From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Tue Feb 1 01:28:07 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id BAA09421 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Tue, 1 Feb 2000 01:28:07 -0500 Message-Id: <200002010612.WAA00840@proxy4.ba.best.com> Comments: Authenticated sender is From: "Tom Walsh" To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com Date: Mon, 31 Jan 2000 22:10:44 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Re: BMW X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.31) Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org > >> > >> BMW X5. Bigger than a Freelander and smaller than a Disco > > > >Actually its a tad bigger than a new Rangie, yet not as tall. > > I know you said that you drove one but the thing I saw sure didn't look > that big..... Is the X5 the only new 4x4 model that BMW has out right > now?? It is the only one, its deceptive because its more like a cross of a big station wagon and sport ute.... ( go check out the Beamer web page as I am generalizing off memory here ) The wheelbase is the same as a rangie, and the body is just a shade longer. The vehicle is fairly roomy inside.. but not huge (just like a Rangie )... It shares the Hill descent control with new LR's ( and they rightfully credit Land Rover for it ) It is a heavily re-inforced space frame ( specifically re-inforced ) to allow the same handling as the sedans... 0-60 is ~7.0 seconds weight is about 4500 lbs Full time all wheel drive, no low range. Front, side and side head airbags ( front and rear on the side ones ) She'll place the order this week maybe for delivery in May ( its my birthday present to her ! ) Back to work to pay for it all! TomW > > Russ and Leslie Wilson > > "Expertise was best defined in terms not of what the expert already knew, > but of how easily the expert could find things out." > - Nathaniel Borenstein > > > > *---------*---------* "Tonka" Truck, Lil Buggar, Lt Brigade, Posh,.. LandRovers "I love the smell of Null pointers in the morning" tomw@best.com, twalsh@redback.com From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Tue Feb 1 02:25:11 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id CAA09449 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Tue, 1 Feb 2000 02:25:11 -0500 Message-ID: <384468558.949389480769.JavaMail.root@web31.pub01> Date: Tue, 1 Feb 2000 02:18:00 -0500 (EST) From: Charles Irvin To: lro@playground.sun.com, mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com Subject: Range Rovers do cool spins! Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: mail.com X-Originating-IP: 24.218.249.12 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org ...now that I got everybody's attention... I have FINALLY made it to Boston, after 8 days, and many stops. Vegas was good, though I spent the first several days sick between there, and Green River UT. Turned out to be exhaust fumes! Made it to Dave G.'s place without any problems, though the altitude didn't like me much, and that stupid snowstorm that chased me across Colorado, Kansas, and up to Wisconsin. Also spent a day with Mark Freeman, and his amazing project, and tried to catch up with Keith in Des Moines, though tax time has him living at his desk! Wisconsin was fun - got toplay on skiis for the first time in 10 years...only fell on my ass once! :) Drove from there, to Cleveland yesterday, then from Cleveland to Boston today - I skipped Dayton due to my already running late. I'll be here in Boston for a few days, then it's off to Virginia, to pick ip the 109 and take it home. Whilst driving through New York, I spun the Rangie on an off-ramp, AND I DIDN'T HIT A THING!!!!! (more about that later) Ben: I'm not sure, but I think that my email got lost somewhere again...I had a few from today/yesterday, and all the rest are for 23/24Jan...176 in all, but nothing from 24Jan, until the most recent ones...could be Juno barfing, too. Also discovered that my ATM card doesn't work! (the bank is fixing that) I'll have to write more later...I'm exhausted! Charles From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Tue Feb 1 05:10:37 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id FAA09752 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Tue, 1 Feb 2000 05:10:37 -0500 Message-Id: <200002010957.BAA10619@wizard.sp.gap.com> Date: Tue, 1 Feb 2000 01:57:38 -0800 (PST) From: John Young Subject: Re: Tom's Toys To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-MD5: Zy4ZTLUNVg5D74mP6dWM6A== X-Mailer: dtmail 1.3.0 @(#)CDE Version 1.3.3 SunOS 5.7 sun4u sparc Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org TomW sez: > This 92" will beat the F350 if driven propely! Sounds like a '66-'68 Ford Bronco with a 289. Of course, I was hoping you were going for the shorty Pinzgauer (but that's even shorter than the Bronco). -John Young (wanting a Tatra T815 - good for crushing Hummers) 1999 Discovery Series II From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Tue Feb 1 06:39:55 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id GAA09846 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Tue, 1 Feb 2000 06:39:55 -0500 Message-Id: <200002011129.DAA12446@proxy2.ba.best.com> Comments: Authenticated sender is From: "Tom Walsh" To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com Date: Tue, 1 Feb 2000 03:28:23 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Re: Tom's Toys X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.31) Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org > TomW sez: > > This 92" will beat the F350 if driven propely! > > Sounds like a '66-'68 Ford Bronco with a 289. Of course, > I was hoping you were going for the shorty Pinzgauer (but > that's even shorter than the Bronco). > nop, wrong direction... Think 70 to 0 in 160 ft! TomW > -John Young (wanting a Tatra T815 - good for crushing Hummers) > 1999 Discovery Series II > > > *---------*---------* "Tonka" Truck, Lil Buggar, Lt Brigade, Posh,.. LandRovers "I love the smell of Null pointers in the morning" tomw@best.com, twalsh@redback.com From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Tue Feb 1 08:31:53 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id IAA10103 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Tue, 1 Feb 2000 08:31:53 -0500 Message-ID: <20000201132318.23697.qmail@web213.mail.yahoo.com> Date: Tue, 1 Feb 2000 05:23:18 -0800 (PST) From: joe mulqueen Subject: Series fabric covered door panels To: mendo MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Hello, Anyone ever make series door panels using fabric? Any likes or dislikes? Is this idea too enticing for dust or just too cushy for a series truck? Thanks for any opinions. JFMulqueen '67 SIIA 109 SW P.S. I'm starting with 1/8" plywood (to be sealed) __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Talk to your friends online with Yahoo! Messenger. http://im.yahoo.com From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Tue Feb 1 09:11:22 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id JAA10186 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Tue, 1 Feb 2000 09:11:22 -0500 Message-Id: <200002011349.FAA18704@blackie.cruzers.com> Subject: Re: BP Special--it may be too late Date: Tue, 1 Feb 00 05:53:21 -0800 x-sender: twakeman@mail.cruzers.com x-mailer: Claris Emailer 2.0, March 15, 1997 From: TeriAnn Wakeman To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org >>X5????? >> >>Que es? > >BMW X5. Bigger than a Freelander and smaller than a Disco...... looks >like a Freelander with an attitude. Ah I was scratching my head on that as wel. One of them 4WD minivan look alikes. TeriAnn Wakeman If you send me direct mail, please Santa Cruz, California start the subject line with TW - twakeman@cruzers.com I will be sure to read the message http://www.shadow-catcher.net <- Photography for sale http://www.overlander.net <- Web directory for Land Rover http://www.cruzers.com/~twakeman <- My personal web site "In the world of type A & type B drivers consider me a type C gypsy traveler. Destinations are optional and not necessarily desirable." From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Tue Feb 1 09:58:31 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id JAA10267 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Tue, 1 Feb 2000 09:58:31 -0500 Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.20000201064624.008f14b0@mail.saber.net> X-Sender: bobnsueb@mail.saber.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (32) Date: Tue, 01 Feb 2000 06:46:24 -0800 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com From: Bob & Sue Bernard Subject: Re: Series fabric covered door panels In-Reply-To: <20000201132318.23697.qmail@web213.mail.yahoo.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org At 05:23 AM 2/1/2000 -0800, you wrote: >Hello, >Anyone ever make series door panels using fabric? Any >likes or dislikes? Is this idea too enticing for dust >or just too cushy for a series truck? >Thanks for any opinions. >JFMulqueen >'67 SIIA 109 SW >P.S. I'm starting with 1/8" plywood (to be sealed) Hi Joe, I made Sherman's panels with 1/16 plywood that has vinyl covering on one side. The stuff was for panelling and is hard surface plywood, maybe mahogany? I painted the vinyl side black to go with the seats and plan to cover them later with the same as the seats. Later S2A same as S3 and I found a perfect match at the local upholstery shop called Wallaby-black. IMHO Cloth would be fine for the in town use but would get dirty,wet,moldy,etc maybe even grungy out here. Bob B From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Tue Feb 1 11:15:45 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id LAA10521 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Tue, 1 Feb 2000 11:15:45 -0500 Message-ID: <003601bf6ccd$d85f8f60$c534cbcc@johnbenh> From: "John R. Benham" To: References: Subject: Speaking of BMW... Date: Tue, 1 Feb 2000 08:03:12 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2919.6600 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2919.6600 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org I was watching European Journal on PBS last night. They had a bit on BMW and Rover. BMW needs $1x10-9, that's right, 1 billion $'s, to keep Rover going! English govt. is trying to pump $247 million into Rover but is coming under opposition from the EC. So at this point BMW is closing Rover's Long Bridge plant and re-evaluating the whole Rover thing... In a few years we really may have some `Classic' Range Rovers... Later, John B. Spokane From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Tue Feb 1 11:54:05 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id LAA10741 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Tue, 1 Feb 2000 11:54:05 -0500 Mime-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <20000201132318.23697.qmail@web213.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20000201132318.23697.qmail@web213.mail.yahoo.com> Date: Tue, 1 Feb 2000 08:06:40 -0800 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com From: john hess Subject: Re: Series fabric covered door panels Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org No. I've used the original vinyl. But you can do what you want. One thing I picked up from David Walker is the use of epoxy. If you go to West marine, you can buy the real deal, epoxy in the gallon container. Mix it up, slather it all over the panel and in a day, you have a completely water proof panel. (buy some waxed paper also. Epoxy sticks/bonds to everything but wax.) polyester batting from a fabric shop also works well under the skin of the door panel. cheers, >Hello, >Anyone ever make series door panels using fabric? Any >likes or dislikes? Is this idea too enticing for dust >or just too cushy for a series truck? >Thanks for any opinions. >JFMulqueen >'67 SIIA 109 SW >P.S. I'm starting with 1/8" plywood (to be sealed) >__________________________________________________ >Do You Yahoo!? >Talk to your friends online with Yahoo! Messenger. >http://im.yahoo.com John F. Hess, Davis California jfhess@dcn.davis.ca.us Land Rover Dormobile web pages: http://wheel.dcn.davis.ca.us/~jfhess/homepage.html 1968 Land Rover Dormobile "Elvis" 1960 Land Rover 88 PU "Stubby" 1966 Mercury Monterey "Tillie" From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Tue Feb 1 12:01:16 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id MAA10828 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Tue, 1 Feb 2000 12:01:16 -0500 Message-ID: <16D03631929FD311BC5D009027D0CBB24AAC@vegmail.ucdavis.edu> From: "Kerner, Rob" To: "'mendo_recce'" Subject: Fort Hunter Liggett trip Date: Tue, 1 Feb 2000 08:54:21 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org what are the dates for the next NCRC trip to hunter ligget. -Rob From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Tue Feb 1 12:17:43 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id MAA10918 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Tue, 1 Feb 2000 12:17:43 -0500 From: Gbrovers@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Tue, 1 Feb 2000 12:09:38 EST Subject: Re: 4.7 gear ratio for an 87 RR? To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL for Macintosh sub 147 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Kevin and the list Here are the answers to your questions along with a couple of additional comments. 1) Overall driveability - it depends on what kind of driving you do. If you never exceed 50 or 55 MPH or so 4.7 gears would improve driveability. The car would accelerate from starting starts much quicker and feel much more lively at lower speeds but if your driving includes higher speed driving 70 or 75 MPH than I would say they won't. The engine will be turning noticably faster with the expected increase in noise from the engine and the rest of the drivetrain. 2) At 65 MPH the increase in RPM would be about 800, at 75 I would imagine 850 RPM or so. I'm at home and can't check my chart to be exact. 3) Can't say for sure about top speed. I suspect that top speed would not be effected to a great degree (but things would sure sound busier!) because that limitation usually has more to do with wind resistance and engine power, neither of which are Rover strong points. 4) I would not recommend them. Differential gearing is one of my specialtys and my experience is that most folks are not particularly happy with 4.7s in later model Rovers. The exceptions are vehicles that are used off road for a large percentage of their usage and/or vehicles that are equipped with very large tires (35" tall or larger) that effectively raise your gearing so they offset to a degree the effect of the diff gears. Other disadvantages of 4.7 gears are that they are not nearly as strong as the stock gears due to the decrease in pinion gear size. If you really want this low of gearing and want some decent durability plan on installing them in a 4 pinion carrier or 4 pinion style diff carrier such as an ARB or a Detroit. Another suggestion would be to use 4.75 gears which have a different tooth count (8X38 vs 10X47) and are stronger but again put them into a 4 pinion carrier because most ring and pinion gear failures are usually caused by the stock 2 pinion carrier flexing or cracking and letting the contact point of the gears shift out toward the ends of the gear teeth. The best option, in my opinion, for gearing of late model Rovers is to split the difference between the factory ratios and use 4.1 gears. You get the benefits of lower gearing but don't have the disadvantages of ultra low gearing. The % difference between stock 3.54 gears and 4.7 gears is about a 25% reduction, which is huge by differential standards. 4.1 gears are about a 12.5% reduction. Gearing reductions in most applications usually feel larger than their actual percentage reductions because they put you higher up on a vehicles power curves, which at lower RPM's, definitely has an upward inclination. I manufacture 4.1 gears and have them in stock, if anyone wants pricing contact me offlist, any additional technical info or questions contact me onlist. Thanks Bill Great Basin Rovers www.greatbasinrovers.com From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Tue Feb 1 13:35:10 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id NAA11199 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Tue, 1 Feb 2000 13:35:10 -0500 Message-ID: <3897277C.D2C5DA0C@ski.org> Date: Tue, 01 Feb 2000 10:35:40 -0800 From: John Brabyn X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com Subject: Re: Dunlop R/Ts, Hollister hills & NTSB Study References: <06DEF5772893D311AAF40000F804F44C3F75A7@rcexs.cobe.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org "Gomes, David" wrote: > Thanks for your note on the Cooper CTDs. I'm about to fit OME mediums and > bilstein shocks to the Disco and was in a real quandry over tires. I wasn't > aware of the Coopers. They look to be closer to the Trac Edge design than > the Dunlop RR R/T is. What types of terrain are you using the Coopers on? > What is your opinion of their performance? Yes they are closer to the Trac Edge design but I think a bit more aggressive and a bit narrower in the tread for a given size. The Coopers have more aggressive lugs but less siping compared with the RTs and Trac Edges. Re types of terrain, I am mostly a desert dude but do visit all types from rocks to sand to snow to mud, with a lot of pavement in between -- usually about 2,000 miles off pavement per year. In subjective opinion land again, I think the RTs might be a bit better for snow, sand and pavement, and the Coopers might be better in mud. As I mentioned I have tried and liked a lot the RTs, but wanted to try the Coopers as an experiment. Also my theory is that mud is the most likely and unpleasant thing to get stuck in, whereas with sand you can just air down and float over it if necessary. Experience so far -- I have only had them for a very short while and only done one off-road trip with them so my experience is limited. They did fine at the recent trail clearing event in the Mendo national forest, even providing the motive force to help another vehicle up a slippery slope. On the pavement they feel fine and are quiet -- a tad noisier than RTs and a tad quieter than Big O XTs. Re sizes -- if the 750-16 will fit it would certainly give great clearance. If I were using that size I think I'd go with the Dunlop RT as their specs show less of a gearing change than other brands (revs/mile). I would expect some noticeable high speed handling penalty (oversteer in sudden manoevers) with a tire that tall and narrow. I noticed this with 215/85R16s on my Classic, although renewing all the suspension bushings helped a lot. The 245/75 is more of a compromise size that is not too radical but should give close to an inch more clearance than stock. Cheers John From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Tue Feb 1 13:37:17 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id NAA11223 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Tue, 1 Feb 2000 13:37:17 -0500 Message-ID: <389725D3.F5AE9644@thelen.org> Date: Tue, 01 Feb 2000 10:28:35 -0800 From: "Christopher H. Dow" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.61 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.2.12-20 i686) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com Subject: Re: Fort Hunter Liggett trip References: <16D03631929FD311BC5D009027D0CBB24AAC@vegmail.ucdavis.edu> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Woops. That's the weekend of March 4th & 5th. C "Kerner, Rob" wrote: > > what are the dates for the next NCRC trip to hunter ligget. > > -Rob From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Tue Feb 1 13:37:26 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id NAA11228 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Tue, 1 Feb 2000 13:37:26 -0500 Message-ID: <389725B6.CFF8CCE4@thelen.org> Date: Tue, 01 Feb 2000 10:28:06 -0800 From: "Christopher H. Dow" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.61 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.2.12-20 i686) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com Subject: Re: Fort Hunter Liggett trip References: <16D03631929FD311BC5D009027D0CBB24AAC@vegmail.ucdavis.edu> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org The weekend of March 3rd & 4th. C "Kerner, Rob" wrote: > > what are the dates for the next NCRC trip to hunter ligget. > > -Rob From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Tue Feb 1 13:42:11 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id NAA11269 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Tue, 1 Feb 2000 13:42:11 -0500 Message-Id: <200002011835.KAA17733@proxy4.ba.best.com> Comments: Authenticated sender is From: "Tom Walsh" To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com Date: Tue, 1 Feb 2000 10:34:10 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Re: BP Special--it may be too late X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.31) Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org > >>X5????? > >> > >>Que es? > > > >BMW X5. Bigger than a Freelander and smaller than a Disco...... looks > >like a Freelander with an attitude. > > Ah I was scratching my head on that as wel. One of them 4WD minivan look > alikes. Why If I didn't know better, that was flamebait in disguise! Its not a minivan, nor does it look like one! Maybe the lexus rs300 starts to look like a minivan, but thats more of a station wagon also IMHO. So to be specific: What are one of those 4wd minivan lookalikes... I can't think of any ( well a few, but they are... Minivans ) Do ya think BMW makes a minivan? Think about it..... Don't minivans have sliding doors? Maybe we should research our statements, after all we have an auto related buisness to run eh, we wouldn't want to look silly :) TomW > http://www.overlander.net <- Web directory for Land Rover no disguised flames on here I bet! *---------*---------* "Tonka" Truck, Lil Buggar, Lt Brigade, Posh,.. LandRovers "I love the smell of Null pointers in the morning" tomw@best.com, twalsh@redback.com From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Tue Feb 1 13:44:13 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id NAA11281 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Tue, 1 Feb 2000 13:44:13 -0500 Message-ID: <20000201180834.21536.qmail@web705.mail.yahoo.com> Date: Tue, 1 Feb 2000 10:08:34 -0800 (PST) From: KC Subject: Re: Tom's Toys To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org > > TomW sez: > > > This 92" will beat the F350 if driven propely! > > > > Sounds like a '66-'68 Ford Bronco with a 289. Of course, > > I was hoping you were going for the shorty Pinzgauer (but > > that's even shorter than the Bronco). > > nop, wrong direction... > > Think 70 to 0 in 160 ft! I'll take a stab: an Audi Cabriolet Quattro? KC __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Talk to your friends online with Yahoo! Messenger. http://im.yahoo.com From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Tue Feb 1 13:51:28 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id NAA11316 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Tue, 1 Feb 2000 13:51:28 -0500 Date: Tue, 1 Feb 2000 11:35:29 -0700 (MST) From: James Howard To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com Subject: Re: BP Special--it may be too late In-Reply-To: <200002011835.KAA17733@proxy4.ba.best.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org On Tue, 1 Feb 2000, Tom Walsh wrote: > What are one of those 4wd minivan lookalikes... I can't think of any > ( well a few, but they are... Minivans ) The Mercedes thingy looks like a Mazda MPV minivan to me. From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Tue Feb 1 14:12:57 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id OAA11410 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Tue, 1 Feb 2000 14:12:57 -0500 Message-Id: <3.0.1.32.20000201091234.009b4e20@hgea01.hgea.org> X-Sender: ogilvi@hgea01.hgea.org X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (32) Date: Tue, 01 Feb 2000 09:12:34 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com From: Faye and Peter Ogilvie Subject: Re: BP Special--it may be too late In-Reply-To: <3.0.6.32.20000131100040.008dd5c0@mail.saber.net> References: <3.0.6.32.20000131090602.00818bb0@pacific.net> <001701bf6bae$4a9f5220$2f28c0d8@BlairPC> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org >Except that the ones with lights started in 70. The 69's had reflectors of >the same colors but flatter and no hole in the wing for the light and wire. > >Bob B My '70 88 also had the reflectors, not the lights. These may have been Series III specific lights. Aloha Peter Kona Coffee Rover From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Tue Feb 1 14:25:34 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id OAA11442 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Tue, 1 Feb 2000 14:25:34 -0500 Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.20000201111517.008fb740@mail.saber.net> X-Sender: bobnsueb@mail.saber.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (32) Date: Tue, 01 Feb 2000 11:15:17 -0800 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com From: Bob & Sue Bernard Subject: Re: BP Special--it may be too late In-Reply-To: <3.0.1.32.20000201091234.009b4e20@hgea01.hgea.org> References: <3.0.6.32.20000131100040.008dd5c0@mail.saber.net> <3.0.6.32.20000131090602.00818bb0@pacific.net> <001701bf6bae$4a9f5220$2f28c0d8@BlairPC> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org At 09:12 AM 2/1/2000, you wrote: >>Except that the ones with lights started in 70. The 69's had reflectors of >>the same colors but flatter and no hole in the wing for the light and wire. >> >>Bob B > >My '70 88 also had the reflectors, not the lights. These may have been >Series III specific lights. > >Aloha >Peter >Kona Coffee Rover Well I parted out a 70-88 that a Navy person brought back from Hawaii then rolled it and it had the lights there, so mid 70 may have been the starting point for the lights. I might still have one in the parts cabinet. Last one! Get it now for only $69.95. Bob B From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Tue Feb 1 14:30:04 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id OAA11452 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Tue, 1 Feb 2000 14:30:04 -0500 Message-Id: <200002011923.LAA04891@blackie.cruzers.com> Subject: Re: BP Special--it may be too late Date: Tue, 1 Feb 00 11:28:10 -0800 x-sender: twakeman@mail.cruzers.com x-mailer: Claris Emailer 2.0, March 15, 1997 From: TeriAnn Wakeman To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org >Why If I didn't know better, that was flamebait in disguise! No not really. I have not spent the time to memorize individual mini van & SUV silhouettes because there are so dang many of them these days. I had been having a problem telling many mini vans from many currentish SUVs until I decided to look at the rear side doors. The mini van rear side doors generally slide open or are double doors and SUV rear side doors are just regular rear side doors. Otherwise they look an awful lot alike to me. For the first few months I saw them I thought the Mercedes SUV was their entry into the mini van market. What can I say I don't pay a whole lot of attention to ether class of vehicle. TeriAnn http://www.overlander.net The world's most complete set of links connecting Rover 4X4 owners with Rover parts, service, accessory & sales companies world wide. From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Tue Feb 1 14:41:31 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id OAA11476 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Tue, 1 Feb 2000 14:41:31 -0500 Message-ID: <02be01bf6cea$12092700$214c1f18@hawaii.rr.com> From: "Peter Hope" To: References: <200002011923.LAA04891@blackie.cruzers.com> Subject: Re: BP Special--it may be too late Date: Tue, 1 Feb 2000 09:25:16 -1000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org > For the first few months I saw them I thought the Mercedes SUV was their > entry into the mini van market. Have to admit that I also thought the same thing. Pete From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Tue Feb 1 15:36:32 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id PAA11607 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Tue, 1 Feb 2000 15:36:32 -0500 From: "Brian Foster" To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com Subject: BMW 4x4s and Disco Jumper Seats Message-Id: <20000201201729.RGZB12271.mta01.onebox.com@onebox.com> Date: Tue, 1 Feb 2000 12:17:29 -0800 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org > [only 4x4 from BMW) It is the only one, its deceptive because > its more like a cross of a big station wagon and sport ute.... I finally had a chance to put a X5 through its paces -- on and off-road. You would be amazed at how capable it is even with street tires. It isn't big enough for a growing family, but in the Sport Ute wars this is the vehicle to have. My father-in-law is out comparing the Lexus and the MB. I talked him into going out and testing the X5. I hope he acquires one for my mother-in-law... it'll make a great hand-me-down in a few years. Everyone knows I enjoy BMWs, but I have to admit that I really, truly like the X5. I like the new M5 a little better, but I certainly wouldn't kick an X5 out of my garage. I would encourage die-hard LR owners to go test drive one and see what you think. FWIW, the X5 is not the only 4x4 from BMW. Also a direct result of the Land Rover Group relationship, BMW is coming out with a 4x4 version of the E46 3-series BMW. I believe they announced the 330iX formally this week. Europe will see it first, but the US will get the 230HP 6-cylinder version here shortly. BMW is also going to have the 6-cylinder version of the X5 out soon too. > ( go check out the Beamer web page) As a new BMW owner, a correction is in order! :-) Bimmers: BMW automobiles Beamers: BMW motorcycles Now... some real LR content. My wife is really starting to use the Disco to do some people hauling. Anybody have a set of the rear jumper seats in the garage collecting dust? We have a '95 with the cloth interior (the tan with rainbow accents fabric) and this would be our first choice. However, we aren't that picky. E-mail me off list at roundel@home.com Cheers, Brian Foster Irvine CA ___________________________________________________________________ To get your own FREE ZDNet onebox - FREE voicemail, email, and fax, all in one place - sign up today at http://www.zdnetonebox.com From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Tue Feb 1 15:50:50 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id PAA11702 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Tue, 1 Feb 2000 15:50:50 -0500 Date: Tue, 1 Feb 2000 13:21:59 -0700 (MST) From: James Howard To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com Subject: Re: BP Special--it may be too late In-Reply-To: <3.0.6.32.20000201122556.00819680@pacific.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org It is unlikely, knowing the British automotive industry, that there was a definite time they switched. If they ran out of the newer ones one day, they would go back and see if they had any of the old style on the shelf, and use them. On Tue, 1 Feb 2000, Granville Pool wrote: > Peter O. wrote: > > >My '70 88 also had the reflectors, not the lights. These may have been > >Series III specific lights. > > Hmmm, I had two '70 SIIAs and both had the exact units BP is selling, as > did both my Series IIIs. > > > Granny > From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Tue Feb 1 15:59:38 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id PAA11726 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Tue, 1 Feb 2000 15:59:38 -0500 Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.20000201122556.00819680@pacific.net> X-Sender: gpool@pacific.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (32) Date: Tue, 01 Feb 2000 12:25:56 -0800 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com From: Granville Pool Subject: Re: BP Special--it may be too late In-Reply-To: <3.0.1.32.20000201091234.009b4e20@hgea01.hgea.org> References: <3.0.6.32.20000131100040.008dd5c0@mail.saber.net> <3.0.6.32.20000131090602.00818bb0@pacific.net> <001701bf6bae$4a9f5220$2f28c0d8@BlairPC> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Peter O. wrote: >My '70 88 also had the reflectors, not the lights. These may have been >Series III specific lights. Hmmm, I had two '70 SIIAs and both had the exact units BP is selling, as did both my Series IIIs. Granny From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Tue Feb 1 16:14:31 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id QAA11784 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Tue, 1 Feb 2000 16:14:31 -0500 Message-Id: <200002012107.NAA02777@proxy4.ba.best.com> Comments: Authenticated sender is From: "Tom Walsh" To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com Date: Tue, 1 Feb 2000 13:06:02 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Re: BP Special--it may be too late X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.31) Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org > James Wrote: > > What are one of those 4wd minivan lookalikes... I can't think of any > > ( well a few, but they are... Minivans ) > > The Mercedes thingy looks like a Mazda MPV minivan to me. Yup the mazda IS a minivan ( sliding doors )... Your correct with the Mercedes.. it is shaped like a Minivan sorta... but, I'm not real sure what it is ( besides ugly :) ( YMMV ) > TerriAnn wrote: > I had been having a problem telling many mini vans from many > currentish SUVs until I decided to look at the rear side doors. The > mini van rear side doors generally slide open or are double doors > and SUV rear side doors are just regular rear side doors. Otherwise > they look an awful lot alike to me. > > For the first few months I saw them I thought the Mercedes SUV was > their entry into the mini van market. What can I say I don't pay a > whole lot of attention to ether class of vehicle. Incredibly... these things are the modern replacements for the 109 in a way! Except the 109 was built for a specific purpose before any "chic"ness factors came into play... there are some who use these new haulers the same as an original 109 would/should be used. As for looks: The X5 looks like a slightly shorter 5 sereies station wagon someone inflated a few extra PSI into making all the corners rounded and adding a few slight bulges to its lines from the pressure :) Brian mentioned the 6 banger version coming... I also read in 2001 a V12 "M" version will debut! I was however un aware of the all wheel drive 3 series coming to market.... Me I like to sit out on the back porch ( 911 cararra 4 cabriolet porch that is, it'll be a long wait once I order it ) PS: I'm "touchy" with that Minivan thing yech!!!!! No offense to you folks who drive em, there just not for me ( Sara feels the same way... her requirements are to fit her woodworking in the back ( her Saab fits more than the Disco!!! )..all wheel drive is a plus for the weather up here, and safety ( its VERY dangerous road ) And all the LR's I have that fufill that role are right hand drive which she doesn't like ( and there is the HILL, and them ( boulder ) creekers on your butt if ya drive slow ( not me, whish they'd get outa the way! ) ) Back to them reflector lights.... there still too much for a reflector and bulb! ( no knock @ BP... just my belief... course My rover use may be different from others? ) TomW > > > > *---------*---------* "Tonka" Truck, Lil Buggar, Lt Brigade, Posh,.. LandRovers "I love the smell of Null pointers in the morning" tomw@best.com, twalsh@redback.com From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Tue Feb 1 16:15:35 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id QAA11794 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Tue, 1 Feb 2000 16:15:35 -0500 Message-Id: <200002012107.NAA03379@proxy4.ba.best.com> Comments: Authenticated sender is From: "Tom Walsh" To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com Date: Tue, 1 Feb 2000 13:06:02 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Re: Tom's Toys X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.31) Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org > > > TomW sez: > > > > This 92" will beat the F350 if driven propely! > > > > > > Sounds like a '66-'68 Ford Bronco with a 289. Of course, > > > I was hoping you were going for the shorty Pinzgauer (but > > > that's even shorter than the Bronco). > > > > nop, wrong direction... > > > > Think 70 to 0 in 160 ft! > > I'll take a stab: an Audi Cabriolet Quattro? Close! correct country, correct vehicle configuration... different manufacturer... ( this makes it to easy now! ) TomW > KC *---------*---------* "Tonka" Truck, Lil Buggar, Lt Brigade, Posh,.. LandRovers "I love the smell of Null pointers in the morning" tomw@best.com, twalsh@redback.com From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Tue Feb 1 17:18:55 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id RAA12085 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Tue, 1 Feb 2000 17:18:55 -0500 Message-ID: <3897591B.DF8C026B@slip.net> Date: Tue, 01 Feb 2000 14:07:23 -0800 From: Jeremy Bartlett X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en]C-CCK-MCD NSCPCD47 (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com Subject: Re: Water Plugged Air Filter Re: Mud Run References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Jeff Rogers wrote: > Do you know how much water, if any, you take in? None I've every noticed but my drain is functioning. The air filter has been dry whenever I check it. Overall one can take in a large amount of water when you consider the volume of air used and the volume % of rain in the intake. Hence the drain. OTOH perhaps you've managed to steam clean a bit of carbon off :) Jeremy From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Tue Feb 1 17:29:05 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id RAA12108 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Tue, 1 Feb 2000 17:29:05 -0500 X-Server-Uuid: f57e99cc-be1e-11d3-8d46-0008c7d388a4 Message-ID: <839B335DA467D211AC1E00A0C922F854057146A3@S010.MOFO.COM> From: "Nieto, Armando S., Jr." To: "'mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com'" Subject: RE: Tom's Toys Date: Tue, 1 Feb 2000 14:24:27 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) X-WSS-ID: 148982A877458-01-01 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org How about Porsche Carrera S4 Cabriolet? -----Original Message----- From: Tom Walsh [mailto:tomw@best.com] Sent: February 01, 2000 1:06 PM To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com Subject: Re: Tom's Toys > > > TomW sez: > > > > This 92" will beat the F350 if driven propely! > > > > > > Sounds like a '66-'68 Ford Bronco with a 289. Of course, > > > I was hoping you were going for the shorty Pinzgauer (but > > > that's even shorter than the Bronco). > > > > nop, wrong direction... > > > > Think 70 to 0 in 160 ft! > > I'll take a stab: an Audi Cabriolet Quattro? Close! correct country, correct vehicle configuration... different manufacturer... ( this makes it to easy now! ) TomW > KC *---------*---------* "Tonka" Truck, Lil Buggar, Lt Brigade, Posh,.. LandRovers "I love the smell of Null pointers in the morning" tomw@best.com, twalsh@redback.com ============================================================================ This message contains information which may be confidential and privileged. Unless you are the addressee (or authorized to receive for the addressee), you may not use, copy or disclose to anyone the message or any information contained in the message. If you have received the message in error, please advise the sender by reply e-mail @mofo.com, and delete the message. Thank you very much. ============================================================================ From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Tue Feb 1 17:51:31 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id RAA12221 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Tue, 1 Feb 2000 17:51:31 -0500 Message-Id: <200002012241.OAA23453@proxy4.ba.best.com> Comments: Authenticated sender is From: "Tom Walsh" To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com Date: Tue, 1 Feb 2000 14:39:44 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: RE: Tom's Toys X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.31) Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org > How about Porsche Carrera S4 Cabriolet? bing! You get the prize! When I get it you can take her for a spin ( actually I thinks its a C4, but details ) I have to order it 1st and before I do that, I have get the X5 settled or Sara with think she's getting less of a present ( or so she says ) long time no see, Sorry I missed ya on the Mud run! TomW > > -----Original Message----- > From: Tom Walsh [mailto:tomw@best.com] > Sent: February 01, 2000 1:06 PM > To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com > Subject: Re: Tom's Toys > > > > > > > TomW sez: > > > > > This 92" will beat the F350 if driven propely! > > > > > > > > Sounds like a '66-'68 Ford Bronco with a 289. Of course, > > > > I was hoping you were going for the shorty Pinzgauer (but > > > > that's even shorter than the Bronco). > > > > > > nop, wrong direction... > > > > > > Think 70 to 0 in 160 ft! > > > > I'll take a stab: an Audi Cabriolet Quattro? > > Close! correct country, correct vehicle configuration... different > manufacturer... ( this makes it to easy now! ) > > TomW > > > KC > *---------*---------* > "Tonka" Truck, Lil Buggar, Lt Brigade, Posh,.. LandRovers > "I love the smell of Null pointers in the morning" > tomw@best.com, twalsh@redback.com > > ============================================================================ > > This message contains information which may be confidential and privileged. > Unless you are the addressee (or authorized to receive for the addressee), > you may not use, copy or disclose to anyone the message or any information > contained in the message. If you have received the message in error, please > advise the sender by reply e-mail @mofo.com, and delete the message. > Thank you very much. > > ============================================================================ > > > *---------*---------* "Tonka" Truck, Lil Buggar, Lt Brigade, Posh,.. LandRovers "I love the smell of Null pointers in the morning" tomw@best.com, twalsh@redback.com From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Tue Feb 1 18:02:52 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id SAA12302 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Tue, 1 Feb 2000 18:02:52 -0500 Message-Id: <4.1.20000201145519.00bd28b0@mail.halcyon.com> X-Sender: clarkebw@mail.halcyon.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.1 Date: Tue, 01 Feb 2000 14:56:09 -0800 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com From: Clarke Williams Subject: Re: BP Special--it may be too late In-Reply-To: <3.0.6.32.20000201122556.00819680@pacific.net> References: <3.0.1.32.20000201091234.009b4e20@hgea01.hgea.org> <3.0.6.32.20000131100040.008dd5c0@mail.saber.net> <3.0.6.32.20000131090602.00818bb0@pacific.net> <001701bf6bae$4a9f5220$2f28c0d8@BlairPC> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Granny, My 1969 has only the reflector. So did my Suffix "G" 1970. Clarke At 12:25 PM 01-02-00 -0800, you wrote: >Peter O. wrote: > >>My '70 88 also had the reflectors, not the lights. These may have been >>Series III specific lights. > >Hmmm, I had two '70 SIIAs and both had the exact units BP is selling, as >did both my Series IIIs. > > >Granny From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Tue Feb 1 21:41:27 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id VAA12885 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Tue, 1 Feb 2000 21:41:27 -0500 X-Sender: waycool@waycool.pobox.stanford.edu Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <200002011825.KAA17469@moab.off-road.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 1 Feb 2000 19:40:23 -0800 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com From: "Rich D. Lee, MD" Subject: Tom's, er SARA's Toy Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Gazing into my crystal ball, I see a few things happening here: Tom is already researching fitments of 16" wheels for 265/70-16" Super Swampers. Tom is fabricating a hitch & towbar for the 101 FC (rover content). Sara is on the phone to Dinan talking chips & superchargers (400hp, the last I checked). Warning! This type of vehicle can only lead to one thing....KIDS ! (My prediction is a new "Little Bugger" by no later than St. Pattie's day 2001) By the way, Tom wrote an eloquent, yet painfully true piece on work & life in Silicon Valley. At least you software types get equity for all your long hours. Rover On! Rich (working in the severe-recession health care industry) Lee, MD From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Tue Feb 1 21:46:12 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id VAA12905 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Tue, 1 Feb 2000 21:46:12 -0500 Message-Id: <200002020147.RAA18305@wizard.sp.gap.com> Date: Tue, 1 Feb 2000 17:47:51 -0800 (PST) From: John Young Subject: Re: Tom's Toys To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-MD5: WK47J70fOxLEhRMVzJ442w== X-Mailer: dtmail 1.3.0 @(#)CDE Version 1.3.3 SunOS 5.7 sun4u sparc Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org > > > > TomW sez: > > > > > This 92" will beat the F350 if driven propely! > > > > > > > > Sounds like a '66-'68 Ford Bronco with a 289. Of course, > > > > I was hoping you were going for the shorty Pinzgauer (but > > > > that's even shorter than the Bronco). > > > > > > nop, wrong direction... > > > > > > Think 70 to 0 in 160 ft! > > > > I'll take a stab: an Audi Cabriolet Quattro? > > Close! correct country, correct vehicle configuration... different > manufacturer... ( this makes it to easy now! ) Hmmm... now sounds more like a Porsche 911 Carrera 4 convertible. BUT, if that's the case4, isn't that actually a 92.6" wheelbase? Surely you wouldn't be THAT FAR OFF, would you? BTW, does anyone know of any pictures on the web of the 4wd Porsches that won the Dakar a few years ago? I'm dying to take a look... John Young Girlfriend has a '95 Porsche 993 Cabriolet From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Tue Feb 1 22:03:49 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id WAA12949 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Tue, 1 Feb 2000 22:03:49 -0500 Date: Tue, 1 Feb 2000 18:58:52 -0800 (PST) From: Alexander George Cooper Message-Id: <200002020258.SAA24172@saga21.Stanford.EDU> To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com Subject: Re: Tom's Toys Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org >BTW, does anyone know of any pictures on the web of the 4wd >Porsches that won the Dakar a few years ago? I'm dying to >take a look... It was actually quite a few years ago that the 959s were used in the Dakar. There's a page with a few pictures and some brief comments here: http://home.olemiss.edu/~waletail/9594.htm Alexander From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Tue Feb 1 23:18:33 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id XAA13034 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Tue, 1 Feb 2000 23:18:33 -0500 From: GElam30092@aol.com Message-ID: <98.130f0b5.25c90895@aol.com> Date: Tue, 1 Feb 2000 23:12:05 EST Subject: off-topic..... ham radio To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 45 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Back in Nov, I picked up a Radio Shack 10 M (28Mhz) radio that only cost about $150. It puts out a relatively small 25-watts. Finally got around to installing it in the SIII this weekend and replaced the CB-antenna with a hamstick which is really nothing more than an extended CB-antenna. This morning, on the way to work, I tuned up and down but didn't hear anything. That's to be expected since 10M is more of a daylight band. This evening, on the way home, I heard a ham in the Philippines working a pileup. A pileup occurs when someone from a relatively distant place is loud and clear into the US and everyone wants to make a contact. As I pulled into my street, I gave him a call and he acknowledged me. Gave me a good report too. Later, I had to take Robyn to an event. This was at 6:30ish when it's dark and there are few signals on 10M. As Robyn got in the SIII, I picked up a signal and Robyn goes, "Hey.... he's got a funny accent." I told her that he should.... he's probably in Australia. He was carrying on a conversation but I could barely hear the other guy. As we came down the street, his signal increased slightly so I threw out my call and he responded too with a VK2 callsign. VK is Australia. We exchanged callsigns and reports and then I thanked him. Wow.... new radio, 25 watts and the first two contacts are from the Philippines and Australia. They say when 10M is open, you can work the world on low power. I believe them now! If you ever thought about getting into ham radio, you can't do much better than a VHF/UHF for local outings and a 10M for daylight calls. Both are relatively inexpensive setups. Make a nice addition to Series and plushies! Cheers, Gerry PHX AZ From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Wed Feb 2 00:28:48 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id AAA13579 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Wed, 2 Feb 2000 00:28:48 -0500 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Sender: rlarson@mail.dsldesigns.com Message-Id: In-Reply-To: References: Date: Tue, 1 Feb 2000 21:24:18 -0800 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com From: Rick Larson Subject: Re: Mud Run Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org >Well, I'm disappointed that I missed the Mud Run *again*. I thought my truck >broke on Thursday, but it turned out to be user error (really)... > >The good news is that those of us with Mantec snorkels will no longer need >to pack water for winter events. This is because I discovered an >undocumented feature of the device that allows it to collect rain water >while you drive. I stumbled onto this functionality without knowing and >turned my air filter into a cork, but I'm almost sure that if the filter >were removed and a jug were mounted to the drain on the filter canister, >that five hours on the road would collect about a quart of water. :^) I seem to have discovered a similar feature. Although my D90 hasn't been driven in the rain in quite some time. I've got no idea how/when the water was collected. But I had about 1/2 of water and a very damp filter. It seems to be the cause of a stall I experienced. Dried everything out and it is running fine. I've had the mantec for years. Never experienced any problem until this year? Really wish I understood the problem. Anti LR types sneaking around LG and filling up snorkels maybe? -Rick -Rick Rick Larson rlarson@dsldesigns.com From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Wed Feb 2 01:33:27 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id BAA13739 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Wed, 2 Feb 2000 01:33:27 -0500 Message-ID: <20000202063015.29280.qmail@web209.mail.yahoo.com> Date: Tue, 1 Feb 2000 22:30:15 -0800 (PST) From: joe mulqueen Subject: ways to mount headlight relays for a Series truck To: mendo MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Hello and here they are: #1. Mount relays (hi&lo beam) and fuses on bulkhead. Take power from nearby starter solenoid. Run the light wires up to the bulbs. Result: Safe location but long wires #2. Try to mount the stuff somewhere on the inner RH fender next to the aircleaner. Take power directly from battery inches away. Result: Shorter wires but cramped mounting? #3. ? Any other good options? Thanks, JoeMulqueen PS. I'll be using 14 (or 12) gage wire. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Talk to your friends online with Yahoo! Messenger. http://im.yahoo.com From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Wed Feb 2 01:50:52 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id BAA13752 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Wed, 2 Feb 2000 01:50:52 -0500 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com Date: Tue, 1 Feb 2000 23:42:49 -0500 Subject: Re: Steering box delimma solved! Message-ID: <20000202.013142.-212663.0.cirvin1258@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 4.0.5 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 2-6 X-Juno-Att: 0 X-Juno-RefParts: 0 From: Charles R Irvin Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org I thought about rebuilding the old one again, but the worm ger has seen much better days...would probably cost as much to replace it alone, s it could to simply get another box already rebuilt. It is a thought, though. Charles ________________________________________________________________ YOU'RE PAYING TOO MUCH FOR THE INTERNET! Juno now offers FREE Internet Access! Try it today - there's no risk! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj. From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Wed Feb 2 02:11:27 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id CAA13793 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Wed, 2 Feb 2000 02:11:27 -0500 Message-Id: <200002020708.XAA06247@proxy2.ba.best.com> Comments: Authenticated sender is From: "Tom Walsh" To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com Date: Tue, 1 Feb 2000 23:06:47 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Re: Tom's Toys X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.31) Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org > > >BTW, does anyone know of any pictures on the web of the 4wd > >Porsches that won the Dakar a few years ago? I'm dying to > >take a look... > > It was actually quite a few years ago that the 959s were used in the Dakar. > There's a page with a few pictures and some brief comments here: > > http://home.olemiss.edu/~waletail/9594.htm > That would be very Fun ( with someone elses machine :) TomW > Alexander > > > *---------*---------* "Tonka" Truck, Lil Buggar, Lt Brigade, Posh,.. LandRovers "I love the smell of Null pointers in the morning" tomw@best.com, twalsh@redback.com From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Wed Feb 2 02:35:30 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id CAA13810 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Wed, 2 Feb 2000 02:35:30 -0500 Message-Id: <200002020732.XAA06501@proxy2.ba.best.com> Comments: Authenticated sender is From: "Tom Walsh" To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com Date: Tue, 1 Feb 2000 23:31:06 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Re: Mud Run X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.31) Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org > Dried everything out and it is running fine. I've had the mantec for > years. Never experienced any problem until this year? > > Really wish I understood the problem. Anti LR types sneaking around > LG and filling up snorkels maybe? > I think I'll go check my Snorkel(s)! TomW > -Rick > > -Rick > > Rick Larson > rlarson@dsldesigns.com > > *---------*---------* "Tonka" Truck, Lil Buggar, Lt Brigade, Posh,.. LandRovers "I love the smell of Null pointers in the morning" tomw@best.com, twalsh@redback.com From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Wed Feb 2 02:46:01 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id CAA13821 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Wed, 2 Feb 2000 02:46:01 -0500 Message-Id: <200002020732.XAA06494@proxy2.ba.best.com> Comments: Authenticated sender is From: "Tom Walsh" To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com Date: Tue, 1 Feb 2000 23:31:06 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Re: Fort Hunter Liggett trip X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.31) Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org > Woops. That's the weekend of March 4th & 5th. > > C > Thanks Chris! Thats correct! I gotta call em up to make sure its not Tank games weekend! Duoh, so much to do! TomW > "Kerner, Rob" wrote: > > > > what are the dates for the next NCRC trip to hunter ligget. > > > > -Rob > > *---------*---------* "Tonka" Truck, Lil Buggar, Lt Brigade, Posh,.. LandRovers "I love the smell of Null pointers in the morning" tomw@best.com, twalsh@redback.com From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Wed Feb 2 03:41:32 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id DAA13860 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Wed, 2 Feb 2000 03:41:32 -0500 Message-Id: <4.1.20000201235407.00bee8e0@mail.halcyon.com> X-Sender: clarkebw@mail.halcyon.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.1 Date: Wed, 02 Feb 2000 00:34:21 -0800 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com From: Clarke Williams Subject: Re: ways to mount headlight relays for a Series truck In-Reply-To: <20000202063015.29280.qmail@web209.mail.yahoo.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Joe, Are you wanting the relays so you can run high wattage H4s? I was just looking at this day before yesterday. The headlights plug into the harness just under the bonnet release -- both headlights plugging into a 4-way bullet connector that is plugged into main harness for the high and low beam circuits (effectively a 3-way connection for each beam). The OE wires are already about 14-12 gauge but are pretty short. Should be okay for up to "150 watt" bulbs (high beam). (I put the wattage in quotes because they are rated for the pair, not per bulb. This is confirmed by actual current measurement on several bulbs) Use a waterproof relay such as P&B VF4-65F11 relays. This is a "Form C" relay, i.e. double throw. Use one each for high and low beams. Get male & female bullets from BritPac (or other) for the small mini-harness you're going to make. Take the drive to the coil from the OE harness to turn the relay "ON" for each beam. Connect the bullets to the headlights to the "Form C" normally open terminal for each beam and draw power from a spare terminal on the bulkhead fuse block. You'll need one of the semi-special 3/8" female tabs to plug into the fuse block. I know BritPac has them for about $0.40 each. I would use a short length of adhesive lined heat shrink to waterproof the crimp-on 3/8" tab for the fuse block. If you use the fuse that feeds the interior roof lamp you will share a 30 amp fuse with only the interior light; nothing else is on this circuit. Use at least 12 gauge to feed the separate power to the relays -- I would strongly suggest using 10 gauge. Install a 16 gauge "fusible link" into the 10 gauge power lead instead of an inline fuse. The fusible link is much more reliable and less expensive, too. (I can send you a URL to show you how to make your own fusible link) Take grounds to the common ground screw under the bonnet latch (same place the headlights take their ground now). If you use adhesive lined heat shrink female tabs for the terminals on the relays you will have an "almost" totally waterproof harness. For this I would not bother with the relay socket -- more expense without additional functionality (the female tabs still plug in). Certainly at least as waterproof as the rest of the OE Series harness is. The relays are shrouded and the terminals will be protected from road spray and dirt. Use tinned wire for best corrosion resistance (Ancor wire from a good Marine supply is readily available and reasonably priced). Solder the bullets just like the factory did. You are finished and have a high-amperage relay circuit for your headlights. I personally would limit the bulbs to no more than maybe 130 watts (ought to be bright enough, eh?). Total cost even at retail single piece prices shouldn't be more than maybe $25. The relays will cost about $7.50 each (they are rated for 40 amps). The heat shrink crimp-on tabs maybe $0.50 each (at max). Contact me off-list if you want more details. Clarke P.S. One other thing to note. The original generator is a little low on amps to power 130 watt high beams for extended periods. Fit a larger battery for a little extra capacity and/or fit an alternator with more than 40 amp output ;-) Electrodyne makes 80,90, & 100 amp 6.5" SAE J180 frame brushless DC alternators (aka "dynamo" like the original Series generator) that has an internal regulator. I haven't had one in my hands yet but am looking closely. I like the idea of a true dynamo vs brush-type alternator. At 10:30 PM 01-02-00 -0800, you wrote: >Hello and here they are: > >#1. Mount relays (hi&lo beam) and fuses on bulkhead. >Take power from nearby starter solenoid. Run the >light wires up to the bulbs. >Result: Safe location but long wires > >#2. Try to mount the stuff somewhere on the inner RH >fender next to the aircleaner. Take power directly >from battery inches away. >Result: Shorter wires but cramped mounting? > >#3. ? > > > Any other good options? > > Thanks, > JoeMulqueen >PS. I'll be using 14 (or 12) gage wire. >__________________________________________________ >Do You Yahoo!? >Talk to your friends online with Yahoo! Messenger. >http://im.yahoo.com From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Wed Feb 2 05:17:21 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id FAA14064 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Wed, 2 Feb 2000 05:17:21 -0500 Message-ID: <03c201bf6d63$fef93cc0$214c1f18@hawaii.rr.com> From: "Peter Hope" To: References: <20000202063015.29280.qmail@web209.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: ways to mount headlight relays for a Series truck Date: Tue, 1 Feb 2000 23:58:02 -1000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org > #1. Mount relays (hi&lo beam) and fuses on bulkhead. > Take power from nearby starter solenoid. Run the > light wires up to the bulbs. > Result: Safe location but long wires > That is the way I am setting up mine. Seperate relay for the high and low. Power from the stock switch activates the relays. Using 10 gauge from the relay to the lights. Wires are not that long, actually shorter then stock and thicker. Pete From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Wed Feb 2 05:27:22 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id FAA14094 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Wed, 2 Feb 2000 05:27:22 -0500 Message-Id: <200002021018.CAA01647@proxy2.ba.best.com> Comments: Authenticated sender is From: "Tom Walsh" To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com Date: Wed, 2 Feb 2000 02:17:29 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Re: Tom's, er SARA's Toy X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.31) Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org > > Sara is on the phone to Dinan talking chips & superchargers (400hp, the > last I checked). > Theres an Idea... I can sneak one in, and go for secret rt 9 romps :) > Warning! This type of vehicle can only lead to one thing....KIDS ! > (My prediction is a new "Little Bugger" by no later than St. Pattie's day 2001) > Yikes! I'm to young ( I mean I'm just a kid! Help! ) The safer part is more cus of what she's seen on rt 9 w/ the fire dept stuff! Even though her Saab is built well, its still small and light. > By the way, Tom wrote an eloquent, yet painfully true piece on work & life > in Silicon Valley. At least you software types get equity for all your long > hours. After 15-20 years of this stuff, and this is the 6th (funded) startup I've been at ( had to count way back for that one, forgot a few :)... some times ya win, sometimes ya make a big crater! Still even now, theres no garauntee, I haven't ordered my toy yet, hers is getting ordered this week if we have time! > > Rover On! > > Rich (working in the severe-recession health care industry) Lee, MD You need to start a dot com! :) PS, everyone: type more, with bigger sigs in your E-mails.... clog up the internet, So we can sell more Redback boxes... I need a new porsche! (also did ya ever hear back from that Sgt??? ) TomW *---------*---------* "Tonka" Truck, Lil Buggar, Lt Brigade, Posh,.. LandRovers "I love the smell of Null pointers in the morning" tomw@best.com, twalsh@redback.com From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Wed Feb 2 09:34:29 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id JAA14520 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Wed, 2 Feb 2000 09:34:29 -0500 Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.20000202062108.008fa5d0@mail.saber.net> X-Sender: bobnsueb@mail.saber.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (32) Date: Wed, 02 Feb 2000 06:21:08 -0800 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com From: Bob & Sue Bernard Subject: Re: ways to mount headlight relays for a Series truck In-Reply-To: <20000202063015.29280.qmail@web209.mail.yahoo.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Joe, How about in front of the battery on the breakfast/grille? also short wires, also kinda cramped, but out of the way and also not an extra bother if you want to remove the fender/wing. Bob B At 10:30 PM 2/1/2000 -0800, you wrote: >Hello and here they are: > >#1. Mount relays (hi&lo beam) and fuses on bulkhead. >Take power from nearby starter solenoid. Run the >light wires up to the bulbs. >Result: Safe location but long wires > >#2. Try to mount the stuff somewhere on the inner RH >fender next to the aircleaner. Take power directly >from battery inches away. >Result: Shorter wires but cramped mounting? > >#3. ? > > > Any other good options? > > Thanks, > JoeMulqueen >PS. I'll be using 14 (or 12) gage wire. >__________________________________________________ >Do You Yahoo!? >Talk to your friends online with Yahoo! Messenger. >http://im.yahoo.com > From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Wed Feb 2 10:56:59 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id KAA14885 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Wed, 2 Feb 2000 10:56:59 -0500 Message-Id: <200002021549.HAA02398@blackie.cruzers.com> Subject: Re: ways to mount headlight relays for a Series truck Date: Wed, 2 Feb 00 07:53:46 -0800 x-sender: twakeman@mail.cruzers.com x-mailer: Claris Emailer 2.0, March 15, 1997 From: TeriAnn Wakeman To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org I prefer #2 between the battery and air cleaner. My relays sit high on the inner wing just below the top. They sit just higher than the wiring harness for easy tie in. This is open space and not cramped. But it does make more work to R&R the wing. I wired Nick's headlamp relay there. I have a winch & a second battery relay there on my car. It has worked out fine. I have driven cars with high wattage high beams and personally prefer the regular wattage high beams and auxillery lighting for places where there is not frequent oncoming traffic. With the high wattage beam you need to go to low beam when an oncoming car is very far away or risk real poor vision in the driver hurrling their car at yours. With the standard high beam you don't see as far but you can safely keep them high beam longer with less risk of an angry driver hitting their high beams a little before you pass. It just seems to me that there are more safe situational uses for regular wattage head lamps plus aux lighting than with a killer high beam and a low beam. >Hello and here they are: > >#1. Mount relays (hi&lo beam) and fuses on bulkhead. >Take power from nearby starter solenoid. Run the >light wires up to the bulbs. >Result: Safe location but long wires > >#2. Try to mount the stuff somewhere on the inner RH >fender next to the aircleaner. Take power directly >from battery inches away. >Result: Shorter wires but cramped mounting? > >#3. ? > > > Any other good options? > > Thanks, > JoeMulqueen >PS. I'll be using 14 (or 12) gage wire. >__________________________________________________ >Do You Yahoo!? >Talk to your friends online with Yahoo! Messenger. >http://im.yahoo.com > TeriAnn http://www.overlander.net The world's most complete set of links connecting Rover 4X4 owners with Rover parts, service, accessory & sales companies world wide. From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Wed Feb 2 11:37:17 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id LAA14934 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Wed, 2 Feb 2000 11:37:17 -0500 To: lro@playground.sun.com, mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com Cc: CA1769@aol.com, manfredi@engr.ucr.edu Date: Wed, 2 Feb 2000 11:15:05 -0500 Subject: If it's Wednesday, this must be Boston... Message-ID: <20000202.111506.-155799.0.cirvin1258@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 4.0.5 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 1-2,9-10,14-15,22-23,27-28,38-39,48-49,52-53,55-56,60-61,64-65,69-71 X-Juno-Att: 0 X-Juno-RefParts: 0 From: Charles R Irvin Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Still in Boston, and I FINALLY made it through the 1200 email messages that were waiting for me! Thanks a plenty to Dave and Cheryl G. for putting me up for a night, as well as to Mark Freeman for handing a spare Dualmatic to me, and to both for great food during my stays. I'll also thank my friends Bill and Karen Dredge (not on the lists, but what the hell) for putting me up/putting up with me while in Cedarburg. (BTW - anybody needing work done on a Brit car in the Milwaukee area - Bill is top notch - and my bribe of videotapes from Speedvision certainly helped!) As Mark said, I filled the Rangies' radiator with antifreeze while I was visiting him - that morning the upper hose was near solid as the system was 99.9% water, so I felt that since I was headed for much cooler terrain, that I should do it at that time. Upon leaving Sedalia, I headed to Milwaukee (actually Thiensville/Cedarburg) by way of Des Moines: plan was to kick tires with Keith in Des Moines, but tax time prevented his being available, and so I continued north. I almost didn't read my map soon enough (write down directions on a notepad like the rally teams do? Who needs that?), and damn near drove past my connection to La Crosse - I would have ended up in Minneapolis! Speaking of LaCrosse: I kinda, sorta, stumbled onto something really cool there - and I forgot to take pice in daylight - I found the Bluesmobile! It was parked on a street, loudspeaker still tied onto the roof, Illinois plates still attached! I know, slap me... Spent 3 days (?) in Milwaukee and worked on the Rangie (drained/re-bled the brakes, tightened a few belts, rotated tires - hey, I had a hydraulic lift all to myself...) then headed east. I skipped Dayton (and the Air Force Museum) due to both weather, and the fact that I'm already a week behind my original schedule, and instead, I drove through Sandusky (for those who saw "Tommy Boy"), and spent a night in Cleveland. Leaving Cleveland, I drove straight through to Boston on I think, Monday night. Vegged-out all day yesterday, and today I have errands to run: discovered that my ATM card DOES NOT WORK!!! Called the bank, and they're fixing it so that I can still do what I drove here for, and make it home. On the way through New York, I spun the Rangie on a rest area entrance! It was beautiful! I inadvertantly entered the ramp a tad over the speed limit and couldn't bear left to get into the car ramp - and was headed straight for the lightposts in between the two lanes! (snow/ice covered pavement all the way) I turned the wheel left, tapped the throttle, and the truck went straight where I wanted it - albeit a bit too much, did a 180, and rolled down the desired lane - BACKWARDS! I tapped the throttle a few times, and the truck stopped: nothing was bent, no other cars involved, and I sat there saying to myself "AWSOME!!!!"! Also due to time, I skipped Pittsburg (sorry Scott), and will be making one stop that I know of, in Memphis on the way home...may drop down to Houston and visit JSC, but that remains to be seen. Still a chance that I'll be driving all the way back on the I-40, but I'm not sure yet - still playing it by ear. As for those of you on the worldwide list - you should be shamed of yourselves: I go away for one week, and you people are at each others throats! People Uns*$&#!g left and right, I mean really...and I thought I was bad. Anyway, I am planning on being in Virginia no later than Friday, picking up the 109, and heading back to L.A. over the weekend...unless Sandy and friends have other plans. That's all for now - I'll have my Juno access the whole time I'm here in Boston, and speaking of which, I found that Juno works best when you use it independantly of all web browsers (instant connections versus trying over for hours!). Charles ________________________________________________________________ YOU'RE PAYING TOO MUCH FOR THE INTERNET! Juno now offers FREE Internet Access! Try it today - there's no risk! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj. From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Wed Feb 2 14:54:56 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id OAA15410 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Wed, 2 Feb 2000 14:54:56 -0500 Message-ID: <06DEF5772893D311AAF40000F804F44C3F75C7@rcexs.cobe.com> From: "Gomes, David" To: "'mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com'" Subject: RE: ways to mount headlight relays for a Series truck Date: Wed, 2 Feb 2000 12:53:24 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Hey Joe, Where you goin' with that soldering iron in your hand.... Sorry... I have a Painless wiring relay kit mounted on the RF wing between the battery and air cleaner. Had the kit salvaged from the D90. It was about $60 from Summit Racing for 2 sealed Bosch relays and a sealed 30 A fuse. I mounted all this to a plate fixed to the wing so one nut removes it for wing removal. The kit is meant to plug into one of your headlight sockets to get the signals for the relay primary circuits, provides new wires out to the headlights, and power and ground from the battery. My front light circuits were so fragged, I replaced them with the Painless wires and ran the signal (relay primary) wires to the harness coming from the dip switch. But as with most everything, my situation was pretty unique. Clarke's system sounded really good for a truck that has some semblance of stock wiring performing well. -Dave G. From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Wed Feb 2 15:19:01 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id PAA15450 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Wed, 2 Feb 2000 15:19:01 -0500 From: GElam30092@aol.com Message-ID: <45.bb8141.25c9ea1f@aol.com> Date: Wed, 2 Feb 2000 15:14:23 EST Subject: BPs gone yuppie...... To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 45 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org What's up with BP's special? Yesterday, it was a Range Rover hat. Today, it's an umbrella! We don't need no stinkin' umbrellas! Cheers, Gerry PHX AZ From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Wed Feb 2 16:40:43 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id QAA15809 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Wed, 2 Feb 2000 16:40:43 -0500 X-Sender: waycool@waycool.pobox.stanford.edu Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <200002021019.CAA09487@moab.off-road.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 2 Feb 2000 14:42:47 -0800 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com From: "Rich D. Lee, MD" Subject: Sara's X-5, Tom's "C-90", Medical Economics and "War Games" Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org >Date: Wed, 2 Feb 2000 02:17:29 -0800 >From: "Tom Walsh" >Subject: Re: Tom's, er SARA's Toy > >> >> Sara is on the phone to Dinan talking chips & superchargers (400hp, the >> last I checked). >> >Theres an Idea... I can sneak one in, and go for secret rt 9 romps :) It's a simple bolt-on (I don't know the cost though). She does NEED it to compensate for the altitude at your place (3% power loss/1000 ft). She also needs it for those "code-3" call-outs. Also, if it is for her (woodworking) business, you can write it off in 4 years under the accellerated depreciation schedule for its GVWR of 6005 lbs. As to late night rt. 9 romps, save it for the C-4. Just be sure you know how to steer with your right foot (I went through SCCA drivers' school in a Corvair) and watch for rapid rear tire wear. Watch the electrics as well. Some years of the C-4s are very problem-prone there. But then, once you know Prince Lucas, there is nothing Herr Bosch can do that you can't fix. I have a video called "The Rally Experience" much of the footage is filmed from inside the cockpit of a Rothmans Porsche 959 Rally car. You are welcome to borrow it.....Uh oh crystal ball now shows topless "C-90" Mendo pre-runner with 6" lift and afore-mentioned Super Swampers, 4-wheel power-sliding up th M-5 this April. > >After 15-20 years of this stuff, and this is the 6th (funded) >startup I've been at ( had to count way back for that one, forgot a >few :)... some times ya win, sometimes ya make a big crater! >Still even now, theres no garauntee, I haven't ordered my toy yet, >hers is getting ordered this week if we have time! Nor is there in medicine. My father and grandfather practiced at the same clinic for all of their (post-military) life. In the 9 years since I finished residency, the politics & economics of managed care and medical groups have led me to work in 6 different clinics, due to (mostly bad) executives' decisions to close or relocate practices. According to some very well-informed consultants, 70% of the medical groups in the bay area are facing bankruptcy and the remaining 30% are simply not saying anything (yet). One of the main reasons for this is that employers in this area now pay 20% to 40% less on health insurance than nearly anywhere else in the nation (not that insurance companies are hurting, they merely pass this "savings" on to those who actually care for you). If you think it's bad trying to get your Rover serviced at a dealer (minimal rover content), try getting an appointment with your doctor. > >You need to start a dot com! :) Actually, I am (possibly 2, in fact). Don't misunderstand me, I love doing and teaching medicine and helping my patients. I am busy at it and am very good at it. I will continue to do it, but I need to find a way that I can afford to and still live here. > >PS, everyone: type more, with bigger sigs in your E-mails.... clog up >the internet, So we can sell more Redback boxes... I need a new >porsche! > >(also did ya ever hear back from that Sgt??? ) You're referring to my off-list message about possibly arranging some kind of "hide and seek" games between "Us" (Rovers posing as either fleeing refugees or marauding 4x4 terrorists) and "Them" (members of the marine reserves in "company" vehicles). This MIGHT take place at Fort Hunter-Liggett on the March 4-5 trip and/or possibly later. Well, I have not spoken with him directly yet, but will be meeting with the reservist who is endorsing this idea tomorrow. I will let you know ASAP what gives. My aim in this is to help facilitate some extra fun on your outing and not complicate anything in the process. More on this soon, Rich (feeling better, with vented spleen) Lee From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Wed Feb 2 16:51:19 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id QAA15828 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Wed, 2 Feb 2000 16:51:19 -0500 From: GElam30092@aol.com Message-ID: <25.167ae86.25c9ffe1@aol.com> Date: Wed, 2 Feb 2000 16:47:13 EST Subject: Re: Sara's X-5, Tom's "C-90", Medical Economics and "War Games" To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 45 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org In a message dated 2/2/2000 2:38:47 PM US Mountain Standard Time, Rich.D.lee@Stanford.edu writes: << Also, if it is for her (woodworking) business, you can write it off in 4 years under the accellerated depreciation schedule for its GVWR of 6005 lbs. >> Yes..... a fact that escapes most people who think that others who choose the Range Rovers are purely doing it for prestige. It's a heck of a deduction if you can use it for business. According to one comparison that LR Scottsdale ran in an ad (and yes I did note the source!), if you take a $58,000 Range Rover versus a $58,000 sports car, the RR's first year deduction is better than $24,000 while the sports car is around $4,500. The total for the RR was around $36,000 versus less than $20k for the sports car. Cheers, Gerry PHX AZ The GVWR also allowed LR to escape other regulations too over the last few years. From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Wed Feb 2 16:51:43 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id QAA15846 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Wed, 2 Feb 2000 16:51:43 -0500 Message-Id: <200002022148.QAA08625@blacker.gdbg.org> To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com Subject: Re: Sara's X-5, Tom's "C-90", Medical Economics and "War Games" In-Reply-To: Your message of "Wed, 02 Feb 2000 14:42:47 PST." Date: Wed, 02 Feb 2000 13:48:25 -0800 From: Benjamin Allan Smith Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org In message you wrote: > You're referring to my off-list message about possibly arranging some kind > of "hide and seek" games between "Us" (Rovers posing as either fleeing > refugees or marauding 4x4 terrorists) and "Them" (members of the marine > reserves in "company" vehicles). This MIGHT take place at Fort > Hunter-Liggett on the March 4-5 trip and/or possibly later. Now that sounds like fun. I even have a 101 already painted in a (mostly) camoflage pattern. Ben From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Wed Feb 2 17:03:01 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id RAA15887 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Wed, 2 Feb 2000 17:03:01 -0500 Message-ID: <06DEF5772893D311AAF40000F804F44C3F75D0@rcexs.cobe.com> From: "Gomes, David" To: "'mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com'" Subject: RE: Medical Economics Date: Wed, 2 Feb 2000 15:02:03 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org ".....6 different clinics, due to (mostly bad) executives' decisions...." Ah, for the old days when Doc Baker would take a chicken (or rebuilt Solex!) in exchange for setting a bone.... :^) Thanks to the advice of you and others, Rich, I'm close to pulling the trigger on a set of Disco mods that should fit my needs nicely, and not break the bank. Only remaining decision is whether a rear drop kit is worth the trade offs for what I do....still some key opinions out on that one. -Dave G. From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Wed Feb 2 17:18:30 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id RAA15921 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Wed, 2 Feb 2000 17:18:30 -0500 Message-Id: <200002022209.OAA26831@proxy4.ba.best.com> Comments: Authenticated sender is From: "Tom Walsh" To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com Date: Wed, 2 Feb 2000 14:08:24 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Re: Sara's X-5, Tom's "C-90", Medical Economics and "War Ga X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.31) Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org > In a message dated 2/2/2000 2:38:47 PM US Mountain Standard Time, > Rich.D.lee@Stanford.edu writes: > > << Also, if it is for her (woodworking) > business, you can write it off in 4 years under the accellerated > depreciation schedule for its GVWR of 6005 lbs. >> > > Yes..... a fact that escapes most people who think that others who choose the > Range Rovers are purely doing it for prestige. It's a heck of a deduction if > you can use it for business. > > According to one comparison that LR Scottsdale ran in an ad (and yes I did > note the source!), if you take a $58,000 Range Rover versus a $58,000 sports > car, the RR's first year deduction is better than $24,000 while the sports > car is around $4,500. The total for the RR was around $36,000 versus less > than $20k for the sports car. > Having been a consultant ( previously, for a quite some time ) I have had legitimate buisnesses expenses to write off ( including mileage ) I have pointed out to our accountant the GVRW of the vehicles I drive.... He never wrote them off ( I'm not sure if he felt it was a flag for audit or he was a moron? ).... My software doesn't weigh that much that I need truck... but I "do" pay to much taxes... We are getting a new accountant this year also! Unfortunatley the woodworking can't be written off ( yet ) TomW > Cheers, > Gerry > PHX AZ > > The GVWR also allowed LR to escape other regulations too over the last few > years. > > > *---------*---------* "Tonka" Truck, Lil Buggar, Lt Brigade, Posh,.. LandRovers "I love the smell of Null pointers in the morning" tomw@best.com, twalsh@redback.com From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Wed Feb 2 18:07:06 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id SAA16003 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Wed, 2 Feb 2000 18:07:06 -0500 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <200002022148.QAA08625@blacker.gdbg.org> References: Your message of "Wed, 02 Feb 2000 14:42:47 PST." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 2 Feb 2000 14:59:37 -0800 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com From: Russ Wilson Subject: Re: Sara's X-5, Tom's "C-90", Medical Economics and "War Games" Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org >In message you wrote: > >> You're referring to my off-list message about possibly arranging some kind >> of "hide and seek" games between "Us" (Rovers posing as either fleeing >> refugees or marauding 4x4 terrorists) and "Them" (members of the marine >> reserves in "company" vehicles). This MIGHT take place at Fort >> Hunter-Liggett on the March 4-5 trip and/or possibly later. > > Now that sounds like fun. I even have a 101 already painted in a >(mostly) camoflage pattern. > >Ben As one who spent 3 lovely years in the 82d Airborne Div. driving around in a Hummer, you will all be chased down and whacked in about .30 seconds flat. Say what you will about the AM General produced monster, it's fast, it's got amazing ground clearance and most importantly of all...... the drivers don't own or maintain the things!! They don't care how much they beat up the trucks while chasing you around. Some marginally educated 19yr old reservist will gladly pound the living crap out of a hummer just because he can. Nice open space at H-L, just the kind of place where the Hummer excells. The only terrain where I'd rather be driving a rover in this little game would be in thick woods where the Hummer would be too wide to follow an 88" up some twisty little trail. Way too much open terrain at Ft.H-L. Good luck. Russ and Leslie Wilson "Expertise was best defined in terms not of what the expert already knew, but of how easily the expert could find things out." - Nathaniel Borenstein From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Wed Feb 2 19:08:06 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id TAA16057 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Wed, 2 Feb 2000 19:08:06 -0500 User-Agent: Microsoft Outlook Express Macintosh Edition - 5.01 (1630) Date: Wed, 02 Feb 2000 16:05:49 -0800 Subject: Re: Water Plugged Air Filter Re: Mud Run From: Jeff Rogers To: Mendo Recce List Message-ID: Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org >> Well, I'm disappointed that I missed the Mud Run *again*. I thought my truck >> broke on Thursday, but it turned out to be user error (really)... >> >> The good news is that those of us with Mantec snorkels will no longer need >> to pack water for winter events. This is because I discovered an >> undocumented feature of the device that allows it to collect rain water >> while you drive. I stumbled onto this functionality without knowing and >> turned my air filter into a cork, but I'm almost sure that if the filter >> were removed and a jug were mounted to the drain on the filter canister, >> that five hours on the road would collect about a quart of water. :^) > > I seem to have discovered a similar feature. Although my D90 hasn't been > driven in the rain in quite some time. I've got no idea how/when the > water was collected. But I had about 1/2 of water and a very damp > filter. It seems to be the cause of a stall I experienced. > > Dried everything out and it is running fine. I've had the mantec for > years. Never experienced any problem until this year? > > Really wish I understood the problem. Anti LR types sneaking around > LG and filling up snorkels maybe? > > - -Rick It could be a vandal, but I think it's more likely that snorkel wasn't engineered for high speed and high RPM's. My theory (at this moment anyway) is that at some rpm/speed the engine's air intake overcomes the pre-cleaner's ability to eject dust and water. ...and without a sump and/or "check valve" the stuff just collects in the filter canister (or in Ben's case, in the engine). I'm going to design two separate sumps - I'll let you know the specifics as I figure it out. -->Jeff From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Wed Feb 2 19:23:40 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id TAA16122 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Wed, 2 Feb 2000 19:23:40 -0500 Message-ID: <20000202231001.16451.qmail@web701.mail.yahoo.com> Date: Wed, 2 Feb 2000 15:10:01 -0800 (PST) From: KC Subject: Re: Tom's Toys To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org > > I'll take a stab: an Audi Cabriolet Quattro? > > Close! correct country, correct vehicle configuration... different > manufacturer... ( this makes it to easy now! ) OK, my next guess would have been a 911 S4 Cab. Do I get a ride too? You can ride in my Disco---yeah I know ya got one, but mine has heated leather seats. How's that for a trade? KC--envious of your upcoming new vehicles __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Talk to your friends online with Yahoo! Messenger. http://im.yahoo.com From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Wed Feb 2 20:42:28 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id UAA16271 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Wed, 2 Feb 2000 20:42:28 -0500 Message-ID: <001501bf6de6$610fe300$e877d4cc@wnio-spo-dalelp> From: "Dale W. Avery" To: Subject: Re: Dunlop R/Ts, Hollister hills & NTSB Study Date: Wed, 2 Feb 2000 17:31:21 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org John and all, I am running the 225/75R-16 CTD's and really like them, except they seem to been wearing pretty rapidly. This may be a problem with any tire on a RR classic, however. Dale -----Original Message----- From: John Brabyn To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com Date: Monday, January 31, 2000 2:40 PM Subject: Re: Dunlop R/Ts, Hollister hills & NTSB Study >Good reasoning Rich, and a good dose of reality for us tweakers. Personally I am >too lazy to carry out major mods requiring enlargement of wheel arches, gearing >changes, power boosts, axle strengthening etc etc -- unless something unlikely >happens that results in me having time and money on my hands! I think your >philosophy of staying close to stock unless one is willing to tackle the full >snowball effect is a good one. > >The 225/75 seems like an excellent choice for avoiding any other modifications -- >it should give about 0.4 inches more clearance than stock and, interestingly if >the specs are to be believed, the 225/75R16 Dunlop RT actually gives lower >gearing (725 revs/mile) than the stock Michelins (circa 705-715 revs/mile). These >figures vary by brand etc but Dunlops generally seem to give more revs/mile for a >given size than most other brands. > >On the 4.0 I am now using 245/75R16s (Cooper CTDs) which don't seem to be causing >any side effects or interference with the metalwork, but probably the 225/75 >would be fine too. I chose the Coopers partly as an experiment to satisfy my >curiosity (since I have already tried and liked the Dunlop RTs), and partly >because their tread pattern seems a bit more aggressive while still being quiet >on the street. > >Keep up the good work Rich > >Cheers > >John > >"Rich D. Lee, MD" wrote: > >> Hi Dave & KC, >> >> I'm always out there "lurking" on the list. In response to your messages: >> >> > >> >I'm curious, what size of Dunlop RR R/Ts are you running on your Disco? And >> >what suspension modifications do you have? Any body trimming? >> > >> >Thanks for your help, >> > >> >- -Dave G. >> >> Dave, >> I have gone the "wimpy" route and have 225/75-16 R/Ts (29.5" dia.) >> on the truck. I chose this size because I wanted to keep the diameter close >> the original tires (29.0" dia.) so I would have the same effective gearing, >> the same size as my spare (or my wife's spare) and can also use my same set >> of chains. I also wanted the tires to weigh as little as possible (a >> left-over fetish from my rally days), because I have to accelerate and >> brake them so often on my hilly commute. I was thinking about the >> 245/75-16s, but for the above reasons and the fact that I would have to cut >> away at my rear fenders (more an issue of time and explaining it to my >> wife, than fear of altering the truck), I chose to stick with the OEM size. >> Also, the 245/75-16s only provide 1/2" more clearance under the diffs and >> have 28.5 lbs more rotating weight, per set, which is equal to carrying 285 >> lbs more in the vehicle. The trade-offs were not worth it for me. >> The tire does not corner or brake as well on pavement as the OEM >> XPCs, but I am willing to compromise for the much-improved off-road >> traction. Even for the little off-road I find myself doing these days. >> If I were to "go large" on a Disco tire, It would have to be >> significantly larger for me to justify and afford what I feel larger tires >> should have (e.g. 4.10 gears, HD axles/hubs/C.V.s all-round, 2" lift and >> more power). Then I would go for 265/75-16, 235/85-16 or 255/85-16. >> The suspension on my 95 Disco is stock springs, with Airlift rear >> coil inserts, Bilsteins and swaybars still-attached. My next step is to >> complete the "cross-over" tube and valve between the Airlift bags so >> compressing one side will enhance the drop on the opposite wheel (off-road >> only). After that, I will do swaybar disconnects and a drop kit. I plan to >> finish the bash-plating underneath before I consider lifting the truck. > > From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Wed Feb 2 20:56:40 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id UAA16283 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Wed, 2 Feb 2000 20:56:40 -0500 Message-ID: <003801bf6de8$556e5e80$e877d4cc@wnio-spo-dalelp> From: "Dale W. Avery" To: Subject: Re: Dunlop R/Ts, Hollister hills & NTSB Study Date: Wed, 2 Feb 2000 17:45:20 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org David, Just to expand on your request a bit...I have used the CTD's in sand, gravel, snow, ice, and rocky (not boulder) conditions. I have the OME mediums and Bilsteins on my '90 RR. I have never experienced any rubbing or other problems with this tire. In fact, I like them a lot. I attended one of the Land Rover dealership's off-road training courses, and their lead instructor commented that he was very impressed with them. This statement came after i drove up a very steep sandbank without any problems. Most of my back country driving occurs on old mining and logging roads in the mountains of ID and MT. These tires have done very well. I would certainlhy buy another set. John will have to give you input about how they work in a desert environment. Good luck with your decision. Dale -----Original Message----- From: Gomes, David To: 'mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com' Date: Monday, January 31, 2000 6:13 PM Subject: RE: Dunlop R/Ts, Hollister hills & NTSB Study >John Brabyn, > >Thanks for your note on the Cooper CTDs. I'm about to fit OME mediums and >bilstein shocks to the Disco and was in a real quandry over tires. I wasn't >aware of the Coopers. They look to be closer to the Trac Edge design than >the Dunlop RR R/T is. What types of terrain are you using the Coopers on? >What is your opinion of their performance? > >I too want something close to factory size to avoid gearing trouble. But, >since the drive train is essentially (with exception of t-case ratio) >identical to the D90 one which turns 265-75R16 BFG ATs from the factory, I'm >not too worried about over stressing it with a slightly heavier than stock >(disco) tire. Since we're deep into opinion land, I'll say, IMHO the 235-85 >looks like too much rubber under a disco, to me. I'm beginning to think a >245-75 might be the way for me to go. I'm mainly on-road, but do some >central CO type trails, sharp rocks, but not much bouldering. I'd like to >be able to do a little early/late season stuff (SNOW). The stock Michelins >can't even handle the snow in my driveway @9k ft, much less trails :^). >So they must go soon. I was really focussed on the RR R/Ts (have 7.50-16s >on the 109) but that Cooper looks like a favorable tread pattern too. I'd >like to know what you think of them before I go into comparing rubber >compounds and such. > >Thanks for your help, > >-Dave G. > > From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Wed Feb 2 21:08:30 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id VAA16315 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Wed, 2 Feb 2000 21:08:30 -0500 Message-ID: <3898E1E9.2526F0D1@wenet.net> Date: Wed, 02 Feb 2000 18:03:21 -0800 From: "Bruce R. Bonar" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com Subject: Re: non-LR: Win2K launch in San Fran 2/15-17? References: <20000201051116.NPBP12271.mta01.onebox.com@onebox.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org The NCRC meeting is Friday the 18th between the SF airport and the City. Take a late flight and join us for the meeting and a beer, I can drop you off at the airport if you can get to the meeting in Brisbane. Bruce Brian Foster wrote: > Anyone planning to attend the Win2K show in San Fran Feb 15-17? I have > to go up to work the booth as the Server Product Marketing representative. > > I am planning on driving up 2/14 and back down 2/18. I am not sure how > much time I'll have to be social, but if we want to have an informal > mendo_recce gathering in the city one night to quaff a brew or two at > a micro brewery... I might be game! > > Cheers, > Brian Foster > Irvine CA > > ___________________________________________________________________ > To get your own FREE ZDNet onebox - FREE voicemail, email, and fax, > all in one place - sign up today at http://www.zdnetonebox.com From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Wed Feb 2 21:47:31 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id VAA16343 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Wed, 2 Feb 2000 21:47:31 -0500 Message-Id: <200002030242.SAA28836@proxy4.ba.best.com> Comments: Authenticated sender is From: "Tom Walsh" To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com Date: Wed, 2 Feb 2000 18:40:39 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Re: Sara's X-5, Tom's "C-90", Medical Economics and "War Ga X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.31) Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org > > As one who spent 3 lovely years in the 82d Airborne Div. driving around in > a Hummer, you will all be chased down and whacked in about .30 seconds > flat. Say what you will about the AM General produced monster, it's fast, > it's got amazing ground clearance and most importantly of all...... the > drivers don't own or maintain the things!! They don't care how much they > beat up the trucks while chasing you around. Some marginally educated 19yr > old reservist will gladly pound the living crap out of a hummer just > because he can. Nice open space at H-L, just the kind of place where the > Hummer excells. The only terrain where I'd rather be driving a rover in > this little game would be in thick woods where the Hummer would be too wide > to follow an 88" up some twisty little trail. Way too much open terrain at > Ft.H-L. Good luck. Hmmm, Incredibly... My sister has a brand spankin new diesel Hummer! Phone conversation: "Hi sis! Can I borrow the hummer to go to the Stanford Mall all weekend, I have a real big box I need to pick up! :)" Actually I plan on dragging her out on trips soon! Maybe this trip?? its got a 12k winch.. We may need it! TomW Funny though... My parents don't own any miltitary vehicles???? > > Russ and Leslie Wilson > > "Expertise was best defined in terms not of what the expert already knew, > but of how easily the expert could find things out." > - Nathaniel Borenstein > > > > *---------*---------* "Tonka" Truck, Lil Buggar, Lt Brigade, Posh,.. LandRovers "I love the smell of Null pointers in the morning" tomw@best.com, twalsh@redback.com From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Wed Feb 2 21:49:31 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id VAA16357 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Wed, 2 Feb 2000 21:49:31 -0500 Message-Id: <200002030242.SAA28210@proxy4.ba.best.com> Comments: Authenticated sender is From: "Tom Walsh" To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com Date: Wed, 2 Feb 2000 18:40:39 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Re: Tom's Toys X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.31) Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org > > > I'll take a stab: an Audi Cabriolet Quattro? > > > > Close! correct country, correct vehicle configuration... different > > manufacturer... ( this makes it to easy now! ) > > OK, my next guess would have been a 911 S4 Cab. Do I get a ride too? You can > ride in my Disco---yeah I know ya got one, but mine has heated leather > seats. How's that for a trade? Hey! Myne are heated! ( after I eat Beans :-) I gotta order it.. then it'll be a few months! Rides are free! ( just don't scream and tell me to slow down like my wife does ( in the series ??? :) ) TomW > KC--envious of your upcoming new vehicles > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Talk to your friends online with Yahoo! Messenger. > http://im.yahoo.com > > *---------*---------* "Tonka" Truck, Lil Buggar, Lt Brigade, Posh,.. LandRovers "I love the smell of Null pointers in the morning" tomw@best.com, twalsh@redback.com From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Wed Feb 2 23:21:12 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id XAA16461 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Wed, 2 Feb 2000 23:21:12 -0500 Message-ID: <20000203041131.24268.qmail@web208.mail.yahoo.com> Date: Wed, 2 Feb 2000 20:11:31 -0800 (PST) From: joe mulqueen Subject: Re:headlight relays & "megawatts" To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org To All, Many good points (especially TAW's). Thanks for the feedback! JFM __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Talk to your friends online with Yahoo! Messenger. http://im.yahoo.com From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Wed Feb 2 23:24:20 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id XAA16471 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Wed, 2 Feb 2000 23:24:20 -0500 Message-ID: <20000203041751.29113.rocketmail@web221.mail.yahoo.com> Date: Wed, 2 Feb 2000 20:17:51 -0800 (PST) From: joe mulqueen Subject: no rover but quality mg&healey pics To: mendo MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org If you're into it..... http://www.apphosting.com/mgstuff/ JoeM '56 MGA '60 3000 BT7 '67 SIIA 109 SW __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Talk to your friends online with Yahoo! Messenger. http://im.yahoo.com From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Wed Feb 2 23:31:47 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id XAA16485 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Wed, 2 Feb 2000 23:31:47 -0500 Date: Wed, 2 Feb 2000 21:15:06 -0700 (MST) From: James Howard To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com Subject: Re: BPs gone yuppie...... In-Reply-To: <45.bb8141.25c9ea1f@aol.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org On Wed, 2 Feb 2000 GElam30092@aol.com wrote: > What's up with BP's special? Yesterday, it was a Range Rover hat. Today, > it's an umbrella! > > We don't need no stinkin' umbrellas! Yes you do, Gerry. You need them to keep the Arizona sun off you when you are working on your Rover by the side of the road. From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Wed Feb 2 23:38:08 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id XAA16497 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Wed, 2 Feb 2000 23:38:08 -0500 Date: Wed, 2 Feb 2000 21:23:20 -0700 (MST) From: James Howard To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com Subject: Re: Sara's X-5, Tom's "C-90", Medical Economics and "War Ga In-Reply-To: <200002030242.SAA28836@proxy4.ba.best.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org > > As one who spent 3 lovely years in the 82d Airborne Div. driving around in > > a Hummer, you will all be chased down and whacked in about .30 seconds > > flat. Say what you will about the AM General produced monster, it's fast, Fast? The diesel powered one I test drove didn't seem fast. It seemed almost as slow as my Series III. It certainly was as loud as my SIII. Great car to let your kids go on dates with. Ain't no way they are going to get real close in one of those! From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Thu Feb 3 00:25:18 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id AAA17029 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Thu, 3 Feb 2000 00:25:18 -0500 Message-Id: <4.1.20000202202859.00d8b210@mail.halcyon.com> X-Sender: clarkebw@mail.halcyon.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.1 Date: Wed, 02 Feb 2000 20:38:54 -0800 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com From: Clarke Williams Subject: Re:headlight relays & "megawatts" In-Reply-To: <20000203041131.24268.qmail@web208.mail.yahoo.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org At 08:11 PM 02-02-00 -0800, you wrote: >To All, >Many good points (especially TAW's). >Thanks for the feedback! >JFM Joe, I hate to disagree with TAW but my Euro Hella H4s do NOT cause problems even with high wattage bulbs. Sharp cutoff of the beam and proper aiming make a big difference. If your lights are actually coming close to touching the other vehicle DIM THEM. I don't care what kind of weak high beams you think you have. Running "stock low-watt" headlights in no excuse for continuing to blind the oncoming driver. If you can't see with your low beams, you are driving too damn fast for conditions, IMHO. Or you have lousy sealed beam bulbs. I dim my lights BEFORE the other guy comes over the hill, not after I strike him in the face with them. I dim around turns. I dim whenever I think there is a possibility of causing problems for the other guy, especially so if the weather is bad and road is wet. But when driving across the Yukon and Alaska, GOOD driving lights together with GOOD high beams make a BIG difference. Coming across a herd of Caribou as you are driving along at 50 mph and round a corner can be disastrous. I want to SEE. When there is no traffic and curvy roads, dead-dark, etc good lights can make the difference between being able to drive at 35 mph and driving (safely) at 50-55 mph. My driving lights track my high beams. Dim the headlights and the driving lamps go OUT. My tuppence, Clarke Williams From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Thu Feb 3 00:43:56 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id AAA17154 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Thu, 3 Feb 2000 00:43:56 -0500 Mime-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <200002020147.RAA18305@wizard.sp.gap.com> References: <200002020147.RAA18305@wizard.sp.gap.com> Date: Wed, 2 Feb 2000 20:40:39 -0800 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com From: john hess Subject: Re: Tom's Toys Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org >Hmmm... now sounds more like a Porsche 911 Carrera 4 convertible. >BUT, if that's the case4, isn't that actually a 92.6" wheelbase? >Surely you wouldn't be THAT FAR OFF, would you? Well, now that the cat's out of the bag, I want to know if the C4 is as capable as the Taurus SHO off road. (remember the SHO and the duufus owner we found on the back roads of Mendo 3-4 years ago? He was taking a short cut, and spent the night in his car, unable to climb the slippery mud hills out.) Who remembers this besides me an Walt Swain? cheers, John F. Hess, Davis California jfhess@dcn.davis.ca.us Land Rover Dormobile web pages: http://wheel.dcn.davis.ca.us/~jfhess/homepage.html 1968 Land Rover Dormobile "Elvis" 1960 Land Rover 88 PU "Stubby" 1966 Mercury Monterey "Tillie" From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Thu Feb 3 03:22:52 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id DAA17226 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Thu, 3 Feb 2000 03:22:52 -0500 Message-Id: <200002030816.AAA05047@proxy2.ba.best.com> Comments: Authenticated sender is From: "Tom Walsh" To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com Date: Thu, 3 Feb 2000 00:14:52 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Re: Tom's Toys X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.31) Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org > > Well, > > now that the cat's out of the bag, I want to know if the C4 is as > capable as the Taurus SHO off road. (remember the SHO and the duufus > owner we found on the back roads of Mendo 3-4 years ago? He was > taking a short cut, and spent the night in his car, unable to climb > the slippery mud hills out.) > > Who remembers this besides me an Walt Swain? > > cheers, What were you two smokin that day? Actually I remember hearing of it, just didn't see it 1st hand! Trust you me, the all wheel drive in "this" C4 is to keep it "ON" the road, not off :) TomW *---------*---------* "Tonka" Truck, Lil Buggar, Lt Brigade, Posh,.. LandRovers "I love the smell of Null pointers in the morning" tomw@best.com, twalsh@redback.com From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Thu Feb 3 03:50:39 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id DAA17240 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Thu, 3 Feb 2000 03:50:39 -0500 Message-Id: <200002030828.AAA10900@proxy2.ba.best.com> Comments: Authenticated sender is From: "Tom Walsh" To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com Date: Thu, 3 Feb 2000 00:26:46 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Re: Sara's X-5, Tom's "C-90", Medical Economics and "War Ga X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.31) Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org > > > As one who spent 3 lovely years in the 82d Airborne Div. driving around in > > > a Hummer, you will all be chased down and whacked in about .30 seconds > > > flat. Say what you will about the AM General produced monster, it's fast, > > Fast? The diesel powered one I test drove didn't seem fast. It seemed > almost as slow as my Series III. It certainly was as loud as my SIII. The Civilian Models are faster than the military ones... ( Civys have a bigger diesel and a intercooled turbo ( turbo being the biggest factor! ) )... Regardless, once there up to speed the suspension will take a beating ( especially if it belongs to uncle SAM :) > > Great car to let your kids go on dates with. Ain't no way they are going > to get real close in one of those! Kids are creative, I wouldn't count on that one !! :) TomW > > > > *---------*---------* "Tonka" Truck, Lil Buggar, Lt Brigade, Posh,.. LandRovers "I love the smell of Null pointers in the morning" tomw@best.com, twalsh@redback.com From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Thu Feb 3 09:45:36 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id JAA17825 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Thu, 3 Feb 2000 09:45:36 -0500 Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.20000203063544.00905d90@mail.saber.net> X-Sender: bobnsueb@mail.saber.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (32) Date: Thu, 03 Feb 2000 06:35:44 -0800 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com From: Bob & Sue Bernard Subject: Re: Tom's Toys In-Reply-To: References: <200002020147.RAA18305@wizard.sp.gap.com> <200002020147.RAA18305@wizard.sp.gap.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org We remember the guy. Was his name Charley? Seems like he was high on something. He was given a ride down toward Clearlake later that night by one of our group, so I don't think he slept in his car. On our way home we saw a hitchhiker where hwy 20 leaves the east side of Clearlake that we thought looked like him. Someone said the SHO was a rental. Bob B At 08:40 PM 2/2/2000 -0800, you wrote: >Well, >now that the cat's out of the bag, I want to know if the C4 is as >capable as the Taurus SHO off road. (remember the SHO and the duufus >owner we found on the back roads of Mendo 3-4 years ago? He was >taking a short cut, and spent the night in his car, unable to climb >the slippery mud hills out.) > >Who remembers this besides me an Walt Swain? > >cheers, > > > >John F. Hess, Davis California jfhess@dcn.davis.ca.us >Land Rover Dormobile web pages: >http://wheel.dcn.davis.ca.us/~jfhess/homepage.html >1968 Land Rover Dormobile "Elvis" 1960 Land Rover 88 PU "Stubby" >1966 Mercury Monterey "Tillie" > From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Thu Feb 3 09:45:49 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id JAA17835 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Thu, 3 Feb 2000 09:45:49 -0500 Message-Id: <200002031440.GAA11514@blackie.cruzers.com> Subject: Re:headlight relays & "megawatts" Date: Thu, 3 Feb 00 06:44:15 -0800 x-sender: twakeman@mail.cruzers.com x-mailer: Claris Emailer 2.0, March 15, 1997 From: TeriAnn Wakeman To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org >At 08:11 PM 02-02-00 -0800, you wrote: >>To All, >>Many good points (especially TAW's). >>Thanks for the feedback! >>JFM > >Joe, > >I hate to disagree with TAW but my Euro Hella H4s do NOT cause problems >even with high wattage bulbs. Sharp cutoff of the beam and proper aiming >make a big difference. I'm not sure we are really disagreeing on most points. Just how light affects oncoming drivers and if there should be an in between light level. And yes Hella makes a very good light that is capable of using street legal lamp wattages and "off-road only" lamp wattages. > >If your lights are actually coming close to touching the other vehicle DIM >THEM. It isn't just touching the car. When I'm driving at night I have noticed that my eyes are drawn towards light sources. And even if they are not touching my car, high wattage lights are bright. I personally find them irritating. I find a lot of the driving lamps that never get dimmed very irritating from head on, and it does affect my vision of the road. Esp if the oncoming car has high wattage low beams as well. Even if they are not aimed in my eyes they are still bright light sources causing my irises to close down. I may be the only driver in the world who reacts this way but I do not think so. But I agree your headlamps should be dim well before coming close to touching the other vehicle. >If you can't see with your low beams, you are >driving too damn fast for conditions, IMHO. Or you have lousy sealed beam >bulbs. I agree completely with that statement. But for me I would add, Low beam for close proximity with oncoming cars, street legal halogen high beams for moderate speed driving & when oncoming cars are yet a long distance ahead. Then aux lighting for those time you are trying to break the sound barrier and there is no car in the forward looking scope. >I dim my lights BEFORE the other guy comes over the hill, not after I >strike him in the face with them. I dim around turns. I dim whenever I >think there is a possibility of causing problems for the other guy, >especially so if the weather is bad and road is wet. Which considering the traffic density means you would never touch your high beams in the San Francisco or Monterey bay areas or the mountains in between. I just think that if you live & mostly drive in a moderate to high traffic density area you need a moderate in between lighting step. > >But when driving across the Yukon and Alaska, GOOD driving lights together >with GOOD high beams make a BIG difference. Coming across a herd of >Caribou as you are driving along at 50 mph and round a corner can be >disastrous. I agree there too. When you are AWAY from any oncoming traffic the more light the better. Spread it long and spread it wide. Joe lives and works in the SF Bay area. This is a heavy traffic density area that has moderate traffic in the wee hours. What kind of lighting works best for you depends upon where you live and where you spend most of your night driving. That's why I prefer a staged response for different driving conditions and different traffic densities. > I want to SEE. When there is no traffic and curvy roads, >dead-dark, etc I agree completely. But where Joe & I live there is very little of the "no traffic" part. I generally don't worry about killer lights for driving out in the outback because I'm normally parked with the top popped before dark and settled in with a good glass of wine and a good book by full dark. I have aux lighting for the few times that I am not settled in by dark while on the trail. > good lights can make the difference between being able to >drive at 35 mph and driving (safely) at 50-55 mph. Good street legal halogens properly aimed throw a reasonable beam at 55 MPH. I'm assuming that someone somewhere did some research before setting the legal limits for lighting on California highways and came up with what they felt was a safe compromise. > >My driving lights track my high beams. Dim the headlights and the driving >lamps go OUT. Unfortunately this is not the case with most people's conversions. Their aux lighting is always on no matter what beam they are using. > >My tuppence, I agree with you almost completely for driving conditions where no oncoming traffic can be seen. All I'm saying is that when you live in moderate to high night traffic density areas it is nice to have more than two options and there should be one optimized for mountain driving with oncoming traffic a ways away yet. And that MY eyes react to killer high beams from a long way off and higher than stock low beams close by. I'm the person with the 5,600 pound fully loaded LR coming at your car head on. I would think that you would want to do anything you can to make sure I can see as well as possible and that I do not get irritated enough to show you my aux lighting just before we pass. I suspect I'm not the only driver out there whose eyes react to oncoming light and who get irritated when "low beams" are still bright enough for me not to see the road ahead. Then of course there is the standard Lucas solution "Dim - flicker - off" TeriAnn http://www.overlander.net The world's most complete set of links connecting Rover 4X4 owners with Rover parts, service, accessory & sales companies world wide. From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Thu Feb 3 10:51:30 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id KAA17972 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Thu, 3 Feb 2000 10:51:30 -0500 Message-Id: <4.1.20000203072828.00cc8a70@mail.halcyon.com> X-Sender: clarkebw@mail.halcyon.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.1 Date: Thu, 03 Feb 2000 07:45:15 -0800 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com From: Clarke Williams Subject: Re:headlight relays & "megawatts" In-Reply-To: <200002031440.GAA11514@blackie.cruzers.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org TeriAnn, I guess where we disagree the most is our choice of living in high population density vs low ;-) I bought 80/110 bulbs for the RR just before coming down from Alaska last winter. They were wonderful across the Yukon (where it is DARK). They also killed the RR headlight switch once we got down to warmer weather in B.C. I expected to need to remove the bulbs once in "town" so to speak, but have since discovered that the extremely sharp cutoff of the Euro Hellas (not DOT approved and much different from the DOT Hella H4s) keeps the low beams out of people's eye and actually comply with the Fed and local headlight regs regarding light on the road. I actually measured them. I think that driving lights should be able to be shut off QUICKLY. I confess to being a little surprised that someone would wire them separate from the high beam circuit. Seems an obvious solution to me. My big Hella 2000 driving lights put out a dangerous amount of light. I believe I would be lacking in reasonable judgement if I were to be unable to quickly turn them off. It seems we agree about aux lighting, too. The driving lights and high beams are wired to the horn, too. Sound the horn, turn both lamps on. Great for the fool trying to run a red light. Well said, TeriAnn. But I admit to preferring lower population density ;-) Clarke At 06:44 AM 03-02-00 -0800, you wrote: **snip** >I agree with you almost completely for driving conditions where no >oncoming traffic can be seen. All I'm saying is that when you live in >moderate to high night traffic density areas it is nice to have more than >two options and there should be one optimized for mountain driving with >oncoming traffic a ways away yet. > >And that MY eyes react to killer high beams from a long way off and >higher than stock low beams close by. I'm the person with the 5,600 >pound fully loaded LR coming at your car head on. I would think that you >would want to do anything you can to make sure I can see as well as >possible and that I do not get irritated enough to show you my aux >lighting just before we pass. I suspect I'm not the only driver out >there whose eyes react to oncoming light and who get irritated when "low >beams" are still bright enough for me not to see the road ahead. > >Then of course there is the standard Lucas solution "Dim - flicker - off" > > >TeriAnn > http://www.overlander.net > > The world's most complete set of links connecting Rover 4X4 owners > with Rover parts, service, accessory & sales companies world wide. From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Thu Feb 3 11:30:57 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id LAA18081 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Thu, 3 Feb 2000 11:30:57 -0500 From: sboarder@gte.net Message-ID: <001101bf6f2c$129bae60$b32b4720@we.theaustin.com> To: Subject: Lighting Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2000 08:22:42 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org For the record I have 90/130 bulbs in a Hella European lens. I have never had any problems with other drivers flashing their lights at me cause they thought my headlights were too bright, after they were properly adjusted. On low beam when I approach another car at a stoplight I can clearly see the cut off of my lights just below the rear window of the sedan in front of me. IMHO the real issue is the DOT standards for headlight lenses in the US. The standard in the US is to have a lens that shines light in every direction and limit the wattage. I much prefer a focused beam that allows much higher wattages, which is, IMHO, considerably safer for both driver and on coming traffic. I don't want to start a flame, but is VERY IMPORTANT that you compare apples to apples in regards to headlight lens design when comparing wattages. That car coming at you with DOT lenses running 55/60 watt bulbs on low beam looks considerably brighter than my European lenses running 90/130 watt bulbs on low beam due to the way the light is refracted. As far as driving lights, it has been many years since I installed driving lights on my VW Golf, but I distinctly remember having to install a relay that only allowed them to be on when the high beams were on. Has something changed with the law that allows them to be always on? Cheers, Nick 1972 SIII 'Grommit' From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Thu Feb 3 12:09:22 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id MAA18150 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Thu, 3 Feb 2000 12:09:22 -0500 Message-ID: <3899B77A.44BCBF70@ski.org> Date: Thu, 03 Feb 2000 09:14:34 -0800 From: John Brabyn X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com Subject: Re: Dunlop R/Ts, Hollister hills & NTSB Study References: <001501bf6de6$610fe300$e877d4cc@wnio-spo-dalelp> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Good to hear about your experience with the CTD Dale. I will let you know how mine do in the desert ASAP! Re the wear, I like tires that wear fast anyway, as it indicates a nice soft compound that probably grips better. I am suspicious of tires formulated for longest wear as the top priority. It tells me the designers very likely compromised somewhere else. Cheers John "Dale W. Avery" wrote: > John and all, > > I am running the 225/75R-16 CTD's and really like them, except they seem to > been wearing pretty rapidly. This may be a problem with any tire on a RR > classic, however. > > Dale > -----Original Message----- > From: John Brabyn > To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com > Date: Monday, January 31, 2000 2:40 PM > Subject: Re: Dunlop R/Ts, Hollister hills & NTSB Study > > >Good reasoning Rich, and a good dose of reality for us tweakers. Personally > I am > >too lazy to carry out major mods requiring enlargement of wheel arches, > gearing > >changes, power boosts, axle strengthening etc etc -- unless something > unlikely > >happens that results in me having time and money on my hands! I think your > >philosophy of staying close to stock unless one is willing to tackle the > full > >snowball effect is a good one. > > > >The 225/75 seems like an excellent choice for avoiding any other > modifications -- > >it should give about 0.4 inches more clearance than stock and, > interestingly if > >the specs are to be believed, the 225/75R16 Dunlop RT actually gives lower > >gearing (725 revs/mile) than the stock Michelins (circa 705-715 revs/mile). > These > >figures vary by brand etc but Dunlops generally seem to give more revs/mile > for a > >given size than most other brands. > > > >On the 4.0 I am now using 245/75R16s (Cooper CTDs) which don't seem to be > causing > >any side effects or interference with the metalwork, but probably the > 225/75 > >would be fine too. I chose the Coopers partly as an experiment to satisfy > my > >curiosity (since I have already tried and liked the Dunlop RTs), and partly > >because their tread pattern seems a bit more aggressive while still being > quiet > >on the street. > > > >Keep up the good work Rich > > > >Cheers > > > >John > > > >"Rich D. Lee, MD" wrote: > > > >> Hi Dave & KC, > >> > >> I'm always out there "lurking" on the list. In response to your messages: > >> > >> > > >> >I'm curious, what size of Dunlop RR R/Ts are you running on your Disco? > And > >> >what suspension modifications do you have? Any body trimming? > >> > > >> >Thanks for your help, > >> > > >> >- -Dave G. > >> > >> Dave, > >> I have gone the "wimpy" route and have 225/75-16 R/Ts (29.5" > dia.) > >> on the truck. I chose this size because I wanted to keep the diameter > close > >> the original tires (29.0" dia.) so I would have the same effective > gearing, > >> the same size as my spare (or my wife's spare) and can also use my same > set > >> of chains. I also wanted the tires to weigh as little as possible (a > >> left-over fetish from my rally days), because I have to accelerate and > >> brake them so often on my hilly commute. I was thinking about the > >> 245/75-16s, but for the above reasons and the fact that I would have to > cut > >> away at my rear fenders (more an issue of time and explaining it to my > >> wife, than fear of altering the truck), I chose to stick with the OEM > size. > >> Also, the 245/75-16s only provide 1/2" more clearance under the diffs and > >> have 28.5 lbs more rotating weight, per set, which is equal to carrying > 285 > >> lbs more in the vehicle. The trade-offs were not worth it for me. > >> The tire does not corner or brake as well on pavement as the OEM > >> XPCs, but I am willing to compromise for the much-improved off-road > >> traction. Even for the little off-road I find myself doing these days. > >> If I were to "go large" on a Disco tire, It would have to be > >> significantly larger for me to justify and afford what I feel larger > tires > >> should have (e.g. 4.10 gears, HD axles/hubs/C.V.s all-round, 2" lift and > >> more power). Then I would go for 265/75-16, 235/85-16 or 255/85-16. > >> The suspension on my 95 Disco is stock springs, with Airlift rear > >> coil inserts, Bilsteins and swaybars still-attached. My next step is to > >> complete the "cross-over" tube and valve between the Airlift bags so > >> compressing one side will enhance the drop on the opposite wheel > (off-road > >> only). After that, I will do swaybar disconnects and a drop kit. I plan > to > >> finish the bash-plating underneath before I consider lifting the truck. > > > > From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Thu Feb 3 13:01:55 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id NAA18226 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Thu, 3 Feb 2000 13:01:55 -0500 Message-ID: <06DEF5772893D311AAF40000F804F44C3F75DE@rcexs.cobe.com> From: "Gomes, David" To: "'mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com'" Subject: RE: Lighting Date: Thu, 3 Feb 2000 10:58:57 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org All my aux lights have been on 3-way switches off/on/beam-synched (low for fogs,hi for driving). Have your cake and eat it too, convenience, and choice. The extra few bucks for the switch and few minutes for wiring pay off for the life of the vehicle, IMHO. Aim is most important too. -Dave G. From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Thu Feb 3 14:15:21 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id OAA18373 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Thu, 3 Feb 2000 14:15:21 -0500 Message-ID: <3899D307.82D607A9@idt.net> Date: Thu, 03 Feb 2000 11:12:07 -0800 From: Dheva Raja X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; U; Linux 2.2.5-22 i586) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: mendo_recce-digest@moab.off-road.com Subject: Maggiolina car top tents Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org For those who are interested in car top tents, or for those who like to spend large amounts of money on things we really don't need (most of us), I first saw these tents at the Billing show in England (July '98.) They were, IMO, the most nicely constructed car top tents I had seen. Unfortunately, without a full roof rack on my ragtop d90 it was impossible to cart one around while driving around Europe. There were no US importers at the time, and the cost of shipping was prohibitive. Now, I finally found someone in the US that has recently imported these tents. His name is Rich Haslacher and site is: http://www.LoftyShelters.com/ I spoke with him at length a while ago and is quite willing to answer any questions. He recently sent me a card detailing the shows in the area where he displays the tents. This weekend he'll be at the San Mateo Expo Center (Sportsmen's show) http://www.sanmateoexpo.org/index.html Of course to support the tent, one needs a full rack or some sort of structure that is capable of bearing the weight. For this purpose, I and a friend recently built a rack for my d90. Not exactly an inexpensive proposition, but I feel it's worth the effort. I'm going to go on Sunday (11:00-12:00.) If anyone is interested, drop a line, we could meet for lunch and talk Rovers. Later, Dheva Raja 95 90 Tdi From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Thu Feb 3 15:25:52 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id PAA18450 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Thu, 3 Feb 2000 15:25:52 -0500 Mime-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <3899D307.82D607A9@idt.net> References: <3899D307.82D607A9@idt.net> Date: Thu, 3 Feb 2000 12:20:49 -0800 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com From: jory bell Subject: Re: Maggiolina car top tents Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org do you happen to know the price? ::jory >For those who are interested in car top tents, or for those who like to >spend large amounts of money on things we really don't need (most of >us), I first saw these tents at the Billing show in England (July >'98.) They were, IMO, the most nicely constructed car top tents I had >seen. Unfortunately, without a full roof rack on my ragtop d90 it was >impossible to cart one around while driving around Europe. There were >no US importers at the time, and the cost of shipping was prohibitive. >Now, I finally found someone in the US that has recently imported these >tents. > >His name is Rich Haslacher and site is: http://www.LoftyShelters.com/ > >I spoke with him at length a while ago and is quite willing to answer >any questions. He recently sent me a card detailing the shows in the >area where he displays the tents. This weekend he'll be at the San >Mateo Expo Center (Sportsmen's show) >http://www.sanmateoexpo.org/index.html > >Of course to support the tent, one needs a full rack or some sort of >structure that is capable of bearing the weight. For this purpose, I >and a friend recently built a rack for my d90. Not exactly an >inexpensive proposition, but I feel it's worth the effort. > >I'm going to go on Sunday (11:00-12:00.) If anyone is interested, drop >a line, we could meet for lunch and talk Rovers. Later, > >Dheva Raja >95 90 Tdi From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Thu Feb 3 15:25:52 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id PAA18451 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Thu, 3 Feb 2000 15:25:52 -0500 Mime-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <3899D307.82D607A9@idt.net> References: <3899D307.82D607A9@idt.net> Date: Thu, 3 Feb 2000 12:20:49 -0800 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com From: jory bell Subject: Re: Maggiolina car top tents Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org do you happen to know the price? ::jory >For those who are interested in car top tents, or for those who like to >spend large amounts of money on things we really don't need (most of >us), I first saw these tents at the Billing show in England (July >'98.) They were, IMO, the most nicely constructed car top tents I had >seen. Unfortunately, without a full roof rack on my ragtop d90 it was >impossible to cart one around while driving around Europe. There were >no US importers at the time, and the cost of shipping was prohibitive. >Now, I finally found someone in the US that has recently imported these >tents. > >His name is Rich Haslacher and site is: http://www.LoftyShelters.com/ > >I spoke with him at length a while ago and is quite willing to answer >any questions. He recently sent me a card detailing the shows in the >area where he displays the tents. This weekend he'll be at the San >Mateo Expo Center (Sportsmen's show) >http://www.sanmateoexpo.org/index.html > >Of course to support the tent, one needs a full rack or some sort of >structure that is capable of bearing the weight. For this purpose, I >and a friend recently built a rack for my d90. Not exactly an >inexpensive proposition, but I feel it's worth the effort. > >I'm going to go on Sunday (11:00-12:00.) If anyone is interested, drop >a line, we could meet for lunch and talk Rovers. Later, > >Dheva Raja >95 90 Tdi From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Thu Feb 3 19:08:01 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id TAA18618 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Thu, 3 Feb 2000 19:08:01 -0500 Message-ID: <000501bf6ea4$122d16e0$7500000a@kpk01> From: "Kevin Kelly" To: "Mendo List" Subject: Brian in SF Date: Thu, 3 Feb 2000 16:08:59 -0800 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2120.0 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2120.0 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Brian Foster wrote: :Anyone planning to attend the Win2K show in San Fran Feb :15-17 I am planning on driving up 2/14 and back down 2/18. : I am not sure how much time I'll have to be social, but if we :want to have an informal mendo recce gathering in the city :one night to quaff a brew or two at a micro brewery... I might be :game Then Bruce wrote: :The NCRC meeting is Friday the 18th between the SF airport and :the City. Take a late flight and join us for the meeting and a beer, :I can drop you off at the airport if you can get to the meeting in Brisbane. As I re-read Brian's post it looks like he is DRIVING up from S. Cal. I would love to try and meet up in the city even if the NCRC meeting time does not work out, or you can't stay late on Friday for the NCRC meeting and are flying back (rather than driving) I can give you a ride to the airport before the NCRC meeting. Kevin Kelly From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Thu Feb 3 19:37:50 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id TAA18641 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Thu, 3 Feb 2000 19:37:50 -0500 From: "Granville Pool" To: Subject: Rover SDI for sale in Chronicle Date: Thu, 3 Feb 2000 16:36:05 -0800 Message-ID: <000001bf6ea7$d4413420$3972a8c0@gbp.DPW.co.mendocino.ca.us> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2173.0 Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Sounds reasonable: ROVER '70 3500S Alu V8, BRG/blk runs/drives good, nds TLC & reg. $2000 (707)542-7722 I'm not sure but think that's a Santa Rosa number. There's also one in Ukiah (a yellow one) that was for sale a while back. I was wondering if it'd sold and saw it driving around town a couple of days ago. Very handsome cars, IMO. Cheers, Granny From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Thu Feb 3 19:52:52 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id TAA18665 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Thu, 3 Feb 2000 19:52:52 -0500 X-Sender: waycool@waycool.pobox.stanford.edu Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <200002030417.UAA01644@moab.off-road.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 3 Feb 2000 17:51:42 -0800 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com From: "Rich D. Lee, MD" Subject: Re: Mendo_Recce digest: V2 #901 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org HI ALL >---------------------------------------------------------------------- > >Date: Wed, 2 Feb 2000 14:59:37 -0800 >From: Russ Wilson >Subject: Re: Sara's X-5, Tom's "C-90", Medical Economics and "War Games" > >>In message you wrote: >> >>> You're referring to my off-list message about possibly arranging some kind >>> of "hide and seek" games between "Us" (Rovers posing as either fleeing >>> refugees or marauding 4x4 terrorists) and "Them" (members of the marine >>> reserves in "company" vehicles). This MIGHT take place at Fort >>> Hunter-Liggett on the March 4-5 trip and/or possibly later. >> >> Now that sounds like fun. I even have a 101 already painted in a >>(mostly) camoflage pattern. >> >>Ben > >As one who spent 3 lovely years in the 82d Airborne Div. driving around in >a Hummer, you will all be chased down and whacked in about .30 seconds >flat. Say what you will about the AM General produced monster, it's fast, >it's got amazing ground clearance and most importantly of all...... the >drivers don't own or maintain the things!! They don't care how much they >beat up the trucks while chasing you around. Some marginally educated 19yr >old reservist will gladly pound the living crap out of a hummer just >because he can. Nice open space at H-L, just the kind of place where the >Hummer excells. The only terrain where I'd rather be driving a rover in >this little game would be in thick woods where the Hummer would be too wide >to follow an 88" up some twisty little trail. Way too much open terrain at >Ft.H-L. Good luck. > >Russ and Leslie Wilson I spoke to my reservist today. He will pose some scenario's with his "higher-ups" this weekend. He is still enthusiastic, but the possible scenario has changed. He said that the grunts would most-likely be on foot, with minimal (say 1-2) humvee as both command/support. A more likely scenario would be them trying to capture/stop a group of enthusiastic-though-misguided off-roaders who were attempting to dash on to a military reservation to either "procure" some form of potentially harmful (or profitable) government property, or destroy it, then escape. I proposed us posing as "eco-terrorists" he said "cool". I still don't know if this will come off, and I don't want it to detract from anyone else's plans of exploring FHL in peace and tranquility. For those who are still interested, even if it will only be for 0.30 seconds, please chime in. Interestingly, he suggested breaking-out the "MILES" equipment. This is the body-mounted laser sensors and blank cartridge-activated muzzle-mounted laser emitters. The emitters mount to M-16/XM-177E2/AR-15 and their .223 derivatives, which he could not supply. You will have to bring your own. For an amusing read on a possible scenario, read the last few chapters of "The Monkeywrench Gang" by Edward Abbey. Heyduke Lives! Rich (George Seldon-Seen Doc Sarvis) Lee From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Thu Feb 3 20:10:06 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id UAA18687 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Thu, 3 Feb 2000 20:10:06 -0500 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com Date: Thu, 3 Feb 2000 19:29:27 -0500 Subject: Re: Rover SDI for sale in Chronicle Message-ID: <20000203.192928.-158687.27.cirvin1258@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 4.0.5 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 0-3,6-9,11-25 X-Juno-Att: 0 X-Juno-RefParts: 0 From: Charles R Irvin Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Uh...a 1970 SD-1??????? Sure it isn't a P6-B? (they could have meant 1980) It it IS a SD-1, it had better be VERY clean for that price. (I mean, no leaky steering rack, A/C works, interior isn't torn apart, no leaky injectors, good brakes, no tired bushings, etc...) Charles On Thu, 3 Feb 2000 16:36:05 -0800 "Granville Pool" writes: > Sounds reasonable: > > ROVER '70 3500S Alu V8, BRG/blk runs/drives good, nds TLC & reg. > $2000 (707)542-7722 > > I'm not sure but think that's a Santa Rosa number. There's also > one in Ukiah (a yellow one) that was for sale a while back. I was > wondering if it'd sold and saw it driving around town a couple of > days ago. Very handsome cars, IMO. > > Cheers, > > > Granny ________________________________________________________________ YOU'RE PAYING TOO MUCH FOR THE INTERNET! Juno now offers FREE Internet Access! Try it today - there's no risk! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj. From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Thu Feb 3 20:14:19 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id UAA18706 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Thu, 3 Feb 2000 20:14:19 -0500 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com Date: Thu, 3 Feb 2000 19:42:38 -0500 Subject: Re: Mendo_Recce digest: V2 #901 Message-ID: <20000203.194530.-158687.28.cirvin1258@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 4.0.5 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 1-4,6-98 X-Juno-Att: 0 X-Juno-RefParts: 0 From: Charles R Irvin Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org ...The Air Force was still using J***s when I was in, in the mid-80's...think they still are. Charles On Thu, 3 Feb 2000 17:51:42 -0800 "Rich D. Lee, MD" writes: > HI ALL > > >---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > >Date: Wed, 2 Feb 2000 14:59:37 -0800 > >From: Russ Wilson > >Subject: Re: Sara's X-5, Tom's "C-90", Medical Economics and "War > Games" > > > >>In message you wrote: > >> > >>> You're referring to my off-list message about possibly arranging > some kind > >>> of "hide and seek" games between "Us" (Rovers posing as either > fleeing > >>> refugees or marauding 4x4 terrorists) and "Them" (members of the > marine > >>> reserves in "company" vehicles). This MIGHT take place at Fort > >>> Hunter-Liggett on the March 4-5 trip and/or possibly later. > >> > >> Now that sounds like fun. I even have a 101 already > painted in a > >>(mostly) camoflage pattern. > >> > >>Ben > > > >As one who spent 3 lovely years in the 82d Airborne Div. driving > around in > >a Hummer, you will all be chased down and whacked in about .30 > seconds > >flat. Say what you will about the AM General produced monster, > it's fast, > >it's got amazing ground clearance and most importantly of all...... > the > >drivers don't own or maintain the things!! They don't care how > much they > >beat up the trucks while chasing you around. Some marginally > educated 19yr > >old reservist will gladly pound the living crap out of a hummer > just > >because he can. Nice open space at H-L, just the kind of place > where the > >Hummer excells. The only terrain where I'd rather be driving a > rover in > >this little game would be in thick woods where the Hummer would be > too wide > >to follow an 88" up some twisty little trail. Way too much open > terrain at > >Ft.H-L. Good luck. > > > >Russ and Leslie Wilson > > > I spoke to my reservist today. He will pose some scenario's > with > his "higher-ups" this weekend. He is still enthusiastic, but the > possible > scenario has changed. He said that the grunts would most-likely be > on > foot, with minimal (say 1-2) humvee as both command/support. A more > likely > scenario would be them trying to capture/stop a group of > enthusiastic-though-misguided off-roaders who were attempting to > dash on to > a military reservation to either "procure" some form of potentially > harmful > (or profitable) government property, or destroy it, then escape. I > proposed > us posing as "eco-terrorists" he said "cool". > I still don't know if this will come off, and I don't want > it to > detract from anyone else's plans of exploring FHL in peace and > tranquility. > For those who are still interested, even if it will only be for 0.30 > seconds, please chime in. Interestingly, he suggested breaking-out > the > "MILES" equipment. This is the body-mounted laser sensors and blank > cartridge-activated muzzle-mounted laser emitters. The emitters > mount to > M-16/XM-177E2/AR-15 and their .223 derivatives, which he could not > supply. > You will have to bring your own. > For an amusing read on a possible scenario, read the last > few > chapters of "The Monkeywrench Gang" by Edward Abbey. > > Heyduke Lives! > > Rich (George Seldon-Seen Doc Sarvis) Lee > > > ________________________________________________________________ YOU'RE PAYING TOO MUCH FOR THE INTERNET! Juno now offers FREE Internet Access! Try it today - there's no risk! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj. From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Thu Feb 3 20:48:41 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id UAA18744 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Thu, 3 Feb 2000 20:48:41 -0500 Message-ID: <389A2F17.38F5BAD9@thelen.org> Date: Thu, 03 Feb 2000 17:45:09 -0800 From: Leslie Dow Organization: Mine, Not Yours X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 (Macintosh; I; PPC) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com" Subject: NCRC Newsletter Issue 16 submission deadline Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Hi all, Just a quick note that the submission deadline for the NCRC newsletter is approaching. It is February 15. Please take a moment to see if you have any great pictures and/or stories that you would like to submit for publication. I hear that the Mud run was quite muddy and great...or at least thats what it looks like based on the muddy jeans (Chris's) hanging in my bathroom 8). Ben and I are always looking for submissions...... thanks! leslie From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Thu Feb 3 22:13:24 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id WAA18778 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Thu, 3 Feb 2000 22:13:24 -0500 Message-ID: <02ce01bf6ebb$75597580$214c1f18@hawaii.rr.com> From: "Peter Hope" To: References: <20000203.192928.-158687.27.cirvin1258@juno.com> Subject: Re: Rover SDI for sale in Chronicle Date: Thu, 3 Feb 2000 16:56:39 -1000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org > Uh...a 1970 SD-1??????? > > Sure it isn't a P6-B? (they could have meant 1980) Just curious, for a brief period you could get a "Sterling" in the US. I have been told this is just a rebadged Rover. If true, what model and did they have the aluminum V-8 also? Pete From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Thu Feb 3 22:26:41 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id WAA18799 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Thu, 3 Feb 2000 22:26:41 -0500 From: "Kelly Minnick" To: Subject: RE: ways to mount headlight relays for a Series truck Date: Thu, 3 Feb 2000 19:29:13 -0800 Message-ID: <000e01bf6ec0$01b24620$d705193f@minnick> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2173.0 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 In-Reply-To: <03c201bf6d63$fef93cc0$214c1f18@hawaii.rr.com> Importance: Normal Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org There are relays (that Bosch makes) that will switch both in one unit. More amperage than MOST (this is the Mendo list) normal people would ever want... Kelly Minnick > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com > [mailto:owner-mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com]On Behalf Of Peter Hope > Sent: Wednesday, February 02, 2000 1:58 AM > To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com > Subject: Re: ways to mount headlight relays for a Series truck > > > > #1. Mount relays (hi&lo beam) and fuses on bulkhead. > > Take power from nearby starter solenoid. Run the > > light wires up to the bulbs. > > Result: Safe location but long wires > > > That is the way I am setting up mine. Seperate relay for the > high and low. > Power from the stock switch activates the relays. Using 10 gauge from the > relay to the lights. Wires are not that long, actually shorter then stock > and thicker. > Pete > > From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Thu Feb 3 22:47:00 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id WAA18814 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Thu, 3 Feb 2000 22:47:00 -0500 Date: Thu, 3 Feb 2000 19:40:18 -0800 (PST) From: Alexander George Cooper Message-Id: <200002040340.TAA15324@saga13.Stanford.EDU> To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com Subject: Eco-terrorism at FHL scenarios Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org On a similar note, I read about an exercise involving the SAS testing the security at an RAF base in Scotland. The plan was for one group to drive up to the main gate and cause a diversion with what would basically be a frontal assault. Meanwhile, the second group would penetrate the base from behind and place dummy charges on planes and other targets. The second group drove up to a chain link fence in a box van, unloaded some guys with chainsaws who cut through the fense (!) and then a team on dirt bikes went in and did their thing, Now I know that we have several members with chainsaws... :) Alexander From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Thu Feb 3 22:58:09 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id WAA18830 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Thu, 3 Feb 2000 22:58:09 -0500 Message-ID: <20000204035637.15630.qmail@web208.mail.yahoo.com> Date: Thu, 3 Feb 2000 19:56:37 -0800 (PST) From: joe mulqueen Subject: soap dish fuse box To: mendo MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Stolen from RN board.......... I made an auxillary fuse box out of a $1 'travel' or covered soap dish from wally mart. Add a marine, 4 gang fuse panel and took power from the battery. Nice, neat and realtively waterproof...Looks like a "factory" installation. JFM __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Talk to your friends online with Yahoo! Messenger. http://im.yahoo.com From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Thu Feb 3 23:16:25 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id XAA18852 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Thu, 3 Feb 2000 23:16:25 -0500 Message-ID: <389A545B.24DFA25C@mitchellfamily.com> Date: Thu, 03 Feb 2000 20:23:56 -0800 From: Ben Mitchell X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 (Macintosh; U; PPC) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com Subject: Re: Eco-terrorism at FHL scenarios References: <200002040340.TAA15324@saga13.Stanford.EDU> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Don't need no chainsaw. Easy to drive around the back gates into FHL...just seems like a bad idea... -Ben Alexander George Cooper wrote: > > On a similar note, I read about an exercise involving the SAS testing the > security at an RAF base in Scotland. The plan was for one group to drive up > to the main gate and cause a diversion with what would basically be a frontal > assault. Meanwhile, the second group would penetrate the base from behind and > place dummy charges on planes and other targets. The second group drove up to > a chain link fence in a box van, unloaded some guys with chainsaws who cut > through the fense (!) and then a team on dirt bikes went in and did their > thing, > > Now I know that we have several members with chainsaws... :) > > Alexander -- Benjamin DeWitt Mitchell mailto: ben@mitchellfamily.com It's never over In a Rover From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Thu Feb 3 23:41:46 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id XAA18890 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Thu, 3 Feb 2000 23:41:46 -0500 Message-ID: <389A58B2.63BA682D@idt.net> Date: Thu, 03 Feb 2000 20:42:26 -0800 From: Dheva Raja X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; U; Linux 2.2.5-22 i586) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: mendo_recce-digest@moab.off-road.com Subject: Re: Maggiolina car top tents prices Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org > do you happen to know the price? > > ::jory > According to the materials he sent me 3 months ago, the prices are as follows (approx due to various configurations): Maggiolina Adventure: $1400-1800 Columbus: $1300-1400 Overcamp: $1000 A bit pricey for sure, but I have not seen something better. Dheva From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Thu Feb 3 23:47:54 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id XAA18900 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Thu, 3 Feb 2000 23:47:54 -0500 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com Date: Thu, 3 Feb 2000 23:18:26 -0500 Subject: Re: NCRC Newsletter Issue 16 submission deadline Message-ID: <20000203.232648.-158687.34.cirvin1258@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 4.0.5 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Juno-Att: 0 X-Juno-RefParts: 0 From: Charles R Irvin Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Submissions, or submissives? Charles On Thu, 03 Feb 2000 17:45:09 -0800 Leslie Dow writes: > Hi all, > Just a quick note that the submission deadline for the NCRC > newsletter > is approaching. It is February 15. Please take a moment to see if > you > have any great pictures and/or stories that you would like to submit > for > publication. I hear that the Mud run was quite muddy and great...or > at > least thats what it looks like based on the muddy jeans (Chris's) > hanging in my bathroom 8). > > Ben and I are always looking for submissions...... > > thanks! > leslie ________________________________________________________________ YOU'RE PAYING TOO MUCH FOR THE INTERNET! Juno now offers FREE Internet Access! Try it today - there's no risk! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj. From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Thu Feb 3 23:47:57 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id XAA18910 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Thu, 3 Feb 2000 23:47:57 -0500 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com Date: Thu, 3 Feb 2000 23:15:32 -0500 Subject: Re: Rover SDI for sale in Chronicle Message-ID: <20000203.232648.-158687.32.cirvin1258@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 4.0.5 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 2-5,7-15 X-Juno-Att: 0 X-Juno-RefParts: 0 From: Charles R Irvin Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org There was the 825, and the 827: the 827 had the Honda V-6 with FWD, but the 827 SLi also had the SD-2 bodystyle (updated SD-1 bodystyle/interoir). Charles On Thu, 3 Feb 2000 16:56:39 -1000 "Peter Hope" writes: > > Just curious, for a brief period you could get a "Sterling" in the > US. I > have been told this is just a rebadged Rover. If true, what model > and did > they have the aluminum V-8 also? > Pete > ________________________________________________________________ YOU'RE PAYING TOO MUCH FOR THE INTERNET! Juno now offers FREE Internet Access! Try it today - there's no risk! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj. From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Thu Feb 3 23:49:13 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id XAA18920 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Thu, 3 Feb 2000 23:49:13 -0500 Message-ID: <389A5769.94614E4@earthlink.net> Date: Thu, 03 Feb 2000 20:36:57 -0800 From: "Franklin H. Yap" X-Sender: "Franklin H. Yap" <@mail.earthlink.net> (Unverified) X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en]C-FLASHNET (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com Subject: Re: Rover SDI for sale in Chronicle References: <20000203.192928.-158687.27.cirvin1258@juno.com> <02ce01bf6ebb$75597580$214c1f18@hawaii.rr.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Peter Hope wrote: > > Just curious, for a brief period you could get a "Sterling" in the US. I > have been told this is just a rebadged Rover. If true, what model and did > they have the aluminum V-8 also? The Sterings I have seen look like they were rebadged Hondas. Frank From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Thu Feb 3 23:49:35 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id XAA18930 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Thu, 3 Feb 2000 23:49:35 -0500 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com Date: Thu, 3 Feb 2000 23:29:24 -0500 Subject: Re: Maggiolina car top tents prices Message-ID: <20000203.232925.-158687.36.cirvin1258@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 4.0.5 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 1-3,5-27 X-Juno-Att: 0 X-Juno-RefParts: 0 From: Charles R Irvin Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org ...a couple of army 1-2 man tents put together, a bit of mosquito netting, and an air matress...shouldn't cost more than $100.00. Charles P.S. If you have a 109 regular, you can skip the netting/tents, and use the air matress in the back of the truck. :) :) :) On Thu, 03 Feb 2000 20:42:26 -0800 Dheva Raja writes: > > do you happen to know the price? > > > > ::jory > > > > According to the materials he sent me 3 months ago, the prices are > as > follows (approx due to various configurations): > > Maggiolina Adventure: $1400-1800 > Columbus: $1300-1400 > Overcamp: $1000 > > A bit pricey for sure, but I have not seen something better. > > Dheva > > > > ________________________________________________________________ YOU'RE PAYING TOO MUCH FOR THE INTERNET! Juno now offers FREE Internet Access! Try it today - there's no risk! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj. From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Fri Feb 4 00:00:18 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id AAA18984 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Fri, 4 Feb 2000 00:00:18 -0500 Message-ID: <389A5BBE.BBB82D87@thelen.org> Date: Thu, 03 Feb 2000 20:55:43 -0800 From: Leslie Dow Organization: Mine, Not Yours X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 (Macintosh; I; PPC) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com Subject: Re: NCRC Newsletter Issue 16 submission deadline References: <20000203.232648.-158687.34.cirvin1258@juno.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Well Charles, if you would like to submit a LR related bondage story Ben and I will certainly see that it gets the appropriate level of editorial abuse..... hehe leslie Charles R Irvin wrote: > > Submissions, or submissives? > > Charles > > On Thu, 03 Feb 2000 17:45:09 -0800 Leslie Dow writes: > > Hi all, > > Just a quick note that the submission deadline for the NCRC > > newsletter > > is approaching. It is February 15. Please take a moment to see if > > you > > have any great pictures and/or stories that you would like to submit > > for > > publication. I hear that the Mud run was quite muddy and great...or > > at > > least thats what it looks like based on the muddy jeans (Chris's) > > hanging in my bathroom 8). > > > > Ben and I are always looking for submissions...... > > > > thanks! > > leslie > > ________________________________________________________________ > YOU'RE PAYING TOO MUCH FOR THE INTERNET! > Juno now offers FREE Internet Access! > Try it today - there's no risk! For your FREE software, visit: > http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj. From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Fri Feb 4 00:06:08 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id AAA19023 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Fri, 4 Feb 2000 00:06:08 -0500 Message-ID: <389A5FDB.EE466E69@mitchellfamily.com> Date: Thu, 03 Feb 2000 21:13:02 -0800 From: Ben Mitchell X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 (Macintosh; U; PPC) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com Subject: Re: NCRC Newsletter Issue 16 submission deadline References: <20000203.232648.-158687.34.cirvin1258@juno.com> <389A5BBE.BBB82D87@thelen.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Um, yeah... Whatever... ;-) Leslie Dow wrote: > > Well Charles, if you would like to submit a LR related bondage story Ben > and I will certainly see that it gets the appropriate level of editorial abuse..... > hehe > leslie > > Charles R Irvin wrote: > > > > Submissions, or submissives? > > > > Charles > > > > On Thu, 03 Feb 2000 17:45:09 -0800 Leslie Dow writes: > > > Hi all, > > > Just a quick note that the submission deadline for the NCRC > > > newsletter > > > is approaching. It is February 15. Please take a moment to see if > > > you > > > have any great pictures and/or stories that you would like to submit > > > for > > > publication. I hear that the Mud run was quite muddy and great...or > > > at > > > least thats what it looks like based on the muddy jeans (Chris's) > > > hanging in my bathroom 8). > > > > > > Ben and I are always looking for submissions...... > > > > > > thanks! > > > leslie > > > > ________________________________________________________________ > > YOU'RE PAYING TOO MUCH FOR THE INTERNET! > > Juno now offers FREE Internet Access! > > Try it today - there's no risk! For your FREE software, visit: > > http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj. -- Benjamin DeWitt Mitchell It's Never Over Semio Corporation ben@mitchellfamily.com In a Rover benha@semio.com Y!Messenger: benha1 http://www.semio.com From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Fri Feb 4 00:09:30 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id AAA19038 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Fri, 4 Feb 2000 00:09:30 -0500 Message-ID: <389A5E30.CCEB9CFE@thelen.org> Date: Thu, 03 Feb 2000 21:06:10 -0800 From: Leslie Dow Organization: Mine, Not Yours X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 (Macintosh; I; PPC) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com Subject: Re: NCRC Newsletter Issue 16 submission deadline References: <20000203.232648.-158687.34.cirvin1258@juno.com> <389A5BBE.BBB82D87@thelen.org> <389A5FDB.EE466E69@mitchellfamily.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Damn ben, is this what it takes to get you to post? Ben Mitchell wrote: > > Um, yeah... > > Whatever... > > ;-) > > Leslie Dow wrote: > > > > Well Charles, if you would like to submit a LR related bondage story Ben > > and I will certainly see that it gets the appropriate level of editorial abuse..... > > hehe > > leslie > > > > Charles R Irvin wrote: > > > > > > Submissions, or submissives? > > > > > > Charles > > > > > > On Thu, 03 Feb 2000 17:45:09 -0800 Leslie Dow writes: > > > > Hi all, > > > > Just a quick note that the submission deadline for the NCRC > > > > newsletter > > > > is approaching. It is February 15. Please take a moment to see if > > > > you > > > > have any great pictures and/or stories that you would like to submit > > > > for > > > > publication. I hear that the Mud run was quite muddy and great...or > > > > at > > > > least thats what it looks like based on the muddy jeans (Chris's) > > > > hanging in my bathroom 8). > > > > > > > > Ben and I are always looking for submissions...... > > > > > > > > thanks! > > > > leslie > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________ > > > YOU'RE PAYING TOO MUCH FOR THE INTERNET! > > > Juno now offers FREE Internet Access! > > > Try it today - there's no risk! For your FREE software, visit: > > > http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj. > > -- > Benjamin DeWitt Mitchell It's Never Over Semio Corporation > ben@mitchellfamily.com In a Rover benha@semio.com > Y!Messenger: benha1 http://www.semio.com From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Fri Feb 4 00:13:33 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id AAA19133 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Fri, 4 Feb 2000 00:13:33 -0500 Message-ID: <389A61B1.B3AE8447@mitchellfamily.com> Date: Thu, 03 Feb 2000 21:20:52 -0800 From: Ben Mitchell X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 (Macintosh; U; PPC) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com Subject: Re: NCRC Newsletter Issue 16 submission deadline References: <20000203.232648.-158687.34.cirvin1258@juno.com> <389A5BBE.BBB82D87@thelen.org> <389A5FDB.EE466E69@mitchellfamily.com> <389A5E30.CCEB9CFE@thelen.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Actually, I just happened to be going through tonight deleting a bunch of messages which are now dated enough that they don't bear response when I saw NL#16 mentioned and (of course) my interest was piqued. Someday I'll get time to actually stay on top of this list again... Sigh... -Ben (Watching AmericaOne kick ass today in New Zeland...yeah...one win to go and we'll have a very real chance at an SF Bay America's Cup.) Leslie Dow wrote: > > Damn ben, is this what it takes to get you to post? > > Ben Mitchell wrote: > > > > Um, yeah... > > > > Whatever... > > > > ;-) > > > > Leslie Dow wrote: > > > > > > Well Charles, if you would like to submit a LR related bondage story Ben > > > and I will certainly see that it gets the appropriate level of editorial abuse..... > > > hehe > > > leslie > > > > > > Charles R Irvin wrote: > > > > > > > > Submissions, or submissives? > > > > > > > > Charles > > > > > > > > On Thu, 03 Feb 2000 17:45:09 -0800 Leslie Dow writes: > > > > > Hi all, > > > > > Just a quick note that the submission deadline for the NCRC > > > > > newsletter > > > > > is approaching. It is February 15. Please take a moment to see if > > > > > you > > > > > have any great pictures and/or stories that you would like to submit > > > > > for > > > > > publication. I hear that the Mud run was quite muddy and great...or > > > > > at > > > > > least thats what it looks like based on the muddy jeans (Chris's) > > > > > hanging in my bathroom 8). > > > > > > > > > > Ben and I are always looking for submissions...... > > > > > > > > > > thanks! > > > > > leslie > > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________ > > > > YOU'RE PAYING TOO MUCH FOR THE INTERNET! > > > > Juno now offers FREE Internet Access! > > > > Try it today - there's no risk! For your FREE software, visit: > > > > http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj. > > > > -- > > Benjamin DeWitt Mitchell It's Never Over Semio Corporation > > ben@mitchellfamily.com In a Rover benha@semio.com > > Y!Messenger: benha1 http://www.semio.com -- Benjamin DeWitt Mitchell It's Never Over Semio Corporation ben@mitchellfamily.com In a Rover benha@semio.com Y!Messenger: benha1 http://www.semio.com From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Fri Feb 4 00:29:09 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id AAA19503 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Fri, 4 Feb 2000 00:29:09 -0500 From: "Kelly Minnick" To: Subject: RE: Sara's X-5, Tom's "C-90", Medical Economics and "War Ga Date: Thu, 3 Feb 2000 21:29:11 -0800 Message-ID: <000f01bf6ed0$c406dbe0$d705193f@minnick> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2173.0 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 In-Reply-To: Importance: Normal Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org I'd have to agree. The first civilian versions would do the 1/4 mile before they hit 60 mph! That's about on par with the old VW bug with the 1200 cc engine... Kelly Minnick > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com > [mailto:owner-mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com]On Behalf Of James Howard > Sent: Wednesday, February 02, 2000 8:23 PM > To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com > Subject: Re: Sara's X-5, Tom's "C-90", Medical Economics and "War Ga > > > > > > > As one who spent 3 lovely years in the 82d Airborne Div. > driving around in > > > a Hummer, you will all be chased down and whacked in about .30 seconds > > > flat. Say what you will about the AM General produced > monster, it's fast, > > Fast? The diesel powered one I test drove didn't seem fast. It seemed > almost as slow as my Series III. It certainly was as loud as my SIII. > > Great car to let your kids go on dates with. Ain't no way they are going > to get real close in one of those! > > > From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Fri Feb 4 00:29:39 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id AAA19513 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Fri, 4 Feb 2000 00:29:39 -0500 From: "Kelly Minnick" To: Subject: RE: Tom's Toys Date: Thu, 3 Feb 2000 21:32:15 -0800 Message-ID: <001001bf6ed1$31ccf880$d705193f@minnick> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2173.0 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 In-Reply-To: Importance: Normal Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Yes. Vince pulled him out with his PTO driven winch. The first time I had seen one in operation. Also remember the van loaded with firewood coming up the slick mud hill... Kelly Minnick > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com > [mailto:owner-mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com]On Behalf Of john hess > Sent: Wednesday, February 02, 2000 8:41 PM > To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com > Subject: Re: Tom's Toys > > > >Hmmm... now sounds more like a Porsche 911 Carrera 4 convertible. > >BUT, if that's the case4, isn't that actually a 92.6" wheelbase? > >Surely you wouldn't be THAT FAR OFF, would you? > > > Well, > > now that the cat's out of the bag, I want to know if the C4 is as > capable as the Taurus SHO off road. (remember the SHO and the duufus > owner we found on the back roads of Mendo 3-4 years ago? He was > taking a short cut, and spent the night in his car, unable to climb > the slippery mud hills out.) > > Who remembers this besides me an Walt Swain? > > cheers, > > > > John F. Hess, Davis California jfhess@dcn.davis.ca.us > Land Rover Dormobile web pages: > http://wheel.dcn.davis.ca.us/~jfhess/homepage.html > 1968 Land Rover Dormobile "Elvis" 1960 Land Rover 88 PU "Stubby" > 1966 Mercury Monterey "Tillie" > From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Fri Feb 4 00:36:36 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id AAA19637 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Fri, 4 Feb 2000 00:36:36 -0500 From: "Kelly Minnick" To: Subject: RE: Rover SDI for sale in Chronicle Date: Thu, 3 Feb 2000 21:38:41 -0800 Message-ID: <001101bf6ed2$18355880$d705193f@minnick> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2173.0 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 In-Reply-To: <02ce01bf6ebb$75597580$214c1f18@hawaii.rr.com> Importance: Normal Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Sterling was an Acura rebadged and sold under Rover... Kelly Minnick (an Acura with wood Dash that is...) > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com > [mailto:owner-mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com]On Behalf Of Peter Hope > Sent: Thursday, February 03, 2000 6:57 PM > To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com > Subject: Re: Rover SDI for sale in Chronicle > > > > Uh...a 1970 SD-1??????? > > > > Sure it isn't a P6-B? (they could have meant 1980) > > > Just curious, for a brief period you could get a "Sterling" in the US. I > have been told this is just a rebadged Rover. If true, what model and did > they have the aluminum V-8 also? > Pete > > From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Fri Feb 4 00:38:32 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id AAA19649 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Fri, 4 Feb 2000 00:38:32 -0500 From: "Kelly Minnick" To: Subject: RE: soap dish fuse box Date: Thu, 3 Feb 2000 21:41:01 -0800 Message-ID: <001201bf6ed2$6b6daac0$d705193f@minnick> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2173.0 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 In-Reply-To: <20000204035637.15630.qmail@web208.mail.yahoo.com> Importance: Normal Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org I used one out of a Honda Civic and mounted it on the passenger's side. Was cool to have more than ONE fuse... Kelly Minnick > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com > [mailto:owner-mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com]On Behalf Of joe mulqueen > Sent: Thursday, February 03, 2000 7:57 PM > To: mendo > Subject: soap dish fuse box > > > Stolen from RN board.......... > > > I made an auxillary fuse box out of a $1 'travel' or > covered soap dish from wally mart. Add a marine, 4 > gang > fuse panel and took power from the battery. Nice, neat > and realtively waterproof...Looks like a "factory" > installation. > > JFM > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Talk to your friends online with Yahoo! Messenger. > http://im.yahoo.com > From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Fri Feb 4 02:13:43 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id CAA19678 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Fri, 4 Feb 2000 02:13:43 -0500 X-Sender: waycool@waycool.pobox.stanford.edu Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <200002040456.UAA32744@moab.off-road.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2000 00:18:49 -0800 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com From: "Rich D. Lee, MD" Subject: Ecoterrorism & Rovers Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org >Date: Thu, 3 Feb 2000 19:40:18 -0800 (PST) >From: Alexander George Cooper >Subject: Eco-terrorism at FHL scenarios > >On a similar note, I read about an exercise involving the SAS testing the >security at an RAF base in Scotland. The plan was for one group to drive up >to the main gate and cause a diversion with what would basically be a frontal >assault. Meanwhile, the second group would penetrate the base from behind and >place dummy charges on planes and other targets. Many similar tales are told by Richard Marcinko in his book "Rogue Warrior", where he trained an elite groop of Navy Seals and pulled a lot of pranks against various U.S. bases to demonstrate their vunerability. He eventually was "encouraged" to resign over this (and some other matters of operational tactics) due to the increasing embarassment it caused. I have a hard time believing all of his macho writings, but it is interesting reading. During the recent LPNF recce, our leadership wisely opted not to attempt to enter FHL from the back berm. Now if we were given permission by the C.O. to try... Or, if we chose it as a way out...Alas, I don't think the other travelers in LPNF would relate well to a group of escaping Rovers bristling with MILES sensors (and "emittors"). >The second group drove up to a chain link fence in a box van, unloaded >some >guys with chainsaws who cut through the fense (!) and then a team on >dirt bikes >went in and did their thing, > >Now I know that we have several members with chainsaws... :) > Fence pliers and mountainbikes are much quieter. Rich From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Fri Feb 4 02:39:34 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id CAA19701 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Fri, 4 Feb 2000 02:39:34 -0500 From: "Brian Foster" To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com Subject: Foster in Frisco Message-Id: <20000204073729.CZPC1148.mta05.onebox.com@onebox.com> Date: Thu, 3 Feb 2000 23:37:29 -0800 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org > Then Bruce wrote: > :The NCRC meeting is Friday the 18th between the SF airport and > :the City. Take a late flight and join us for the meeting and a beer, > :I can drop you off at the airport if you can get to the meeting in > Brisbane. > > As I re-read Brian's post it looks like he is DRIVING up from S. Cal. > I would love to try and meet up in the city even if the NCRC meeting > time does not work out, or you can't stay late on Friday for the > NCRC meeting > and are flying back (rather than driving) I can give > you a ride to the airport before the NCRC meeting. Well... you read my message properly. I am planning on driving up during the 14th and I was planning on driving home the 18th (I get booted out of the hotel that AM). I will consider staying for the meeting and driving home that Saturday AM, but I'll need a place to stay. I have a friend in San Mateo who may put me up. It also depends on what time the NCRC meeting lets out -- if it's not too late I may drive down to Santa Barbara/San Luis Obispo and split the drive up. I don't know what I'll be driving tho'... I am selling the '76 BMW 2002. I need to locate something to replace it soon since this is my daily driver. Anyway, I may stay for the meeting but a few more things need to be ironed out. However, I will be driving --not flying -- and that is definite. Brian Foster ___________________________________________________________________ To get your own FREE ZDNet onebox - FREE voicemail, email, and fax, all in one place - sign up today at http://www.zdnetonebox.com From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Fri Feb 4 03:35:30 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id DAA19767 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Fri, 4 Feb 2000 03:35:30 -0500 Message-Id: <4.1.20000203234931.00b9cf00@mail.halcyon.com> X-Sender: clarkebw@mail.halcyon.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.1 Date: Fri, 04 Feb 2000 00:30:08 -0800 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com From: Clarke Williams Subject: Re: Ecoterrorism & Rovers In-Reply-To: References: <200002040456.UAA32744@moab.off-road.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Rich, I'm not personally comfortable with the "ecoterrorism" term in the subject, nor the apparent Marcinko was a damn good leader and special warfare operative. He was not merely "training SEALS" -- he was the Team Leader and responsible for their performance. He was also the Plank CO of SEAL Team 6 and the 8th CO of SEAL Team 2. (If you don't know what a Plank member is, you are already out of your depth) Training missions for NAVSPECWARGRP involving various vulnerable (or perceived so) targets have been "fair game" for spec-ops since the '60's -- and still are. Marcinko's over-the-line issues that forced him from the service were much more along the lines of "drunken bar fights and civilians in hospital" and similar than "unauthorized training missions". That together with Mercedes 580SEs for most of the members of TEAM-6 (and later Red Cell) and various other "military vehicles" purchased under his authorization led him to his well deserved demise. An average cost of $1.5 million per man per year is beyond even the SEALS norms. The US Navy's Special Warfare Command has some of the finest people that have ever served our country - today, yesterday and tomorrow. Marcinko is not a good example of how the Navy conducts Special Warfare - then or now. A brilliant Operator, yes. A skillful warrior, yes. An example of Navy Leadership, NOT. You folks live in California. There are plenty of TEAM mates in and around San Diego. ASK THEM what they think of Marcinko. Drop a dime to call the CO of NavSpecWarGrp -- his name is Captain William H. Raven (unless he has been promoted since I last spoke with him.) Simply call information for SEAL Teams at Coronado and ask for the CO. It may surprise you but you WILL be connected. The TEAMs are kinda like that. The TEAMS are not civilians nor "typical" military. Be careful before ye judge or pass along misinformatsia. Marcinko is not an example of the TEAMS' best. I don't care how good his books (ghost-written) read. Clarke P.S. I also have qualms about your choice of "our leaders wisely opted not to enter ... [via] the back berm". I have already addressed this. CALL THE C.O. BEFORE HAND! At 12:18 AM 04-02-00 -0800, you wrote: *snip* >Many similar tales are told by Richard Marcinko in his book "Rogue >Warrior", where he trained an elite groop of Navy Seals and pulled a lot of >pranks against various U.S. bases to demonstrate their vunerability. He >eventually was "encouraged" to resign over this (and some other matters of >operational tactics) due to the increasing embarassment it caused. I have a >hard time believing all of his macho writings, but it is interesting >reading. **snip** > > During the recent LPNF recce, our leadership wisely opted not to >attempt to enter FHL from the back berm. Now if we were given permission by >the C.O. to try... Or, if we chose it as a way out...Alas, I don't think >the other travelers in LPNF would relate well to a group of escaping Rovers >bristling with MILES sensors (and "emittors"). > >Rich Clarke Williams From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Fri Feb 4 08:56:39 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id IAA20130 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Fri, 4 Feb 2000 08:56:39 -0500 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2000 08:16:35 -0500 Subject: Re: Ecoterrorism & Rovers Message-ID: <20000204.082749.-158687.40.cirvin1258@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 4.0.5 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 7-8,10-15,17-99 X-Juno-Att: 0 X-Juno-RefParts: 0 From: Charles R Irvin Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org >From what I found out in the Air Force, I do know that Marcinko was ousted primarily for an incident that occured at the Seal Beach Weapons Station: his team conducted the typical security breach test (twice - first time the CO claimed they were not prepared!), and the second time 'round, they kidnapped and interrogated the XO! Not a cool thing to do - though I myself would have loved to do it to a few people, so those in the "community" could understand why it happened. (he got into sooooo much trouble for it) Funny - they want you to do your job as best you can, but when you go beyond their expectations, they yank on the leash. However, in this case I understand that it was a personal thing. Charles On Fri, 04 Feb 2000 00:30:08 -0800 Clarke Williams writes: > Rich, > > I'm not personally comfortable with the "ecoterrorism" term in the > subject, nor the apparent > > Marcinko was a damn good leader and special warfare operative. He > was not merely "training SEALS" -- he was the Team Leader and > responsible for their performance. He was also the Plank CO of SEAL > Team 6 and the 8th CO of SEAL Team 2. (If you don't know what a > Plank member is, you are already out of your depth) > > Training missions for NAVSPECWARGRP involving various vulnerable (or > perceived so) targets have been "fair game" for spec-ops since the > '60's -- and still are. > > Marcinko's over-the-line issues that forced him from the service > were much more along the lines of "drunken bar fights and civilians > in hospital" and similar than "unauthorized training missions". > That together with Mercedes 580SEs for most of the members of TEAM-6 > (and later Red Cell) and various other "military vehicles" purchased > under his authorization led him to his well deserved demise. An > average cost of $1.5 million per man per year is beyond even the > SEALS norms. > > The US Navy's Special Warfare Command has some of the finest people > that have ever served our country - today, yesterday and tomorrow. > Marcinko is not a good example of how the Navy conducts Special > Warfare - then or now. A brilliant Operator, yes. A skillful > warrior, yes. An example of Navy Leadership, NOT. > > You folks live in California. There are plenty of TEAM mates in and > around San Diego. ASK THEM what they think of Marcinko. Drop a > dime to call the CO of NavSpecWarGrp -- his name is Captain William > H. Raven (unless he has been promoted since I last spoke with him.) > Simply call information for SEAL Teams at Coronado and ask for the > CO. It may surprise you but you WILL be connected. The TEAMs are > kinda like that. > > The TEAMS are not civilians nor "typical" military. Be careful > before ye judge or pass along misinformatsia. Marcinko is not an > example of the TEAMS' best. I don't care how good his books > (ghost-written) read. > > Clarke > > P.S. I also have qualms about your choice of "our leaders wisely > opted not to enter ... [via] the back berm". I have already > addressed this. CALL THE C.O. BEFORE HAND! > > At 12:18 AM 04-02-00 -0800, you wrote: > *snip* > >Many similar tales are told by Richard Marcinko in his book "Rogue > >Warrior", where he trained an elite groop of Navy Seals and pulled > a lot of > >pranks against various U.S. bases to demonstrate their > vunerability. He > >eventually was "encouraged" to resign over this (and some other > matters of > >operational tactics) due to the increasing embarassment it caused. > I have a > >hard time believing all of his macho writings, but it is > interesting > >reading. > > **snip** > > > > During the recent LPNF recce, our leadership wisely opted > not to > >attempt to enter FHL from the back berm. Now if we were given > permission by > >the C.O. to try... Or, if we chose it as a way out...Alas, I don't > think > >the other travelers in LPNF would relate well to a group of > escaping Rovers > >bristling with MILES sensors (and "emittors"). > > > > >Rich > > > Clarke Williams > ________________________________________________________________ YOU'RE PAYING TOO MUCH FOR THE INTERNET! Juno now offers FREE Internet Access! Try it today - there's no risk! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj. From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Fri Feb 4 08:56:39 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id IAA20131 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Fri, 4 Feb 2000 08:56:39 -0500 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2000 07:59:05 -0500 Subject: Re: NCRC Newsletter Issue 16 submission deadline Message-ID: <20000204.082749.-158687.39.cirvin1258@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 4.0.5 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 0-1,4-49 X-Juno-Att: 0 X-Juno-RefParts: 0 From: Charles R Irvin Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org I didn't mean ME! However - I do have a very dear friend here in Boston that's a Dominatrix...(the stories she can tell...needless to say, I don't want to know.) Charles On Thu, 03 Feb 2000 20:55:43 -0800 Leslie Dow writes: > Well Charles, if you would like to submit a LR related bondage story > Ben > and I will certainly see that it gets the appropriate level of > editorial abuse..... > hehe > leslie > > Charles R Irvin wrote: > > > > Submissions, or submissives? > > > > Charles > > > > On Thu, 03 Feb 2000 17:45:09 -0800 Leslie Dow > writes: > > > Hi all, > > > Just a quick note that the submission deadline for the NCRC > > > newsletter > > > is approaching. It is February 15. Please take a moment to see > if > > > you > > > have any great pictures and/or stories that you would like to > submit > > > for > > > publication. I hear that the Mud run was quite muddy and > great...or > > > at > > > least thats what it looks like based on the muddy jeans > (Chris's) > > > hanging in my bathroom 8). > > > > > > Ben and I are always looking for submissions...... > > > > > > thanks! > > > leslie > > > > ________________________________________________________________ > > YOU'RE PAYING TOO MUCH FOR THE INTERNET! > > Juno now offers FREE Internet Access! > > Try it today - there's no risk! For your FREE software, visit: > > http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj. ________________________________________________________________ YOU'RE PAYING TOO MUCH FOR THE INTERNET! Juno now offers FREE Internet Access! Try it today - there's no risk! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj. From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Fri Feb 4 11:00:38 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id LAA20462 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Fri, 4 Feb 2000 11:00:38 -0500 From: GElam30092@aol.com Message-ID: <78.108332d.25cc4ffa@aol.com> Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2000 10:53:30 EST Subject: stuck in 3rd To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 45 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org As I got on the interstate this morning, I shifted into 3rd and then let off the gas to slow down. When I picked up the speed, I couldn't shift out of third! #@$#% I got into O/D and got off at the next exit. 3 right turns later, I was headed back home. Logically, I don't think the problem is with the transmission itself but with the gear change mechanisms. Any advice before I dive into it is greatly appreciated. (Used to have a Dodge that would do this occasionally. A tap of the shifting mechanism below would fix it. But on a LR with no accessible parts o/s is new to me!) As usual, any advice is greatly appreciated! Cheers, Gerry PHX AZ From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Fri Feb 4 11:17:25 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id LAA20511 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Fri, 4 Feb 2000 11:17:25 -0500 Message-ID: <000501bf6f2a$802ff780$7500000a@kpk01> From: "Kevin Kelly" To: "Mendo List" Subject: Sterlings Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2000 08:11:23 -0800 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2120.0 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2120.0 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Peter Hope wrote: :: Just curious, for a brief period you could get a +ACI-Sterling+ACI- in the US. I :: have been told this is just a rebadged Rover. If true, what model and did :: they have the aluminum V-8 also The Frank wrote: : The Sterlings I have seen look like they were rebadged Hondas. All the Sterlings sold in the U.S. were in fact rebadged Rovers almost identical to the Rover sedans sold in Europe. Frank is partly correct in that all the Sertlings sold in the U.S. had Acura Legend (made by Honda) drive trains and other parts, but the bodies and most of the cars were made by Rover in England. My parents owned a Serling for a while in the late 80's. A friend of my Dad sold the one year old low miles car to them for a great price before he moved to Europe. In the year they had it the thing always had problems, so they sold it and bought an Acura (that had almost no problems). As far as I know there are no parts in a Sterling that will fit on a Land Rover. The DOHC V6 will bolt in to a 1986-1990 Acura Legend, but not a Land Rover. Kevin Kelly From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Fri Feb 4 11:32:49 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id LAA20582 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Fri, 4 Feb 2000 11:32:49 -0500 Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.20000204082121.0090e100@mail.saber.net> X-Sender: bobnsueb@mail.saber.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (32) Date: Fri, 04 Feb 2000 08:21:21 -0800 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com From: Bob & Sue Bernard Subject: Re: stuck in 3rd In-Reply-To: <78.108332d.25cc4ffa@aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Gerry, When my Datsun P/U did this, it was caused by a worn out synchro ring that was getting cocked and binding. It happened only when getting off the freeway from doing 65-70. Around town no problem. The thing that would free it was to rock it backward while in gear. The thing that fixed it was new synchro. Bob B At 10:53 AM 2/4/2000 EST, you wrote: >As I got on the interstate this morning, I shifted into 3rd and then let off >the gas to slow down. When I picked up the speed, I couldn't shift out of >third! #@$#% > >I got into O/D and got off at the next exit. 3 right turns later, I was >headed back home. > >Logically, I don't think the problem is with the transmission itself but with >the gear change mechanisms. Any advice before I dive into it is greatly >appreciated. (Used to have a Dodge that would do this occasionally. A tap >of the shifting mechanism below would fix it. But on a LR with no accessible >parts o/s is new to me!) > >As usual, any advice is greatly appreciated! > >Cheers, >Gerry >PHX AZ > From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Fri Feb 4 11:32:55 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id LAA20592 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Fri, 4 Feb 2000 11:32:55 -0500 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <000f01bf6ed0$c406dbe0$d705193f@minnick> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2000 08:21:40 -0800 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com From: Russ Wilson Subject: Hummer Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org >I'd have to agree. The first civilian versions would do the 1/4 mile before >they hit 60 mph! That's about on par with the old VW bug with the 1200 cc >engine... The early military versions had the GM 6.2 under the hood. The later military versions have the new and improved? 6.5 with WAY more get up and go. I have never been in a civilian version. I'd think they would be a touch slower because of the emmisions/DOT stuff that had to be added. This along with the weight from the solid doors etc. I guess(hope) that we'll all get a chance to see for ourselves soon. Russ and Leslie Wilson "Expertise was best defined in terms not of what the expert already knew, but of how easily the expert could find things out." - Nathaniel Borenstein From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Fri Feb 4 11:44:51 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id LAA20662 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Fri, 4 Feb 2000 11:44:51 -0500 Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.20000204083944.00822560@pacific.net> X-Sender: gpool@pacific.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (32) Date: Fri, 04 Feb 2000 08:39:44 -0800 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com From: Granville Pool Subject: Mendo, the early days, was RE: Tom's Toys In-Reply-To: <001001bf6ed1$31ccf880$d705193f@minnick> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org John Hess wrote: >capable as the Taurus SHO off road. (remember the SHO and the duufus >owner we found on the back roads of Mendo 3-4 years ago? He was >taking a short cut, and spent the night in his car, unable to climb >the slippery mud hills out.) >Who remembers this besides me an Walt Swain? Kelly Minnick wrote: >Yes. Vince pulled him out with his PTO driven winch. The first time I had >seen one in operation. Also remember the van loaded with firewood coming up >the slick mud hill... I remember all too well and even remember that it's Vance, not Vince. I remember that Walt had the red 109 (now Joe's, right?) with chains on. Vance was the one who told me about how to get onto the LRO list, when I met him at the Hayward Leak (in '94 I think it was). I remember that BP had a booth there and was selling off some LR models. Vance and Roger were fighting over the rest of the white police 110 models (after I got mine). I met Morgan and several others there, too. That set the stage for the idle discussion on the LRO list the next fall, between Morgan and me, that led to the first mendo recces for planning the Mendocino Forest Rallye that we got scared into making a notarallye. On the first recce (January '94?), none of the vehicles had a winch, a locker, a lift, rock sliders, or any other fancy stuff. In fact, I rather doubt that any of us had even heard of rock sliders. Walt and I weren't even driving our Rovers. On the second recce, the term "vapour locke" was coined. Those were the days... Granny From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Fri Feb 4 11:50:35 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id LAA20695 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Fri, 4 Feb 2000 11:50:35 -0500 Message-ID: <03b501bf6f2c$6c764e40$214c1f18@hawaii.rr.com> From: "Peter Hope" To: References: Subject: Re: Hummer Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2000 06:25:17 -1000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org > The early military versions had the GM 6.2 under the hood. The later > military versions have the new and improved? 6.5 with WAY more get up and > go. I have never been in a civilian version. I'd think they would be a > touch slower because of the emmisions/DOT stuff that had to be added. This > along with the weight from the solid doors etc. I guess(hope) that we'll > all get a chance to see for ourselves soon. All of the Army ones I have driven have had goveners. I have never been impressed with their get up and go on road, but that is not what they were designed for. But they have a hell of a lot of power. Drove one once carrying the companies weapons and towing a full water buffalo (trailer). Was able to get up to 65 with out much problem. Off road they shine. Have never had a load like the one just mentioned, but have had loaded up with people and 5000rds of ammo (5.56 & 7.62). If I ever won one, I would sell it quick. They are to big and heavy for my personal tastes. Wouldn't mind having the engine/trany/xfer combo for a 130 hybrid/camper though :-) Pete From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Fri Feb 4 12:10:26 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id MAA20908 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Fri, 4 Feb 2000 12:10:26 -0500 Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.20000204084901.00910a40@mail.saber.net> X-Sender: bobnsueb@mail.saber.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (32) Date: Fri, 04 Feb 2000 08:49:01 -0800 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com From: Bob & Sue Bernard Subject: Re: Mendo, the early days, was RE: Tom's Toys In-Reply-To: <3.0.6.32.20000204083944.00822560@pacific.net> References: <001001bf6ed1$31ccf880$d705193f@minnick> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org At 08:39 AM 2/4/2000 -0800, you wrote: >Kelly Minnick wrote: > >>Yes. Vince pulled him out with his PTO driven winch. The first time I had >>seen one in operation. Also remember the van loaded with firewood coming up >>the slick mud hill... > >I remember all too well and even remember that it's Vance, not Vince. I >remember that Walt had the red 109 (now Joe's, right?) with chains on. > >On the first recce (January '94?), none of the vehicles had a winch, a >locker, a lift, rock sliders, or any other fancy stuff. In fact, I rather >doubt that any of us had even heard of rock sliders. Walt and I weren't >even driving our Rovers. Hi, I wasn't on the first Mendo, but I believe it was the second. And Sherman has had his Homade rock sliders since about 1990. And his full rollcage a year or two before that. Bob B >On the second recce, the term "vapour locke" was coined. > >Those were the days... > > >Granny > From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Fri Feb 4 13:06:48 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id NAA21034 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Fri, 4 Feb 2000 13:06:48 -0500 Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.20000204100011.00821b40@pacific.net> X-Sender: gpool@pacific.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (32) Date: Fri, 04 Feb 2000 10:00:11 -0800 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com From: Granville Pool Subject: Re: Mendo, the early days, was RE: Tom's Toys In-Reply-To: <3.0.6.32.20000204084901.00910a40@mail.saber.net> References: <3.0.6.32.20000204083944.00822560@pacific.net> <001001bf6ed1$31ccf880$d705193f@minnick> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Bob B wrote: >I wasn't on the first Mendo, but I believe it was the second. And Sherman >has had his Homade rock sliders since about 1990. And his full rollcage a >year or two before that. You were on the first Mendocino Forest notaRallye. There were two Mendo recces before that. And I might have been exaggerating a little :^) Granny From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Fri Feb 4 13:19:56 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id NAA21047 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Fri, 4 Feb 2000 13:19:56 -0500 X-Sender: studios@cwnet.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.1.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com From: Michael Carradine Subject: NCRC web site Message-Id: <20000204175101.JICJ9690.mail.rdc1.sfba.home.com@c895892-a> Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2000 09:51:01 -0800 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Basic NCRC subscription info has been posted at www.landrover.net/NCRC for a couple of years, but a link needs to be made to the official site. Anyone have the URL??? Is there also a URL for the Mendo list? -Michael '50 80", '89 RR in heat From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Fri Feb 4 13:31:19 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id NAA21058 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Fri, 4 Feb 2000 13:31:19 -0500 Date: 4 Feb 2000 10:28:27 -0800 Message-Id: From: "Michael Slade" To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com X-Sender: web79245@dreamlab.cc Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Subject: Timm Coopers latest... Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org All, Here's the URL for Timm Coopers latest creation. Some of you know Timm, some of you don't. Most of you will get a kick out of what he's done to his Series One 109 Pick-Up. http://www.DreamLab.CC/coopers1/seriesonepickup.html Later, Michael Slade Portland, Oregon www.DreamLab.cc From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Fri Feb 4 13:39:04 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id NAA21078 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Fri, 4 Feb 2000 13:39:04 -0500 Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2000 10:22:41 -0800 (PST) From: john hess To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com Subject: Re: stuck in 3rd In-Reply-To: <78.108332d.25cc4ffa@aol.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Stubby's problem in this regard has always been the pin that links the rod coming out of the belt housing to the linkage. What is your pedal like? Does it work normally? Does it feel real easy? cheers On Fri, 4 Feb 2000 GElam30092@aol.com wrote: > As I got on the interstate this morning, I shifted into 3rd and then let off > the gas to slow down. When I picked up the speed, I couldn't shift out of > third! #@$#% > > I got into O/D and got off at the next exit. 3 right turns later, I was > headed back home. > > Logically, I don't think the problem is with the transmission itself but with > the gear change mechanisms. Any advice before I dive into it is greatly > appreciated. (Used to have a Dodge that would do this occasionally. A tap > of the shifting mechanism below would fix it. But on a LR with no accessible > parts o/s is new to me!) > > As usual, any advice is greatly appreciated! > > Cheers, > Gerry > PHX AZ > john hess, Davis, California jfhess@dcn.davis.ca.us Dormie web pages at http://dcn.davis.ca.us/~jfhess/startpoint.html From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Fri Feb 4 13:45:09 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id NAA21101 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Fri, 4 Feb 2000 13:45:09 -0500 From: GElam30092@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2000 13:39:45 EST Subject: Re: stuck in 3rd To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 45 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org In a message dated 2/4/2000 11:38:03 AM US Mountain Standard Time, jfhess@wheel.dcn.davis.ca.us writes: << What is your pedal like? Does it work normally? Does it feel real easy? >> Feels fine..... no problem that I can feel. I can stop and start again (except for starting off in 3rd obviously!). Thanks for the suggestion though! Gerry From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Fri Feb 4 14:18:50 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id OAA21168 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Fri, 4 Feb 2000 14:18:50 -0500 Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.20000204111107.008e5390@uxsfo4> X-Sender: jr033@uxsfo4 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Fri, 04 Feb 2000 11:11:07 -0800 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com From: Jim Russell Subject: TTT50 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org For those interested in such trivia, the other day the Turner turned fifty (K) and 1,500.4 running (oil pressure) hours while passing Boeing Field on the way to work. At one time I thought I might try to write up a little something for the NCRC newsletter regarding my experiences with it up to some significant point such as this but ended up deciding it would be pretty uninteresting ('cept maybe for some of the stuff as to how it came about). I know that there have recently been some negative threads on Turners but my experience has been, at worst, uneventful and, at best, very good. Zero problems, very good performance. From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Fri Feb 4 14:18:57 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id OAA21178 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Fri, 4 Feb 2000 14:18:57 -0500 Message-Id: <200002041908.LAA22503@proxy4.ba.best.com> Comments: Authenticated sender is From: "Tom Walsh" To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2000 11:06:43 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Re: Hummer X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.31) Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org As I said... miliary had smaller engine.. 6.2 then to 6.5L Civilian is now 6.5L with turbo and intercooler, HUGE difference. but Non turbo is still a snail IMHO ( it will beat my series! and FC101 probably ) (I had a intercoolr tube come off on the F350 Diesel once... Litterally couldn't get out of its own way, So having the intercooled turbo is a HUGE boost in HP & torque ) TomW > > The early military versions had the GM 6.2 under the hood. The later > military versions have the new and improved? 6.5 with WAY more get up and > go. I have never been in a civilian version. I'd think they would be a > touch slower because of the emmisions/DOT stuff that had to be added. This > along with the weight from the solid doors etc. I guess(hope) that we'll > all get a chance to see for ourselves soon. > > > Russ and Leslie Wilson > > "Expertise was best defined in terms not of what the expert already knew, > but of how easily the expert could find things out." > - Nathaniel Borenstein > > > > *---------*---------* "Tonka" Truck, Lil Buggar, Lt Brigade, Posh,.. LandRovers "I love the smell of Null pointers in the morning" tomw@best.com, twalsh@redback.com From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Fri Feb 4 14:52:59 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id OAA21228 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Fri, 4 Feb 2000 14:52:59 -0500 Mime-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <389A58B2.63BA682D@idt.net> References: <389A58B2.63BA682D@idt.net> Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2000 11:49:56 -0800 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com From: jory bell Subject: Re: Maggiolina car top tents prices Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org they look pretty sweet. if they were just a few inches shorter, i could fit them entirely in my roof rack (88) i would be interested to know if they had a model with a door/entry on the end(s) instead of the sides (so i could climb on the hood or up the rear ladder on my 88.) ::jory > > do you happen to know the price? > > > > ::jory > > > >According to the materials he sent me 3 months ago, the prices are as >follows (approx due to various configurations): > >Maggiolina Adventure: $1400-1800 >Columbus: $1300-1400 >Overcamp: $1000 > >A bit pricey for sure, but I have not seen something better. > >Dheva From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Fri Feb 4 15:03:48 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id PAA21250 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Fri, 4 Feb 2000 15:03:48 -0500 Message-Id: <200002041959.LAA10529@blackie.cruzers.com> Subject: Re: Timm Coopers latest... Date: Fri, 4 Feb 00 12:03:48 -0800 x-sender: twakeman@mail.cruzers.com x-mailer: Claris Emailer 2.0, March 15, 1997 From: TeriAnn Wakeman To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Good set of pictures Michael! It has been fun watching this car come together. When my car was at Timm'a house getting her new engine and transmission the series I was a frame with a bulkhead, front springs & front axle mounted. The back was just propped up. Then he brought a rolling frame with front & rear axles, springs mounted & the engine almost mounted to PABFM. Now you have supplied pictures for an update. Thanks!! When my car was at Timm's house, he & I brainstormed nonrestrictive shock mountings & suspension mechanics on a series rig for several hours. It is interesting to see that the series I has grown the shck mountings that he & I discussed as probably being the best. It is essentually the same shock mounting that I have been talking about adding to my Rover. I'll have to ask him how they are working out. I know front articulation shown in your picture would not have been possile without moving the front top shock mount up into a tower. Thanks much for the update!!! TeriAnn Wakeman If you send me direct mail, please Santa Cruz, California start the subject line with TW - twakeman@cruzers.com I will be sure to read the message http://www.shadow-catcher.net <- Photography for sale http://www.overlander.net <- Web directory for Land Rover http://www.cruzers.com/~twakeman <- My personal web site "In the world of type A & type B drivers consider me a type C gypsy traveler. Destinations are optional and not necessarily desirable." From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Fri Feb 4 15:26:03 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id PAA21322 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Fri, 4 Feb 2000 15:26:03 -0500 Message-Id: <4.1.20000204121010.00d5f4a0@mail.halcyon.com> X-Sender: clarkebw@mail.halcyon.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.1 Date: Fri, 04 Feb 2000 12:16:03 -0800 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com From: Clarke Williams Subject: Re: Hummer In-Reply-To: <200002041908.LAA22503@proxy4.ba.best.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Tom, At 11:06 AM 04-02-00 -0800, you wrote: >As I said... >miliary had smaller engine.. >6.2 then to 6.5L >Civilian is now 6.5L with turbo and intercooler, HUGE difference. >but Non turbo is still a snail IMHO ( it will beat my series! and >FC101 probably ) >TomW As I said, Tom, the military uses the SAME SIZE ENGINE AS CIVILIAN. The heavier 12,500lb HMMWVs are even using turbos. Early civilian Hummers used 6.2L. Why? Simple ... the 6.5L was not invented yet. Early civilian Hummers were also NA diesels, not turbo. (yes, I know that AMG put gas engines in some few civilian Hummers) Current production military and civilian Hummers and Humvees both use 6.5L. Period. There has NEVER been a difference in engine size between civilian and military Hummer/Humvee of the same model year. PERIOD. Clarke Williams From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Fri Feb 4 15:28:23 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id PAA21332 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Fri, 4 Feb 2000 15:28:23 -0500 From: "Brian Foster" To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com Subject: Good ol' days Message-Id: <20000204202452.ZSQU354.mta03.onebox.com@onebox.com> Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2000 12:24:52 -0800 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org I remember the stories from the first mendo event. I joined within a few days of the mendo_recce e-mail list birth. Stacey and I didn't get much of chance to attend any of the mendo events, but we did meet up with the folks from this list at China Lake. Those that went may remember that we were out there with our 95 Disco before it had plates and with only 1200 miles on the odometer. We remember that trip fondly. Now that our kids are 5 and 3, we believe they are old enough to start joining us on camping adventures like China Lake. You might see the Fosters in an upcoming event soon. Cheers, Brian Foster ___________________________________________________________________ To get your own FREE ZDNet onebox - FREE voicemail, email, and fax, all in one place - sign up today at http://www.zdnetonebox.com From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Fri Feb 4 15:36:53 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id PAA21343 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Fri, 4 Feb 2000 15:36:53 -0500 Message-ID: <389B3824.68D7DDB0@wenet.net> Date: Fri, 04 Feb 2000 12:35:48 -0800 From: "Bruce R. Bonar" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com Subject: Re: NCRC web site References: <20000204175101.JICJ9690.mail.rdc1.sfba.home.com@c895892-a> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org The official NCRC website is: http://www.roverstuff.com/ncrc/ Bruce Bonar Michael Carradine wrote: > Basic NCRC subscription info has been posted at > www.landrover.net/NCRC for a couple of years, > but a link needs to be made to the official site. > Anyone have the URL??? Is there also a URL for > the Mendo list? > > -Michael > > '50 80", '89 RR in heat From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Fri Feb 4 16:54:41 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id QAA21396 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Fri, 4 Feb 2000 16:54:41 -0500 Message-Id: <200002042149.NAA20174@proxy4.ba.best.com> Comments: Authenticated sender is From: "Tom Walsh" To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2000 13:48:39 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Re:headlight relays & "megawatts" X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.31) Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org It would be cheaper if all ate more carrots :) TomW, whats up doc? > irises to close down. I may be the only driver in the world who reacts > this way but I do not think so. > *---------*---------* "Tonka" Truck, Lil Buggar, Lt Brigade, Posh,.. LandRovers "I love the smell of Null pointers in the morning" tomw@best.com, twalsh@redback.com From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Fri Feb 4 17:03:20 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id RAA21409 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Fri, 4 Feb 2000 17:03:20 -0500 From: "Kelly Minnick" To: Subject: RE: Good ol' days Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2000 14:03:41 -0800 Message-ID: <000401bf6f5b$b29e7760$8605193f@minnick> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2173.0 In-Reply-To: <20000204202452.ZSQU354.mta03.onebox.com@onebox.com> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Importance: Normal Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org I remember you having to put virgin scratches on it, and I felt really bad. The road to Pleasant canyon had not been traveled on for a long time and it was completely overgrown with bushes & trees. Very cool looking but scratch producing! Many will remember TW & her U-bolt problems. I've got some great pictures that haven't been posted anywhere(YET)... I also remember playing ambulance with Jim on the second Mendo. Hope there were not lasting effects to the leg, Jim. It was also that trip that sparked my interest in Mogs, to end up buying one later that year. Aw - memories. I think a spring desert trip would be nice through Cerro Gorto, Saline, etc. Kelly Minnick > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com > [mailto:owner-mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com]On Behalf Of Brian Foster > Sent: Friday, February 04, 2000 12:25 PM > To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com > Subject: Good ol' days > > > I remember the stories from the first mendo event. I joined within a > few days of the mendo_recce e-mail list birth. > > Stacey and I didn't get much of chance to attend any of the mendo events, > but we did meet up with the folks from this list at China Lake. Those > that went may remember that we were out there with our 95 Disco before > it had plates and with only 1200 miles on the odometer. We remember that > trip fondly. > > Now that our kids are 5 and 3, we believe they are old enough to start > joining us on camping adventures like China Lake. You might see > the Fosters > in an upcoming event soon. > > Cheers, > Brian Foster > > ___________________________________________________________________ > To get your own FREE ZDNet onebox - FREE voicemail, email, and fax, > all in one place - sign up today at http://www.zdnetonebox.com > > From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Fri Feb 4 17:04:03 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id RAA21419 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Fri, 4 Feb 2000 17:04:03 -0500 From: "Kelly Minnick" To: Subject: RE: Mendo, the early days, was RE: Tom's Toys Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2000 13:54:36 -0800 Message-ID: <000301bf6f5a$6d7fe020$8605193f@minnick> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2173.0 In-Reply-To: <3.0.6.32.20000204084901.00910a40@mail.saber.net> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Importance: Normal Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Bob- Sherman has always been a way-cool off-roader (since I've known him...) Many items custom! Kelly Minnick > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com > [mailto:owner-mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com]On Behalf Of Bob & Sue > Bernard > Sent: Friday, February 04, 2000 8:49 AM > To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com > Subject: Re: Mendo, the early days, was RE: Tom's Toys > > Hi, > I wasn't on the first Mendo, but I believe it was the second. And Sherman > has had his Homade rock sliders since about 1990. And his full rollcage a > year or two before that. > Bob B > > > > > >On the second recce, the term "vapour locke" was coined. > > > >Those were the days... > > > > > >Granny > > > From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Fri Feb 4 17:07:55 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id RAA21439 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Fri, 4 Feb 2000 17:07:55 -0500 From: GElam30092@aol.com Message-ID: <79.12c46fe.25cca6d5@aol.com> Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2000 17:04:05 EST Subject: Disco rear bumper: BP item To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com, anieto@mofo.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 45 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Well, Armando asked me about my rear bumper from Australia the other day. I'm not sure I'd recommend it since it does lessen rear clearance a bit but is 10X more substantial that the factory one. There is a new alternative on the market. Check BP's special today for a $399 replacement! Where were they when I needed them last year? :-) Cheers, Gerry >From the ad: Regardless how you use your Discovery, as the grocery getter, commuter, or on the trail, you need one of these bumpers! Many folks choose the Disco as their daily driver for the safety of their family: it sits up high and provides superior accident protection. Trouble is that the bumper is thin and the aluminum bodywork is easily damaged and expensive to repair. Our bumper is much stronger than the stock factory unit, but still looks like original equipment: all the factory lights and reflectors are returned to their exact location, the shape mirrors the stock look, and the troublesome plastic end caps are completely eliminated. Our all steel bumper extends around the corners and down both sides to substancially protect the rear body from damage. The steel used in our bumper is three times thicker than the stock one, providing superior protection and safety. The finish is satin black powdercoat to exactly match the trim on the rest of the truck, and a durable non slip surface is provided for entry and exit. If some yayhoo on a cell phone rear ends you with one of our bumpers, they are going to lose! Off road, our bumper protects those delicate lower rear fender areas from rock and brush damage. Designed for abuse on the trail, your departure angles are exactly the same as stock. Sliding off a berm won't be the worry it usually is! This is a genuine rock slider, built for tough trail use. Our bumper is carefully designed NOT to require modifications to the body to fit! You will need to drill 4 5/16" holes to attach braces to the chassis, but the hardware is provided along with detailed instructions. You reuse all the factory lights from your original bumper, and we even provide the two-sided tape for the reflector! Should you wish, you can easily return to the stock bumper. The trailer hitch is not affected in any way, but you will need to trim or remove the mudflaps. Any 4WD, body shop, or mechanic can easily and quickly mount it for you if you can't do it yourself, but it is designed with the do it yourselfer in mind. This is a very sharp looking bumper, with fit and finish second to none! It weighs only 78 lbs., much lighter than other accessory bumpers, important in keeping the weight balance and fuel mileage within reason. Strong doesn't have to be heavy, and the little V8 doesn't need excess weight to drag around. Today we have 4 pre-production rear bumpers available at a special one time only low price. The production versions will sell for about $500 and are coming off the line now, but here's a chance for four lucky people to get theirs at at least $100 off! (Some slight filing or fitting may be required.) Once these four are gone at this price, that's it, so don't wait! Bumpers are shipped common carrier. $399! From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Fri Feb 4 17:09:12 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id RAA21449 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Fri, 4 Feb 2000 17:09:12 -0500 From: Zaxcoinc@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2000 16:49:19 EST Subject: Re: NCRC Newsletter Issue 16 submission deadline To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 45 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org In a message dated 2/3/00 9:08:08 PM Pacific Standard Time, leslie@thelen.org writes: > Damn ben, is this what it takes to get you to post? > > Ben Mitchell wrote: > > > > Um, yeah... > > > > Whatever... Sorry, on Ben's behalf he's been a little tied up.... Zack :) From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Fri Feb 4 17:34:29 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id RAA21461 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Fri, 4 Feb 2000 17:34:29 -0500 From: "Kelly Minnick" To: Subject: RE: Mendo, the early days, was RE: Tom's Toys Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2000 13:47:28 -0800 Message-ID: <000001bf6f59$6e3c95e0$8605193f@minnick> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2173.0 In-Reply-To: <3.0.6.32.20000204083944.00822560@pacific.net> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Importance: Normal Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Feeling stupid - again. I know it's Vance, too - sigh. In fact, he stopped by here one day out of the blue with his V-8 109! Pretty cool rig. Kelly Minnick > Kelly Minnick wrote: > > >Yes. Vince ... > > I remember all too well and even remember that it's Vance, not Vince. I > remember that Walt had the red 109 (now Joe's, right?) with chains on. > > Granny > From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Fri Feb 4 17:35:49 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id RAA21472 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Fri, 4 Feb 2000 17:35:49 -0500 From: "Kelly Minnick" To: Subject: RE: Hummer Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2000 13:50:59 -0800 Message-ID: <000101bf6f59$ec792cc0$8605193f@minnick> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2173.0 In-Reply-To: <03b501bf6f2c$6c764e40$214c1f18@hawaii.rr.com> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Importance: Normal Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org The early Civilian models also had the 6.2 (non-turbo). Many were swapping for a Chevy 350. I always thought they should have made the Civilian version a 3/4 scale version! I know the current versions are turbo'ed and probably intercooled. But at 6200 lbs, one does need a few ponies (not just torque) to pass, merge with trafic, etc. Kelly Minnick > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com > [mailto:owner-mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com]On Behalf Of Peter Hope > Sent: Friday, February 04, 2000 8:25 AM > To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com > Subject: Re: Hummer > > > > The early military versions had the GM 6.2 under the hood. The later > > military versions have the new and improved? 6.5 with WAY more > get up and > > go. I have never been in a civilian version. I'd think they would be a > > touch slower because of the emmisions/DOT stuff that had to be added. > This > > along with the weight from the solid doors etc. I guess(hope) > that we'll > > all get a chance to see for ourselves soon. > All of the Army ones I have driven have had goveners. I have never been > impressed with their get up and go on road, but that is not what they were > designed for. But they have a hell of a lot of power. Drove one once > carrying the companies weapons and towing a full water buffalo (trailer). > Was able to get up to 65 with out much problem. > Off road they shine. Have never had a load like the one just > mentioned, but > have had loaded up with people and 5000rds of ammo (5.56 & 7.62). > If I ever > won one, I would sell it quick. They are to big and heavy for my personal > tastes. Wouldn't mind having the engine/trany/xfer combo for a 130 > hybrid/camper though :-) > Pete > From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Fri Feb 4 19:27:50 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id TAA21541 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Fri, 4 Feb 2000 19:27:50 -0500 Message-Id: <200002050022.QAA27061@proxy4.ba.best.com> Comments: Authenticated sender is From: "Tom Walsh" To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2000 16:21:35 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Re: Hummer X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.31) Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Clarke, Why are you telling me this? Do you think I don't know? I wasn't even responding to you?!!! AND WE WEREN"T comparing year for year... stop being so nit pickity. ( and even if I was comparing, the military doesn't chuck out all there inventory each year.. so yes, there are still some old 6.2 ones around So the comparision was still valid Who cares? The world is NOT a contest of who can provide THE MOST bulk original or copied data to the list(s) ) Someone said they were slow ( James Howard ), I posted that the current civy models had a turbo and weren't slow as compared to then. Amen... drink water, not coffee, stop reading so many manuals :) TomW > Tom, > > At 11:06 AM 04-02-00 -0800, you wrote: > >As I said... > >miliary had smaller engine.. > >6.2 then to 6.5L > >Civilian is now 6.5L with turbo and intercooler, HUGE difference. > >but Non turbo is still a snail IMHO ( it will beat my series! and > >FC101 probably ) > >TomW > > As I said, Tom, the military uses the SAME SIZE ENGINE AS CIVILIAN. The heavier 12,500lb HMMWVs are even using turbos. > > Early civilian Hummers used 6.2L. Why? Simple ... the 6.5L was not invented yet. Early civilian Hummers were also NA diesels, not turbo. (yes, I know that AMG put gas engines in some few civilia > Hummers) > > Current production military and civilian Hummers and Humvees both use 6.5L. Period. There has NEVER been a difference in engine size between civilian and military Hummer/Humvee of the same model y > ar. PERIOD. > > > > Clarke Williams > > > *---------*---------* "Tonka" Truck, Lil Buggar, Lt Brigade, Posh,.. LandRovers "I love the smell of Null pointers in the morning" tomw@best.com, twalsh@redback.com From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Fri Feb 4 19:39:30 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id TAA21553 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Fri, 4 Feb 2000 19:39:30 -0500 Message-Id: <4.1.20000204163542.00be9e50@mail.halcyon.com> X-Sender: clarkebw@mail.halcyon.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.1 Date: Fri, 04 Feb 2000 16:36:28 -0800 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com From: Clarke Williams Subject: Re: Hummer In-Reply-To: <200002050022.QAA27061@proxy4.ba.best.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Tom, Sorry, it has been an "interesting" week. Didn't mean to ruffle your feathers. Clarke At 04:21 PM 04-02-00 -0800, you wrote: >Clarke, >Why are you telling me this? >Do you think I don't know? > >I wasn't even responding to you?!!! >AND WE WEREN"T comparing year for year... stop being so nit pickity. >( and even if I was comparing, the military doesn't chuck out all there >inventory each year.. so yes, there are still some old 6.2 ones around >So the comparision was still valid Who cares? The world is NOT a contest >of who can provide THE MOST bulk original or copied data to the >list(s) ) > >Someone said they were slow ( James Howard ), I posted that the current civy >models >had a turbo and weren't slow as compared to then. > >Amen... drink water, not coffee, stop reading so many manuals :) >TomW >> Tom, >> >> At 11:06 AM 04-02-00 -0800, you wrote: >> >As I said... >> >miliary had smaller engine.. >> >6.2 then to 6.5L >> >Civilian is now 6.5L with turbo and intercooler, HUGE difference. >> >but Non turbo is still a snail IMHO ( it will beat my series! and >> >FC101 probably ) >> >TomW >> >> As I said, Tom, the military uses the SAME SIZE ENGINE AS CIVILIAN. The >heavier 12,500lb HMMWVs are even using turbos. >> >> Early civilian Hummers used 6.2L. Why? Simple ... the 6.5L was not >invented yet. Early civilian Hummers were also NA diesels, not turbo. >(yes, I know that AMG put gas engines in some few civilia >> Hummers) >> >> Current production military and civilian Hummers and Humvees both use >6.5L. Period. There has NEVER been a difference in engine size between >civilian and military Hummer/Humvee of the same model y >> ar. PERIOD. >> >> >> >> Clarke Williams >> >> >> > *---------*---------* >"Tonka" Truck, Lil Buggar, Lt Brigade, Posh,.. LandRovers >"I love the smell of Null pointers in the morning" >tomw@best.com, twalsh@redback.com From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Fri Feb 4 21:22:57 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id VAA21600 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Fri, 4 Feb 2000 21:22:57 -0500 Message-ID: <389B8804.C2C0C6DB@slip.net> Date: Fri, 04 Feb 2000 18:16:36 -0800 From: Jeremy Bartlett X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en]C-CCK-MCD NSCPCD47 (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: mendo recce Subject: 3rd NCRC Rally Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Just an early note for those planning to participate that the next NCRC rally will be held on the first weekend (Sat.and Sun.) in November. That should be the 4th and 5th. Jeremy From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Fri Feb 4 21:23:39 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id VAA21610 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Fri, 4 Feb 2000 21:23:39 -0500 Message-ID: <389B8880.A4E09442@slip.net> Date: Fri, 04 Feb 2000 18:18:40 -0800 From: Jeremy Bartlett X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en]C-CCK-MCD NSCPCD47 (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com Subject: Jim Lives was Re: TTT50 References: <3.0.5.32.20000204111107.008e5390@uxsfo4> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Jim Russell wrote: > For those interested in such trivia, the other day the Turner turned fifty > (K) and 1,500.4 running (oil pressure) hours while passing Boeing Field on > the way to work. Jim! long time no hear. Glad to see you're still around up north; any plans to meet up on the July 4 PCRC/NCRC trip? Jeremy From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Sat Feb 5 00:38:59 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id AAA22281 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Sat, 5 Feb 2000 00:38:59 -0500 From: "Worldwide Rovers" To: Subject: stuck in third Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2000 21:30:23 -0800 Message-ID: <000001bf6f9a$19ea5ea0$9d2564d8@com.humboldt1.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2232.26 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <200002042231.OAA19655@moab.off-road.com> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Gerry....I had this problem all the time with my Series 1. If you pull up the plate on the transmission tunnel that the yellow knobbed lever passes through you should find that the gear change lever is stuck between two shaft assemblies (first/second and third/fourth). I found I could slide back the appropriate shaft assembly with some needle nose pliers and everything was fine for a month or so - then SOS. The basic problem was that the detent ball was corroded and was not dropping down and holding the 3/4 shaft assembly firmly. Therefore the 3/4 shaft would just move easily and jam up when you shifted. If you remove the detent ball, clean it, clean/hone the shaft and possibly replace the spring it should no longer happen. Since I did this -- no more hang-up problems. Good luck. Clark Bowen From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Sat Feb 5 02:38:08 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id CAA22309 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Sat, 5 Feb 2000 02:38:08 -0500 Message-Id: <200002050735.XAA00021@smtp.Stanford.EDU> X-Sender: waycool@popserver.stanford.edu Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2000 23:33:07 -0800 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com From: waycool@leland.Stanford.EDU (Rich Lee MD) Subject: Re: Mendo_Recce digest: V2 #905 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org ------------------------- Clarke, Just after I hit the send button, I was thinking about how you would respond. My first reply is "Relax". >Marcinko was a damn good leader and special warfare operative. He was not >>merely "training SEALS" -- he was the Team Leader and responsible for their >>performance. He was also the Plank CO of SEAL Team 6 and the 8th CO of SEAL >>Team 2. (If you don't know what a Plank member is, you are already out of >your >depth) I do know what a plank member is and I have a lot of respect for Marcinko (not so much his ghost writer). If didn't, I would not have plugged his book. The "macho" comment comes from the steroid-dipping wanna-bees who read his book and suddenly think that because they can bench 500 lbs and have a private arsenal they can be like him (or better). I keep forgetting that I am responding to a more mature and experienced list here. I also post a lot (medical answers) to a list for high school kids and I don't always switch into "High Range" when composing my response. For some reason, I have a lot of patients and a few friends who were members of SEAL teams or other special forces. Many did not get well-deserved treatment (or medical care) from their government, for all they went through. They stick with me because I do appreciate what they have experienced (even though I have never dodged bullets from foreign hostiles, just a few from drunken yahoos, in Jeeps) and I allow them both permission and time to deal with what's hurting them. > >Training missions for NAVSPECWARGRP involving various vulnerable (or perceived >>so) targets have been "fair game" for spec-ops since the '60's -- and still >are. > >Marcinko's over-the-line issues that forced him from the service were much >more >along the lines of "drunken bar fights and civilians in hospital" and >similar >than "unauthorized training missions". That together with Mercedes >580SEs for >most of the members of TEAM-6 (and later Red Cell) and various >other "military >vehicles" purchased under his authorization led him to his >well deserved >demise. An average cost of $1.5 million per man per year is >beyond even the >SEALS norms. These were the "operational tactics" and "embarassment" (mainly financial) to which I was referring. By the way, $1.5 mil is also the alleged compensation one of our CEOs received to devise a merger that fell apart and generated $70 million in debt. That IS embarassing. Besides I'm jelous of Marcinko's allowance for vehicles and ammo. >The US Navy's Special Warfare Command has some of the finest people that have >>ever served our country - today, yesterday and tomorrow. Agreed, that's why I enjoy taking care of them. They learned to think "outside the box". Unfortunately, many are also in chronic pain from injuries too long ignored (both physical and psychological). >Marcinko is not a good example of how the Navy conducts Special Warfare - then >>or now. A brilliant Operator, yes. A skillful warrior, yes. An example of >>Navy Leadership, NOT. My kind of guy, I'd love to party with him, but I think it would hurt too much. >You folks live in California. There are plenty of TEAM mates in and around >San >Diego. ASK THEM what they think of Marcinko. They are in northern CA as well, and I always ask them. They say he is for real, but the book comes off as portraying TEAM 6 as a bit too invinceable (even though careful reading of his book shows them not to be). >Drop a dime to call the CO of NavSpecWarGrp -- his name is Captain William H. >>Raven (unless he has been promoted since I last spoke with him.) Simply call >>information for SEAL Teams at Coronado and ask for the CO. It may surprise >you >but you WILL be connected. The TEAMs are kinda like that. I know they are. I'd like to hire them for attitude adjustment in the health care industry, and to "advocate" for my patients. > >The TEAMS are not civilians nor "typical" military. Be careful before ye >>judge or pass along misinformatsia. Marcinko is not an example of the TEAMS' >>best. I don't care how good his books (ghost-written) read. Already knew that from others. Also, I try not to Judge anyone (doesn't keep me from calling them names though). > >P.S. I also have qualms about your choice of "our leaders wisely opted not to >>enter ... [via] the back berm". I have already addressed this. CALL THE >C.O. >BEFORE HAND! Doo-oh! Of course we should have called the C.O. . As I understand, in all past trips (unofficial recce, few rigs, open gates and/or clear bypasses) it wasn't neccessary. The "wisdom" was in their tactful way of diffusing our collective lust (you know what mob mentality can be like) to enter the fort, by a route that created no problems/conflicts on past trips. Regardless (and I repeat), a good time was had that day by a lot of good people in good Rovers. Whatever else is said on this list, I think that is what we are all aiming for. Rover On (bare minimum rover content) Rich P.S. I may not share all your views, probably share more than you think, but I'd rather buy you a beer (or Ambien or Vioxx or Viagra) than give you qualms or make you personally uncomfortable. From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Sat Feb 5 11:56:35 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id LAA22732 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Sat, 5 Feb 2000 11:56:35 -0500 From: GElam30092@aol.com Message-ID: <84.10b1a94.25cdaf3b@aol.com> Date: Sat, 5 Feb 2000 11:52:11 EST Subject: Re: stuck in third To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 45 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org In a message dated 2/4/00 10:37:36 PM US Mountain Standard Time, wwrover@humboldt1.com writes: << I found I could slide back the appropriate shaft assembly with some needle nose pliers and everything was fine for a month or so - then SOS. >> Good deal..... that's kind of the lines that I was thinking. Something was jamming up versus something actually wrong with the transmission itself. I'll take a look at this tomorrow! Thanks again. Gerry From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Sat Feb 5 14:02:06 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id OAA22836 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Sat, 5 Feb 2000 14:02:06 -0500 Message-ID: <389C7233.D8E526FD@thelen.org> Date: Sat, 05 Feb 2000 10:56:22 -0800 From: Leslie Dow Organization: Mine, Not Yours X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 (Macintosh; I; PPC) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com Subject: Update on theThe poop on the....Spotted: Series PU for sale in Palo Alto References: <20000112002229.29127.qmail@web705.mail.yahoo.com> <387CA295.58DE3BCC@thelen.org> <387D03E6.6FB7CB17@thelen.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org So this morning Chris goes out to scrape the goop off Guildenstern(from the mud run) and finds this note on Rosencrantz from the guy with the IIa ....Dropped the price from $8500 to $7500 to $5000...going back to nevada on Tuesday and wants to selll.. (remeber its not how much you spend its how much you save) 650-493-7330 ...guess it didn't move for $8000 in the merc, eh? leslie Leslie Dow wrote: > > So I called the number and talked to the owner. A Guy named Paul who > works at BJ Bull there in the shopping Center. > He is planning to put it in the paper on friday for $8500 but he will > take $7500 for it now. Here is the scoop... > -it is configured now as a station wagon *but* it also has a full length > Tropical top > -it is a 67 IIa that was owned by an old miner in Lovelock Nevada > -he claims it only has 67K miles on it but when pushed said that he did > not know for sure if the odometer had turned over. > -the old guy in Lovelock put either a new gearbox or transfer case in it > recently he was not sure > -it presently has non-functioning brake lights..(imagine that!) :-) > -it also has an exhaust leak in the manifold > -it is not tagged in Calif.!!!! but he says that he has a clear title... > > he sounds pretty anxious to sell... > > "Christopher H. Dow" wrote: > > > > It was priced at $8500 last week. I tried to go look at it with Ben > > Mitchell last night, but the vehicle wasn't there. It was t here > > earlier when I came back from getting dinner. Hence I believe it runs. > > > > C > > > > KC wrote: > > > > > > --- Kelly Minnick wrote: > > > > How much? > > > > > > > > George Cooper > > > > > In case anybody is interested I saw a short wheelbase series > > > > > pickup for sale > > > > > in the parking lot of the Lucky on Alma, just north of Meadow in > > > > > Palo Alto. > > > > > I only saw it as I went by, but it looked like a Series II or > > > > > III. It was a > > > > > grey color with a cab but no cover over the bed. > > > > > > I checked it out this AM and here's what I saw: > > > '67 Series II (I think) 88" Pick Up > > > Tropical Roof > > > spare tyre mount on bonnet > > > very worn blue > > > very worn tires, stock size I think--look like it's been sitting awhile > > > Nevada plates > > > well used, many small dents, no significant body damamge > > > no visible rust but it was raining and I was on the way to work so I > > > didn't roll underneath > > > center diff. seems to have a leak > > > seats look pretty good, except those in the bed are well worn > > > frame looks good > > > aftermarket tach. > > > no price, "b/o" #493-7330 > > > KC > > > __________________________________________________ > > > Do You Yahoo!? > > > Talk to your friends online with Yahoo! Messenger. > > > http://im.yahoo.com From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Sat Feb 5 14:56:26 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id OAA22922 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Sat, 5 Feb 2000 14:56:26 -0500 Message-ID: <389C808B.7CCC94E1@wenet.net> Date: Sat, 05 Feb 2000 11:56:59 -0800 From: "Bruce R. Bonar" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com Subject: Re: Good ol' days References: <000401bf6f5b$b29e7760$8605193f@minnick> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Yup, many great memories. Kelly Minnick wrote: > I > think a spring desert trip would be nice through Cerro Gorto, Saline, etc. Let's do it! If you plan, the Rovers will come. Bruce From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Sat Feb 5 15:09:35 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id PAA22996 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Sat, 5 Feb 2000 15:09:35 -0500 Message-ID: <389C83A6.F095EDA5@wenet.net> Date: Sat, 05 Feb 2000 12:10:14 -0800 From: "Bruce R. Bonar" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com Subject: Re: TTT50 References: <3.0.5.32.20000204111107.008e5390@uxsfo4> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Jim, Good to hear from you. Articles are always welcome for the newsletter, so start writing. Are we going to see you at Team Trophy cheering the NCRC teams on? Bruce Jim Russell wrote: > For those interested in such trivia, the other day the Turner turned fifty > (K) and 1,500.4 running (oil pressure) hours while passing Boeing Field on > the way to work. At one time I thought I might try to write up a little > something for the NCRC newsletter regarding my experiences with it up to > some significant point such as this but ended up deciding it would be > pretty uninteresting ('cept maybe for some of the stuff as to how it came > about). > > I know that there have recently been some negative threads on Turners but > my experience has been, at worst, uneventful and, at best, very good. Zero > problems, very good performance. From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Sat Feb 5 15:14:25 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id PAA23014 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Sat, 5 Feb 2000 15:14:25 -0500 Message-ID: <389C819D.287C0237@earthlink.net> Date: Sat, 05 Feb 2000 12:01:33 -0800 From: "Franklin H. Yap" X-Sender: "Franklin H. Yap" <@mail.earthlink.net> (Unverified) X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en]C-FLASHNET (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com Subject: Re: Good ol' days References: <000401bf6f5b$b29e7760$8605193f@minnick> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Kelly Minnick wrote: > ... U-bolt problems. I've got some great > pictures that haven't been posted anywhere(YET)... I've got a bunch of photos too ... somewhere. Frank From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Sat Feb 5 15:19:44 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id PAA23024 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Sat, 5 Feb 2000 15:19:44 -0500 Message-ID: <389C8616.CD67846A@wenet.net> Date: Sat, 05 Feb 2000 12:20:38 -0800 From: "Bruce R. Bonar" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com Subject: Re: Foster in Frisco References: <20000204073729.CZPC1148.mta05.onebox.com@onebox.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Brian Foster wrote: > Well... you read my message properly. I am planning on driving up during > the 14th and I was planning on driving home the 18th (I get booted out > of the hotel that AM). I will consider staying for the meeting and driving > home that Saturday AM, but I'll need a place to stay. Brian, you're welcome to stay with Stephanie and me in San Carlos after the meeting on Friday the 18th. The agenda for the NCRC meeting is discussion of land use issues and what position the club should take, if any. And how politically involved we should be. We're also discussing the July 4 trip with the PCRC and possible trip locations for the coming year. We're also looking for input on a 2001 NCRC trip to Moab. Anyone want to volunteer to pull and replace a half-shaft for show and tell? Bruce Bonar From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Sat Feb 5 16:47:43 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id QAA23046 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Sat, 5 Feb 2000 16:47:43 -0500 Message-ID: <389C9AA8.D37911CB@wenet.net> Date: Sat, 05 Feb 2000 13:48:24 -0800 From: "Bruce R. Bonar" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com Subject: Good ole days References: <200002020147.RAA18305@wizard.sp.gap.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org So John or Granville, or any other of the remaining original recce members. Why not write an article for the NCRC newsletter about the start of the No Cal rover group. Both mendo and the NCRC. It seems like only yesterday that Charlie and the rental SHO were part of the trip. Same with the Panamint trip with Kelly and Brian. I'm not sure Teri Ann has forgiven us yet for drinking wine and smoking cigars as she did her field repair only to pack up to leave before she had a chance to relax. There have been alot of miles driven over the last 6 years with many folks and wonderful memories. Bruce john hess wrote: > >Hmmm... now sounds more like a Porsche 911 Carrera 4 convertible. > >BUT, if that's the case4, isn't that actually a 92.6" wheelbase? > >Surely you wouldn't be THAT FAR OFF, would you? > > Well, > > now that the cat's out of the bag, I want to know if the C4 is as > capable as the Taurus SHO off road. (remember the SHO and the duufus > owner we found on the back roads of Mendo 3-4 years ago? He was > taking a short cut, and spent the night in his car, unable to climb > the slippery mud hills out.) > > Who remembers this besides me an Walt Swain? > > cheers, > > John F. Hess, Davis California jfhess@dcn.davis.ca.us > Land Rover Dormobile web pages: > http://wheel.dcn.davis.ca.us/~jfhess/homepage.html > 1968 Land Rover Dormobile "Elvis" 1960 Land Rover 88 PU "Stubby" > 1966 Mercury Monterey "Tillie" From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Sat Feb 5 16:53:49 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id QAA23078 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Sat, 5 Feb 2000 16:53:49 -0500 Message-Id: <200002052152.QAA13960@blacker.gdbg.org> To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com Subject: Re: Good ole days In-Reply-To: Your message of "Sat, 05 Feb 2000 13:48:24 PST." <389C9AA8.D37911CB@wenet.net> Date: Sat, 05 Feb 2000 13:52:29 -0800 From: Benjamin Allan Smith Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org In message <389C9AA8.D37911CB@wenet.net>you wrote: > It seems like only yesterday that Charlie and the rental SHO were part > of the trip. Same with the Panamint trip with Kelly and Brian. I'm not > sure Teri Ann has forgiven us yet for drinking wine and smoking cigars > as she did her field repair only to pack up to leave before she had a > chance to relax. There have been alot of miles driven over the last 6 > years with many folks and wonderful memories. http://www.fourfold.org/mendo_recce_stories/ The 1st and 2nd destert trips are LRDG and LRGD_II PPMGC the Pink Panther Memorial Gate Crash at Hollister Hills The original mud run the SudsTriangle and the next year Suds II Showing up at Hayward all muddy: Yahoo_Hayward The Palo Alto field meet that first year. Ben From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Sat Feb 5 20:14:36 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id UAA23236 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Sat, 5 Feb 2000 20:14:36 -0500 From: GElam30092@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Sat, 5 Feb 2000 20:11:32 EST Subject: AZ LRO site...... To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 45 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Terry West of the AZ LRO has started a web page for the club. There's a video (Real-player) of Darrell going up one of the more difficult trails. That's all there is on the page but it's a good start by Terry. Take a look...... Gerry PHX AZ From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Sat Feb 5 21:28:03 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id VAA23311 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Sat, 5 Feb 2000 21:28:03 -0500 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Sender: rlarson@mail.dsldesigns.com Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <200002052152.QAA13960@blacker.gdbg.org> References: <200002052152.QAA13960@blacker.gdbg.org> Date: Sat, 5 Feb 2000 18:23:20 -0800 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com From: Rick Larson Subject: Re: Good ole days Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org >In message <389C9AA8.D37911CB@wenet.net>you wrote: > > > It seems like only yesterday that Charlie and the rental SHO were part > > of the trip. Same with the Panamint trip with Kelly and Brian. I'm not > > sure Teri Ann has forgiven us yet for drinking wine and smoking cigars > > as she did her field repair only to pack up to leave before she had a > > chance to relax. There have been alot of miles driven over the last 6 > > years with many folks and wonderful memories. > >http://www.fourfold.org/mendo_recce_stories/ > >The 1st and 2nd destert trips are LRDG and LRGD_II > >PPMGC the Pink Panther Memorial Gate Crash at Hollister Hills > >The original mud run the SudsTriangle and the next year Suds II > >Showing up at Hayward all muddy: Yahoo_Hayward > >The Palo Alto field meet that first year. > >Ben The first Mendo Mojave Rd trip and the Panamint trip stand out as classic long range Rover type trips. -Rick -Rick Rick Larson rlarson@dsldesigns.com From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Sat Feb 5 22:44:19 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id WAA23385 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Sat, 5 Feb 2000 22:44:19 -0500 From: GElam30092@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Sat, 5 Feb 2000 22:41:51 EST Subject: Re: Good ole days To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 45 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org In a message dated 2/5/00 7:27:19 PM US Mountain Standard Time, rlarson@dsldesigns.com writes: << The first Mendo Mojave Rd trip and the Panamint trip stand out as classic long range Rover type trips. >> I'm not sure when the first Mojave trip was but I was in the late '95 version with Rick, Ben/his friend and Jim Holmes/friend. I drove up from PHX and managed to find Jim and his girlfriend. Later on, we heard Ben calling on the radio. Some time that night, Rick rolled in after getting a late start from Safari Gard..... I think. I will never forget waking up and finding Rick there. I can't believe that I slept through his arrival since he had quite a few watts of light on his D-90! And, if I remember correctly, Ben slept on top of his SIII. What a good group of folks! Cheers, Gerry From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Sat Feb 5 23:09:15 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id XAA23409 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Sat, 5 Feb 2000 23:09:15 -0500 From: "Kelly Minnick" To: Subject: RE: Good ol' days Date: Sat, 5 Feb 2000 20:11:38 -0800 Message-ID: <000001bf7058$438229a0$3705193f@minnick> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2173.0 In-Reply-To: <389C808B.7CCC94E1@wenet.net> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Importance: Normal Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Hmm. Sounds like a movie in the making! Kelly Minnick > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com > [mailto:owner-mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com]On Behalf Of Bruce R. Bonar > Sent: Saturday, February 05, 2000 11:57 AM > To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com > Subject: Re: Good ol' days > > > Yup, many great memories. > > Kelly Minnick wrote: > > > I > > think a spring desert trip would be nice through Cerro Gorto, > Saline, etc. > > Let's do it! If you plan, the Rovers will come. > > Bruce > > From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Sat Feb 5 23:38:39 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id XAA23422 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Sat, 5 Feb 2000 23:38:39 -0500 Message-ID: <05b701bf7055$00b5aaa0$214c1f18@hawaii.rr.com> From: "Peter Hope" To: References: Subject: Re: AZ LRO site...... Date: Sat, 5 Feb 2000 17:48:17 -1000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org what's the url? ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Saturday, February 05, 2000 15:11 Subject: AZ LRO site...... > Terry West of the AZ LRO has started a web page for the club. There's a > video (Real-player) of Darrell going up one of the more difficult trails. > That's all there is on the page but it's a good start by Terry. > > Take a look...... > Gerry > PHX AZ From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Sat Feb 5 23:56:30 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id XAA23434 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Sat, 5 Feb 2000 23:56:30 -0500 From: GElam30092@aol.com Message-ID: <39.e33fc0.25ce584c@aol.com> Date: Sat, 5 Feb 2000 23:53:32 EST Subject: Re: AZ LRO site...... To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 45 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org In a message dated 2/5/00 9:37:07 PM US Mountain Standard Time, phope@hawaii.rr.com writes: << what's the url? >> Duh... sorry about that! www.azlro.org Cheers, Gerry From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Sun Feb 6 01:59:50 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id BAA24067 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Sun, 6 Feb 2000 01:59:50 -0500 Message-Id: <3.0.1.32.20000205225451.006e6f0c@pacific.net> X-Sender: gpool@pacific.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.1 (32) Date: Sat, 05 Feb 2000 22:54:51 -0800 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com From: Granville Pool Subject: Re: Good ole days In-Reply-To: <389C9AA8.D37911CB@wenet.net> References: <200002020147.RAA18305@wizard.sp.gap.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Bruce Bonar wrote: >So John or Granville, or any other of the remaining original recce >members. Why not write an article for the NCRC newsletter about the >start of the No Cal rover group. Both mendo and the NCRC. I think I wrote a version of that story for the Aluminum Workhorse at the time. I looked in my electronic archives and it's still there. I have photos, too, of course, maybe even scanned ones. I also still have archived my original postings on the LRO and/or mendo_recce list of those first two recces, before the first notarallye. I'll see if I can put something together by the 15th but work problems may make that somewhat difficult. Cheers, Granny From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Sun Feb 6 01:59:56 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id BAA24077 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Sun, 6 Feb 2000 01:59:56 -0500 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Sender: rlarson@mail.dsldesigns.com Message-Id: In-Reply-To: References: Date: Sat, 5 Feb 2000 22:54:37 -0800 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com From: Rick Larson Subject: Re: Good ole days Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Yup, that trip was the one I was thinking about! -Rick >In a message dated 2/5/00 7:27:19 PM US Mountain Standard Time, >rlarson@dsldesigns.com writes: > ><< The first Mendo Mojave Rd trip and the Panamint trip stand out as > classic long range Rover type trips. >> > >I'm not sure when the first Mojave trip was but I was in the late '95 version >with Rick, Ben/his friend and Jim Holmes/friend. I drove up from PHX and >managed to find Jim and his girlfriend. Later on, we heard Ben calling on >the radio. Some time that night, Rick rolled in after getting a late start >from Safari Gard..... I think. > >I will never forget waking up and finding Rick there. I can't believe that I >slept through his arrival since he had quite a few watts of light on his >D-90! And, if I remember correctly, Ben slept on top of his SIII. > >What a good group of folks! > >Cheers, >Gerry -Rick Rick Larson rlarson@dsldesigns.com From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Sun Feb 6 02:22:11 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id CAA24092 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Sun, 6 Feb 2000 02:22:11 -0500 Message-ID: <002401bf706b$a0f84520$214c1f18@hawaii.rr.com> From: "Peter Hope" To: References: Subject: Re: Timm Coopers latest... Date: Sat, 5 Feb 2000 20:30:14 -1000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Michael, I love the pics. You mention that there's more to follow, would love to see some more details of the 1/4 eliptics and the spring over on the front. Pete From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Sun Feb 6 09:45:52 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id JAA24544 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Sun, 6 Feb 2000 09:45:52 -0500 Message-Id: <200002061444.GAA09676@blackie.cruzers.com> Subject: Re: AZ LRO site...... Date: Sun, 6 Feb 00 06:47:40 -0800 x-sender: twakeman@mail.cruzers.com x-mailer: Claris Emailer 2.0, March 15, 1997 From: TeriAnn Wakeman To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Gerry, I'll add a link to the new club site from my personal site if you are willing to tell us the URL. >Terry West of the AZ LRO has started a web page for the club. There's a >video (Real-player) of Darrell going up one of the more difficult trails. >That's all there is on the page but it's a good start by Terry. > >Take a look...... Is the location a secret? >Gerry >PHX AZ > TeriAnn http://www.overlander.net The world's most complete set of links connecting Rover 4X4 owners with Rover parts, service, accessory & sales companies world wide. From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Sun Feb 6 12:37:35 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id MAA24682 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Sun, 6 Feb 2000 12:37:35 -0500 Mime-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: Date: Sun, 6 Feb 2000 09:30:00 -0800 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com From: john hess Subject: good ol' days [reposting] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org from the depths of my email program: Our own Granville Pool provides a recapping of a Mendo Recce in 1995: From: gpool@pacific.pacific.net (Granville B. Pool) Reply-To: mendo_recce@owens.ridgecrest.ca.us Resent-Date: Sat Apr 1 08:58:22 PST 1995 Subject: Snow Run One; Part 2 Status: O X-Status: Whoa! Before you read Part 2, there's some stuff I gotta add to Part 1: I can't believe I had forgotten this! Actually I had written Part 2 and then thought I should go pick up my photographs before I send it out, to see if the photos might jog my memory for any corrections and additions. And, sure enough, there were things I'd forgotten. Gotta take notes next time (maybe I can borrow Jory's laptop and write in real time). Back at the beginning of the story, when we went up Elk Mountain Road and stopped at the turn-off for Bear Creek Road, there was a little incident that has to be recounted. The last two Land-Rovers in line, coming up the mountain, were Vance and Jason. As Vance pulled off the road to park behind the other vehicles, he pulled off into the ditch, against the snowbank, and got stuck!! What makes this especially embarrassing for Vance is that he was the one, you'll recall, on the previous run, who got the "worst stuck" award on the slipnslide hill in the mud at night. You guessed it, into the ditch, against the bank!! But Vance is cool, he was the one who said that he seemed to like to do that. I've got some nice photos of Jason pulling Vance out, backwards. Gotta nice shot of Bruce and Walt pouring over the quad maps on the bonnet of the Defender 90, before we started down that fateful trail. Really nice one, too, Gerry, of you and Bob standing helplessly by, watching Walt put your Land-Rover in the ditch [heh, heh]. And Vance, Morgan, and Jim solving Morgan's vapor lock... And now, Part 2: Into the soup: We couldn't just stand around on the gravel bar, admiring each others' Land-Rovers, appeasing the hungry giant, and aswaging the vapor lock forever. We had to either get across the Rice Fork so the over-nighters could make camp at Bear Creek or turn around and get out of there so we could find another camp before dark. Morgan pulled on his hip-wellies, grabbed a stick, and wandered out into the semi-likely-looking part of the stream. He found that it was shallow for most of its width, just upstream from where we had the Rovers lined up. But right against the far bank was the main channel and it was too deep to test without getting water into his boots. John Hess had a set of chest-high waders (good thinking, John, especially since Jory didn't come along this time--no one else was willing to strip off and wade into the snow-melt water). So John put on his waders and went back out to find a route. He found that the deep part of the channel wasn't too bad in one spot, right at the mouth of a small brook. It appeared that we could go up the far bank there and veer left toward the forest road with minimal tresspass. I dare say that Vance had every expectation that he would get to try out his "new" winch (if you haven't seen Vance's sano installation, you should). He got his Rover into position and Morgan reeled out enough cable to hitch to Walt's Toy. I estimated the distance to be a leettle far for Vance's winch cable so added my heavy tow cable/chain which added about another 25-30 feet of length (should have been more...). We hooked Walt up and off he went. As he charged up the far bank, Vance began to panic, watching his winch cable winding off to the last few wraps on the drum. He waved his arms and yelled frantically but to no avail (I have a photo of this!). All our yelling could not get Walt's attention, he was that intent on simply making it up the bank. Just NOT a place to stop. Fortunately, he got stopped just before the cable ran out completely and yanked Vance's Land-Rover out from under him! This first success encouraged the rest of us (well, some of us). I believe Jason went next and also had no problems. Next was Ben, with his rear weighted down with the extra engine. I don't know if that is to blame or his very blown head gasket. But he stalled out and had to get pulled out by Walt (how embarrassing). Well, with Ben now in place with his winch on the far bank and Vance still ready on the near one, I figured it was time for me to try to "Dodge the ford" or something like that. Mostly, I wanted to get to the other side so I could get some close-ups of the bad part of the ford before everybody was across. Also just wanted to get this over with. Boy was I wishing I had my Land-Rover. I knew that I should have gone out with Gerry, that my Dodge was out of its league here. But it was only 3:00 P.M. when Gerry and Bob left I didn't want to be left out. Off I went; I didn't make it. In retrospect, my planning and general thinking were inexcusably poor. I attribute it to sleep deprivation. It's not like I haven't done plenty of fording in my time. I had worked 14 hours on my Land-Rover the day before. I had put the head back on and gotten it all together and running beautifully. But when I had gone to town [in the Land-Rover] for supplies for the weekend, my water temp gauge had shot up into the red and stayed there. I really didn't believe it but didn't want to chance cooking my $600 cylinder head job. Since it was after midnight, I just had to give up. I had tried, valiantly, to get my Rover ready and had failed. Damme! So I was stuck with Dodge or no go (didn't really consider riding with someone else; why not, Granville?). In any case, after all those hours of wrenching and about 3.5 hours sleep, I just wasn't thinking too clearly (some say I never am). I had looked under the hood of the Dodge to see how my electrical system would fare and--incredibly--did not consider the air intake! Damn thing has a hose from the air cleaner to the grille and THIS dummy did not think to relocate it. I had seen that my distributor was at the top of the rear of the engine and so out of harm's way. But that air intake, about 30" off the ground is what got me. It took a big ol' gulp of creek swill and promptly died. Of course I didn't realize that it had inhaled the water. I just thought it was wet plugs or something. So I tried to restart the engine and it wouldn't turn over at all. Here, again, I had the wrong idea and thought that was because of the starter's being under water. WRONG! Another big-time lack of planning was failure to get a tow strap tied on before starting across the river. Duhhhhh. Stoopid Dodge has no hooks or loops on the front. Have to tie to the forged A-arms. Try doing that in three feet of water!! John and Morgan were trying frantically to get me tied on but how? Well, PhDs are good for something! The clever fellows opened the hood so they could see from above what was happening below, as they reached the end of the tow stap under the bumper, to the A-arm. Then, by reaching in from above, they were able to tie it on. Great work fellows!! I really never thanked them properly (like by giving them all the rest of my supply of ale and stout). They hooked the strap to Walt's Toy and Walt snatched me from the soup and well up and out of the way. I opened my door and out rushed a flood of water, which by then was about 5 or 6 inches deep in my cab and had been pouring in through the speaker grilles in the doors. Of course all my food was on the floor. While I had been waiting to get pulled out, I had picked up the food bags (which were on the floor, of course) to try to dump the water from them out the window. Oops!! There went my extra sandwich (dinner) and carton of yogurt (breakfast), merrily floating away!!! And now I was facing the prospect of an unintended overnight stay with dwindling (and perhaps much-damaged) tucker. As I squeegeed water out of my footwells with my hands (with lots of help from Mother Walt who was very concerned about me) and wondered if my engine would ever run again, I asked myself, "Hey, stoopid, why in the *($&()&*^ didn't you go out with Gerry like you knew you should?" My wife was expecting me home that night (sort of, actually she knows me better than that) and now look what I had done!! Several attempts at restarting the engine yielded the same result: Nothing. So I did the only sensible thing; I ignored it awhile and grabbed my camera to go capture the trials of some of the remaining fools. Along about then, Jim was trying to cross. He'll have to tell you exactly what went so wrong but he got into even worse trouble than I did! It seems that his Land-Rover was a bit more boyant than some of the other vehicles and floated off downstream into a hole that was a good three feet deep or more. Where my Dodge got choked was maybe 24-30" or so, judging from the photos. Jim was really in a serious hole, with the creek flowing OVER his bonnet!! Yes, Jim, I got some terrific fotos of your floundering, sinking, and recovery. Again, no strap previously attached so delays while something was hooked up to Ben's winch. A worry, with Jim's Rover in so deep, was that trying to winch it out at the necessary angle could cause it to flip over and really get sunk. But Vance came over and positioned his Land-Rover straight ahead of Jim's and hooked his winch to it. Another lead was hooked to Ben's winch. With a very smooth, coordinated, team effort, it came out O.K. Camel Trophy, eat your heart out!! Boy, I wish I'd had a video recorder for that episode! Bruce came across next. Hey, if I'd been sitting there with a new D90, I'd have taken a while to screw up the courage to "baptise" it, too. No worries, that's what they are built for, more so than the Series rigs, I dare say. Then Morgan got ready to cross. Morgan was pretty worried about his rig's chances for success, due to its having a Chevy 6 installed. Certain components are apparently much more vulnerable than on the Land-Rover engines. He covered his grille with a plastic tarp and forged ahead; success!! Finally we had all gotten across. Now we had to try to get the two drowned engines resuscitated. Mine still wouldn't start and Vance said I'd better pull my sparkplugs. WHAT? Yeah, it gradually dawned on me (duhhh), the starter could not budge it because my combustion chambers were full of water. Now I was REALLY depressed. A fellow at work had his engine destroyed that way (by his teenage son)! What a mess I had made!!! We (Walt, mostly, I was so tired, depressed, and useless) pulled the plugs all out. Vance decided to lean under the hood to watch what would happen when I cranked it over with the starter. WHOOSH!!! It shot fountains of water maybe 10 or 15 feet out to the sides; most spectacular!! Unfortunately for Vance, it also shot a whole lot of this yucky, petrol-laced water right into his conveniently positioned face. Thank God he was wearing glasses!! I bet he'll remember this episode fully as long as I will! Everyone: Thanks, thanks, and more thanks for all your help in rescuing me. What a grand team you are and how lucky we all are to have such friends and co-conspirators!!! I owe everyone, big time and promise not to forget. After some very well-earned vapor lock [note: my photos reveal that the vapor lock session was while Morgan was getting ready to cross--we just couldn't wait for him], we set off for the Bear Creek campground, about a mile or so away. Just up from the river, we came to the junction of M-10 and M-3 (which was where the Snivellers convoy turned north on the 1987 trip). As we approached that intersection, we found that the road we were on was blocked by a barracade which said "Road Closed" to those coming from the other way (yeah, right). NOW they tell us!! In Part 3, you'll see how Walt, John, and I faired on our attempt to continue on out to the east, toward Stonyford, in some SERIOUS snow, after leaving the overnighters to set up their camp by the rushing Bear Creek... John F. Hess, Davis California jfhess@dcn.davis.ca.us Land Rover Dormobile web pages: http://wheel.dcn.davis.ca.us/~jfhess/homepage.html 1968 Land Rover Dormobile "Elvis" 1960 Land Rover 88 PU "Stubby" 1966 Mercury Monterey "Tillie" From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Sun Feb 6 12:37:37 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id MAA24696 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Sun, 6 Feb 2000 12:37:37 -0500 Mime-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <389C9AA8.D37911CB@wenet.net> References: <200002020147.RAA18305@wizard.sp.gap.com> <389C9AA8.D37911CB@wenet.net> Date: Sun, 6 Feb 2000 09:30:12 -0800 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com From: john hess Subject: Re: Good ole days Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org I'll see what sort of documentation I have for the original recce's. I know some of this stuff made it into print in the Aluminum Workhorse, but a history lesson for the NCRC club would be a great idea. cheers, >So John or Granville, or any other of the remaining original recce >members. Why not write an article for the NCRC newsletter about the >start of the No Cal rover group. Both mendo and the NCRC. > >It seems like only yesterday that Charlie and the rental SHO were part >of the trip. Same with the Panamint trip with Kelly and Brian. I'm not >sure Teri Ann has forgiven us yet for drinking wine and smoking cigars >as she did her field repair only to pack up to leave before she had a >chance to relax. There have been alot of miles driven over the last 6 >years with many folks and wonderful memories. > >Bruce > >john hess wrote: > > > >Hmmm... now sounds more like a Porsche 911 Carrera 4 convertible. > > >BUT, if that's the case4, isn't that actually a 92.6" wheelbase? > > >Surely you wouldn't be THAT FAR OFF, would you? > > > > Well, > > > > now that the cat's out of the bag, I want to know if the C4 is as > > capable as the Taurus SHO off road. (remember the SHO and the duufus > > owner we found on the back roads of Mendo 3-4 years ago? He was > > taking a short cut, and spent the night in his car, unable to climb > > the slippery mud hills out.) > > > > Who remembers this besides me an Walt Swain? > > > > cheers, > > > > John F. Hess, Davis California jfhess@dcn.davis.ca.us > > Land Rover Dormobile web pages: > > http://wheel.dcn.davis.ca.us/~jfhess/homepage.html > > 1968 Land Rover Dormobile "Elvis" 1960 Land Rover 88 PU "Stubby" > > 1966 Mercury Monterey "Tillie" John F. Hess, Davis California jfhess@dcn.davis.ca.us Land Rover Dormobile web pages: http://wheel.dcn.davis.ca.us/~jfhess/homepage.html 1968 Land Rover Dormobile "Elvis" 1960 Land Rover 88 PU "Stubby" 1966 Mercury Monterey "Tillie" From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Sun Feb 6 12:46:05 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id MAA24710 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Sun, 6 Feb 2000 12:46:05 -0500 Mime-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: Date: Sun, 6 Feb 2000 09:41:55 -0800 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com From: john hess Subject: good ol' days (shameless plug) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Hi, It finally dawned on me that my web pages are so old that a lot of this stuff is on them. For Mendo 1, check out: http://wheel.dcn.davis.ca.us/~kghess/mendo1/mendo1.html (remember Jimmy Ps stickers???) For Hollister, check out: http://wheel.dcn.davis.ca.us/~kghess/hollister95/hollister95.html For the Mojave trip, check out: http://wheel.dcn.davis.ca.us/~kghess/mojave96/mojave96.html John F. Hess, Davis California jfhess@dcn.davis.ca.us Land Rover Dormobile web pages: http://wheel.dcn.davis.ca.us/~jfhess/homepage.html 1968 Land Rover Dormobile "Elvis" 1960 Land Rover 88 PU "Stubby" 1966 Mercury Monterey "Tillie" From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Sun Feb 6 13:14:33 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id NAA24726 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Sun, 6 Feb 2000 13:14:33 -0500 Message-Id: <200002061813.KAA14602@blackie.cruzers.com> Subject: Re: Timm Coopers latest... Date: Sun, 6 Feb 00 10:17:08 -0800 x-sender: twakeman@mail.cruzers.com x-mailer: Claris Emailer 2.0, March 15, 1997 From: TeriAnn Wakeman To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org >Michael, >I love the pics. You mention that there's more to follow, would love to see >some more details of the 1/4 eliptics and the spring over on the front. >Pete Pete I have a picture of the front spring over taken before the body was added, or for that matter when the rear suspension was still a thought being churned in the back of Timm's fertile mind. It is located near the bottom of a web page: http://www.cruzers.com/~twakeman/LR/LRlift.htm Basically he welded four steel tubes to the sides of the axle housing, placed the spring on top of that and the stock bottom plate up on top. He used bolts, grade 8 I think, to secure everything. He removed one or more leaves (sorry I do not remember how many) so they would travel farther and the car would sit lower. At that time he was thinking that the reduced spring pack would allow the car to site somewhere around the stock height while greatly increasing articulation. I don't remember taking any pictures of the rear suspension while at Portland last year. A key part of the rear suspension design is the stock frame shape. The series I 109 two door had a different shaped frame. The frame actually steps up right after the front seat and is level clear to the back. The series I stationwagon & series II frames are the same height front to back with curves to run the frame over the axles then back down. This raised rear section provided clearence to add all the new stuff. On the other hand he has talked about wanting to come down one of these times and joining in on a mendo gonzo++ run. It could be a good time to see how the latest Timm Special actually works. TeriAnn http://www.overlander.net The world's most complete set of links connecting Rover 4X4 owners with Rover parts, service, accessory & sales companies world wide. From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Sun Feb 6 13:41:08 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id NAA24743 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Sun, 6 Feb 2000 13:41:08 -0500 Message-Id: <200002061839.KAA15378@blackie.cruzers.com> Subject: Re: AZ LRO site...... Date: Sun, 6 Feb 00 10:42:53 -0800 x-sender: twakeman@mail.cruzers.com x-mailer: Claris Emailer 2.0, March 15, 1997 From: TeriAnn Wakeman To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Gerry, You guys might consider adding an e-mail contact address for web surfers who would like to get in touch with the club. Just a thought... TeriAnn http://www.overlander.net The world's most complete set of links connecting Rover 4X4 owners with Rover parts, service, accessory & sales companies world wide. From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Sun Feb 6 14:12:22 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id OAA24759 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Sun, 6 Feb 2000 14:12:22 -0500 Message-ID: <007701bf70ce$419c4f00$214c1f18@hawaii.rr.com> From: "Peter Hope" To: References: <200002061813.KAA14602@blackie.cruzers.com> Subject: Re: Timm Coopers latest... Date: Sun, 6 Feb 2000 08:16:14 -1000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org > Basically he welded four steel tubes to the sides of the axle housing, > placed the spring on top of that and the stock bottom plate up on top. > He used bolts, grade 8 I think, to secure everything. > > He removed one or more leaves (sorry I do not remember how many) TeriAnn, thanks for the pic. Have any more? I am interested in the steering linkage. Have to make any changes with the spring over? Looks like 5 leaves on the front. Pete From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Sun Feb 6 15:07:18 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id PAA24777 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Sun, 6 Feb 2000 15:07:18 -0500 From: SFmms@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Sun, 6 Feb 2000 15:01:12 EST Subject: Re: Springtime Desert Trip To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 45 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Bruce wrote: << Let's do it! If you plan, the Rovers will come.>> This springtime desert trip one I'd try to make too since it would be closer to me. We might even come as a convoy of 2 Series trucks as we want to go see the '66 SIIa we've had in mind in 10 days or so (it's out of state). Ultimate plan is to drive or tow it home if we get it. Couple of other vehicles to check out too, just because we hate to make a trip just to see one. If I get a good look at them, I'll post comments to this list if anyone else is interested. One is a '72 or '73 SIII 88 with some Defender items on it, the other is a '65 SIIa 88 with a blown engine, but the body and frame is supposed to be good. I'll have to arrange something in the Big Bear area some day too, as we can use our cabin as a staging area and maybe use the BBQ or something. Plenty of parking around it - coiuld even fit up to 10 vehicles because ot it's location. Also camping widely available up there and we've found some interesting trails at all levels of challenge. BTW anyone have experience with the vehicle towing setups where the front tires are raised off the ground, for a Series vehicle? All I've done is flat towing my SIII. I want to know if the former arrangement might be better if we have to tow. Karen Sindir '74 SIII 88 Red Rufy + stablemate ? '95 Disco EFE From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Sun Feb 6 15:12:37 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id PAA24788 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Sun, 6 Feb 2000 15:12:37 -0500 From: GElam30092@aol.com Message-ID: <67.15a4641.25cf2edf@aol.com> Date: Sun, 6 Feb 2000 15:09:03 EST Subject: Re: AZ LRO site...... To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 45 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org In a message dated 2/6/00 11:40:21 AM US Mountain Standard Time, twakeman@cruzers.com writes: << You guys might consider adding an e-mail contact address for web surfers who would like to get in touch with the club. Just a thought... >> He will..... just was just his first time to sit down and get *something* up. Thanks! Gerry From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Sun Feb 6 15:21:00 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id PAA24799 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Sun, 6 Feb 2000 15:21:00 -0500 From: GElam30092@aol.com Message-ID: <3a.10b06eb.25cf30bc@aol.com> Date: Sun, 6 Feb 2000 15:17:00 EST Subject: Re: Springtime Desert Trip To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 45 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org In a message dated 2/6/00 1:06:48 PM US Mountain Standard Time, SFmms@aol.com writes: << This springtime desert trip one I'd try to make too since it would be closer to me. >> At one time, we talked about a Mojave spring trip. TAW was interested. I might talk James and Kelly if its over Memorial Day. I think they're both taking classes now. But, I'm open to anything but really like the Mojave area. The history there is excellent especially if we can get someone to narrate the area we're driving in from the Road Guide. How 'bout Chris, Leslie et al? You guys ready for another one? Cheers, Gerry Elam PHX AZ From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Sun Feb 6 15:30:15 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id PAA24810 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Sun, 6 Feb 2000 15:30:15 -0500 From: GElam30092@aol.com Message-ID: <22.1a24aa8.25cf32f5@aol.com> Date: Sun, 6 Feb 2000 15:26:29 EST Subject: still stuck in 3rd...... To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 45 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Took the floorboards out and removed the gearshift assembly. Still can't get the 3/4 selector to move. Not surprising since the gearshift wouldn't more it. Will take the seat box out next and start taking the gear selector area apart. While this is kind of frustrating, it's also a challenge for me and I'm actually enjoying it..... this time anyway. :-) Time to stop and work on something else that will not be any fun. Taxes. I also promised myself that I'd play HF radio with a new (to me) operating mode: PSK31. It takes HF signals and used the sound card of a computer as an a/d converter to decode the signal into text. It's especially efficient since the signal separation required is only about 100 hz and is also idea for low power operation. The program is free and all it takes to listen is a line from the external speaker output to the sound card. Simple. Then, I'll build up the line needed to hook the line-out to the mic of the radio. That's a little more difficult but not overly so. At least with radios, you don't have to worry about gear box oil.... only packed smoke that escapes! Cheers, Gerry From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Sun Feb 6 16:35:31 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id QAA24842 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Sun, 6 Feb 2000 16:35:31 -0500 Message-Id: <200002062131.NAA20456@blackie.cruzers.com> Subject: Re: Timm Coopers latest... Date: Sun, 6 Feb 00 13:34:40 -0800 x-sender: twakeman@mail.cruzers.com x-mailer: Claris Emailer 2.0, March 15, 1997 From: TeriAnn Wakeman To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org >TeriAnn, >thanks for the pic. Have any more? Nope, sorry I was taking pictures of my conversion and only had one roll of film (10 exposures) with me. But it was the first spring over I have seen up close on a LR so I snapped one. > I am interested in the steering >linkage. Have to make any changes with the spring over? Not 100% sure but I think he went to power steering same as he installed in mine but with a slight design change in the frame mounting plate. >Looks like 5 leaves on the front. >Pete TeriAnn http://www.overlander.net The world's most complete set of links connecting Rover 4X4 owners with Rover parts, service, accessory & sales companies world wide. From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Sun Feb 6 17:25:18 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id RAA24861 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Sun, 6 Feb 2000 17:25:18 -0500 Message-ID: <389DF40F.A5A920D@thelen.org> Date: Sun, 06 Feb 2000 14:22:07 -0800 From: "Christopher H. Dow" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.61 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.2.12-20 i686) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com Subject: Re: AZ LRO site...... References: <39.e33fc0.25ce584c@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Is there a sniglet for doing that? It happens frequently enough that I think there should be a term for it. C GElam30092@aol.com wrote: > > In a message dated 2/5/00 9:37:07 PM US Mountain Standard Time, > phope@hawaii.rr.com writes: > > << what's the url? >> > > Duh... sorry about that! www.azlro.org > Cheers, > Gerry From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Sun Feb 6 17:59:58 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id RAA24879 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Sun, 6 Feb 2000 17:59:58 -0500 Message-ID: <000901bf70f5$79a024e0$f5916bce@davery> From: "Dale W. Avery" To: References: <22.1a24aa8.25cf32f5@aol.com> Subject: PSK31, and working on Rusty Date: Sun, 6 Feb 2000 14:56:58 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2919.6600 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2919.6600 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Geery, Let me know what you think of PSK31. I am very intereted in that mode myself. I want to try it out with my TS50. I wonder how it would work with a notebook computer and the TS50 out in the boonies?? I just spent the last three days working on Rusty. Cleaned up the top and sides. I had a leak in the sunroof. Took it out to the local Rover dealer to repair. turned out that the drain tube in the left rear corner of the sunroof assembly had somehow come loose and was 6" too short! So after that was fixed, they used some chemical cleaner to loosen the duct tape residue off the top of the car. I used duct tape to seal the sunroof from all the rain we have been getting. At any rate, the chemical worked pretty good. however, when they washed the car off the bits of duct tape gooey spread all over the top and the sides near the roof drains. It took me most of an afternoon with coleman fuel and rags to get the stuff off. So when I was done with that, I decided to sand off some rust spots off the back of the rover (toward the center of the vehicle next to the tail lights and on the base of the lower tailgate. I bought a Dremel tool and some abrasive bits. Great tool! Stripped the paint off to bare metal, then treated with Extend (a rust inhibitor), some zinc-rich primer, and finally two coats of Chaminox paint. I had to do the body paint with a brush unfortunately, 'cuz I didn't get it in aerosal cans. but it still looks really good. Next spring, I remove the rear bumper and brake lights, and sand down the rear tailgate a second time. Then spray paint the whole thing. For now, the new paint will protect that rear end from any more rust (I hope). Now I'm going back out to wax the car. The Coleman fuel really cleaned it up, but I don't want to take it back out in the crummy weather without resealing the paint. I'll get the freshly painted rear area next weekend. Always something to do! ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Sunday, February 06, 2000 12:26 PM Subject: still stuck in 3rd...... > Took the floorboards out and removed the gearshift assembly. Still can't get > the 3/4 selector to move. Not surprising since the gearshift wouldn't more > it. Will take the seat box out next and start taking the gear selector area > apart. While this is kind of frustrating, it's also a challenge for me and > I'm actually enjoying it..... this time anyway. :-) > > Time to stop and work on something else that will not be any fun. Taxes. I > also promised myself that I'd play HF radio with a new (to me) operating > mode: PSK31. It takes HF signals and used the sound card of a computer as > an a/d converter to decode the signal into text. It's especially efficient > since the signal separation required is only about 100 hz and is also idea > for low power operation. The program is free and all it takes to listen is > a line from the external speaker output to the sound card. Simple. Then, > I'll build up the line needed to hook the line-out to the mic of the radio. > That's a little more difficult but not overly so. At least with radios, you > don't have to worry about gear box oil.... only packed smoke that escapes! > > Cheers, > Gerry > > > > From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Sun Feb 6 18:14:19 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id SAA24894 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Sun, 6 Feb 2000 18:14:19 -0500 From: GElam30092@aol.com Message-ID: <3a.10e6993.25cf57f7@aol.com> Date: Sun, 6 Feb 2000 18:04:23 EST Subject: Re: PSK31, and working on Rusty To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 45 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org In a message dated 2/6/00 3:59:01 PM US Mountain Standard Time, davery@ior.com writes: << Let me know what you think of PSK31. I am very intereted in that mode myself. I want to try it out with my TS50. I wonder how it would work with a notebook computer and the TS50 out in the boonies? >> I would say excellent if the soundcard is compatible with the SoundBlaster standard. I just copied four different QSO in progress without retuning the radio. The software has a "waterfall" display. Just click on the bright yellow lines and Bob's yer uncle. Give it a shot ... simply unbelievable! Cheers, Gerry From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Sun Feb 6 21:07:36 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id VAA24948 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Sun, 6 Feb 2000 21:07:36 -0500 Message-ID: <389E276D.61AD6F46@home.com> Date: Sun, 06 Feb 2000 18:01:18 -0800 From: Fil Figueroa X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en]C-AtHome0405 (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com Subject: Re: AZ LRO site...... References: <39.e33fc0.25ce584c@aol.com> <389DF40F.A5A920D@thelen.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org "Christopher H. Dow" wrote: > > Is there a sniglet for doing that? It happens frequently enough that I > think there should be a term for it. > i have not heard the term "sniglet" for a long time, brings back memories from NNTN cheers, fil - i'm always a victim of ignasecond From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Sun Feb 6 21:57:15 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id VAA24961 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Sun, 6 Feb 2000 21:57:15 -0500 From: GElam30092@aol.com Message-ID: <54.12108fc.25cf8db5@aol.com> Date: Sun, 6 Feb 2000 21:53:41 EST Subject: Re: AZ LRO site...... To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 45 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org > Is there a sniglet for doing that? It happens frequently enough that I > think there should be a term for it. >> How 'bout "Url's disease"? Cheers, Gerry From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Sun Feb 6 23:34:01 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id XAA25063 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Sun, 6 Feb 2000 23:34:01 -0500 Message-ID: <00b701bf7113$6ba117a0$0a926fce@baggarly.com> From: "Nick C. Baggarly" To: References: <3a.10b06eb.25cf30bc@aol.com> Subject: Re: Springtime Desert Trip Date: Sun, 6 Feb 2000 20:31:20 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org > At one time, we talked about a Mojave spring trip. I'm definitely interested in a spring Mojave road trip as well. That's a fun area! I can arrange for Debbie Burger to be our guide. Debbie knows the area well. She also knows Dennis Casavier, the author of the Mojave Road guide book. She might even be able to talk Dennis into meeting up with us. And if Rick goes I'll be able to give him his Mojave book maps back. It's not like he's just down the street or anything. Nick ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Sunday, February 06, 2000 2:17 PM Subject: Re: Springtime Desert Trip > In a message dated 2/6/00 1:06:48 PM US Mountain Standard Time, SFmms@aol.com > writes: > > << This springtime desert trip one I'd try to make too since it would be > closer > to me. >> > > At one time, we talked about a Mojave spring trip. TAW was interested. I > might talk James and Kelly if its over Memorial Day. I think they're both > taking classes now. > > But, I'm open to anything but really like the Mojave area. The history there > is excellent especially if we can get someone to narrate the area we're > driving in from the Road Guide. How 'bout Chris, Leslie et al? You guys > ready for another one? > > Cheers, > Gerry Elam > PHX AZ > From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Mon Feb 7 01:44:28 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id BAA25701 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Mon, 7 Feb 2000 01:44:28 -0500 Message-ID: <389E6663.FA14E2A7@earthlink.net> Date: Sun, 06 Feb 2000 22:29:55 -0800 From: "Franklin H. Yap" X-Sender: "Franklin H. Yap" <@mail.earthlink.net> (Unverified) X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en]C-FLASHNET (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com Subject: Re: good ol' days (shameless plug) References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org John hess wrote: > > It finally dawned on me that my web pages are so old that a lot of > this stuff is on them. > This reminded me that about a year ago I was playing around with webpages. Anyway, there are a few photos of the Panamint Valley desert trip at http://home.earthlink.net/~ceyap/page7.html I think that may be Kelly with the hat supervising the u-bolt fix. Frank From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Mon Feb 7 10:08:33 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id KAA26095 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Mon, 7 Feb 2000 10:08:33 -0500 From: GElam30092@aol.com Message-ID: <38.1ce79b4.25d038bb@aol.com> Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2000 10:03:23 EST Subject: Re: Springtime Desert Trip To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 45 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org In a message dated 2/6/2000 9:32:59 PM US Mountain Standard Time, nick@baggarly.com writes: << I'm definitely interested in a spring Mojave road trip as well. That's a fun area! >> Sounds like we need to define *spring*. In AZ, as long as it's between 65 and 110, we call it spring. Do we want to set aside a weekend and include a Friday? Or pick a holiday weekend like Good Friday or Memorial Day? Or, is next weekend good for anyone? :-) Or, is there a calendar of events to check dates against? Seems like the Mendo is April 29 (my birthday too) so I'm not sure that Good Friday will work and Memorial Day might be too far out for spring. If nothing else, how does March 17-19 sound as a default? Cheers, Gerry PS: I'll bring a white sheet and try to find a projector if Nick will bring slides of their trip! We'll hang the sheet up as a screen and Nick can take about the trip. From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Mon Feb 7 12:01:27 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id MAA26300 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Mon, 7 Feb 2000 12:01:27 -0500 Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2000 09:48:11 -0700 (MST) From: James Howard To: Mendo list Subject: Overheating Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Will too advance ignition timing, or too retarded, or both, cause overheating? From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Mon Feb 7 12:08:14 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id MAA26329 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Mon, 7 Feb 2000 12:08:14 -0500 Message-ID: <06DEF5772893D311AAF40000F804F44C3F7613@rcexs.cobe.com> From: "Gomes, David" To: "'mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com'" Subject: RE: Overheating Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2000 10:07:46 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Usually it's excessive retard associated with overheating. Too much advance will cause things like pinging or knocking before it causes overheating. -Dave G. From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Mon Feb 7 12:10:58 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id MAA26339 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Mon, 7 Feb 2000 12:10:58 -0500 Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2000 09:56:35 -0700 (MST) From: James Howard To: Mendo list Subject: Vapour locke Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Anyone have any solutions for vapour lock problems on a SIII with a Weber carb? From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Mon Feb 7 12:27:37 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id MAA26355 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Mon, 7 Feb 2000 12:27:37 -0500 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <00b701bf7113$6ba117a0$0a926fce@baggarly.com> References: <3a.10b06eb.25cf30bc@aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2000 09:20:36 -0800 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com From: Russ Wilson Subject: Re: Springtime Desert Trip Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org >> At one time, we talked about a Mojave spring trip. > >I'm definitely interested in a spring Mojave road trip as well. That's a fun >area! >Nick Nick, Ahhhhh I see the little voices have started singing inside your head....."You must get back on the trail..... you must go on another roadtrip.....pack up the dormie and hit the road...." You're a nice enough guy Nick but realize that you are sick. cheers Russ and Leslie Wilson "Expertise was best defined in terms not of what the expert already knew, but of how easily the expert could find things out." - Nathaniel Borenstein From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Mon Feb 7 12:30:28 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id MAA26369 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Mon, 7 Feb 2000 12:30:28 -0500 Message-ID: <06DEF5772893D311AAF40000F804F44C3F7615@rcexs.cobe.com> From: "Gomes, David" To: "'mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com'" Subject: RE: Vapour locke Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2000 10:29:24 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org 1- Insulate your under-bonnet fuel lines with foil faced insulation from Summit Racing. And route them with an eye toward keeping cool. 2- Make and install a heat shield for the carb base. This can be as simple as a piece of sheet metal (two halves for easier fittment) that fits between the mounting bolt heads and the carb base, and is about 3-4" bigger than the carb base all around. These are generic fixes, though. If there's something peculiar to the Webber carb, this diesel bum wouldn't know about it! :^) If it has an engine coolant line attached for de-icing, see if removing the line (or clamping it shut) effects the problem at all. > ---------- > From: James Howard[SMTP:jhoward@sextans.lowell.edu] > Reply To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com > Sent: Monday, February 07, 2000 9:56 AM > To: Mendo list > Subject: Vapour locke > > > Anyone have any solutions for vapour lock problems on a SIII with a Weber > carb? > > From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Mon Feb 7 13:34:44 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id NAA26501 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Mon, 7 Feb 2000 13:34:44 -0500 Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2000 10:08:02 -0800 (PST) From: john hess To: "'mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com'" Subject: RE: Overheating In-Reply-To: <06DEF5772893D311AAF40000F804F44C3F7613@rcexs.cobe.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org OK, for us scientific types, when you advance the timing, you make it MORE before TDC, right? And when you retard the timing, you make it AFTER TDC? I find that Stubby runs best with timing way before TDC: As in 15 degrees or so. thanks On Mon, 7 Feb 2000, Gomes, David wrote: > Usually it's excessive retard associated with overheating. Too much advance > will cause things like pinging or knocking before it causes overheating. > > -Dave G. > > john hess, Davis, California jfhess@dcn.davis.ca.us Dormie web pages at http://dcn.davis.ca.us/~jfhess/startpoint.html From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Mon Feb 7 14:16:43 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id OAA26645 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Mon, 7 Feb 2000 14:16:43 -0500 Message-ID: <06DEF5772893D311AAF40000F804F44C3F761B@rcexs.cobe.com> From: "Gomes, David" To: "'mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com'" Subject: RE: Overheating Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2000 12:12:42 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org > OK, for us scientific types, when you advance the timing, you make it MORE > before TDC, right? And when you retard the timing, you make it AFTER TDC? > Yup, advance = earlier in the crank rotation cycle, retard = later in the cycle, but not necesarilly after top dead center. (timing of 5 deg BTDC would be retarded with reference to 10 deg BTDC) Important to do the timing setting as dictated by the manual. Some cars say vacuum advance connected, some say disconnect and plug it. Vac advance will make 10+ degrees of difference at idle. I don't know what's right for LR petrol as I only have diesel...... -Dave G. From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Mon Feb 7 15:50:27 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id PAA26779 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Mon, 7 Feb 2000 15:50:27 -0500 From: StevHutch@aol.com Message-ID: <37.10689ea.25d0870b@aol.com> Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2000 15:37:31 EST Subject: Re: Towing To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 39 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org >BTW anyone have experience with the vehicle towing setups where the front >tires are raised off the ground, for a Series vehicle? Karen, I have towed my series III 88 several times (L.A. to past San Francisco, and S.F. to Dallas/back again) using those Uhaul type tow dollys. Both times it towed very smoothly, and without any real problems ; other than the fact of forgeting once that you can't back up more than 10' or so with them as they begin to pivot and will jack knife, so plan ahead on parking and especially when negotiating small filling stations. They are cheaper/lighter than normal trailers, have built in trailer lights so no last minute wiring tricks are needed, and save wear and tear on the front drive gear to boot. They are really designed for smaller cars though, so be sure to pay attention to the tensioning of the front tire tie-downs and check them often..especially if you have anything bigger than the narrow stock tires on your truck. (I don't know about 16" wheels though..) - Steve Hutchins From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Mon Feb 7 16:06:42 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id QAA26820 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Mon, 7 Feb 2000 16:06:42 -0500 Message-ID: <008701bf71ad$976012c0$214c1f18@hawaii.rr.com> From: "Peter Hope" To: References: <37.10689ea.25d0870b@aol.com> Subject: Re: Towing Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2000 10:54:56 -1000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org > >BTW anyone have experience with the vehicle towing setups where the front > >tires are raised off the ground, for a Series vehicle? > > Karen, > > using those Uhaul type tow dollys. Both times it > towed very smoothly, and without any real problems ; other than the fact of > forgeting once that you can't back up more than 10' or so with them as they > begin to pivot and will jack knife, so plan ahead on parking and especially > when negotiating small filling stations Have towed my 88" and a number of other vehicles with these dollies myself. Not sure it was mentioned but remove the rear drive shaft before doing any towing. As far as the reversing... it is next to impossible, even with someone sitting in the drivers seat turning the rover wheel. Ended up rolling the vehicle off the dolly, pushing it, moving the tow vehicle, and then remounting the rover using a comealong. Pete From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Mon Feb 7 16:08:31 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id QAA26830 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Mon, 7 Feb 2000 16:08:31 -0500 Message-ID: <06DEF5772893D311AAF40000F804F44C3F7621@rcexs.cobe.com> From: "Gomes, David" To: "'mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com'" Subject: RE: Towing Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2000 14:02:49 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org And don't forget to put the T-case in neutral to save spinning the t-case and tranny the whole time. It shouldn't cause any damage, but it's easy to put the case in neutral and not take the chance, since you aren't in the truck to hear it if something starts whining in the first hour of a 2 day trip! Removing the prop shaft isn't all that difficult, either, but not required like it is on a vehicle with auto box and no t-case. -Dave G. From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Mon Feb 7 16:23:50 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id QAA26878 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Mon, 7 Feb 2000 16:23:50 -0500 Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.20000207132142.0082fde0@pacific.net> X-Sender: gpool@pacific.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (32) Date: Mon, 07 Feb 2000 13:21:42 -0800 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com From: Granville Pool Subject: Re: Towing In-Reply-To: <008701bf71ad$976012c0$214c1f18@hawaii.rr.com> References: <37.10689ea.25d0870b@aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org >Not sure it was mentioned but remove the rear drive shaft before doing any >towing. Or install free-wheeling hubs on the rear if you are planning to tow it very often. Unlocking those is a lot easier. If you flat tow it, you can unlock all four wheels. Granny From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Mon Feb 7 16:58:55 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id QAA26931 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Mon, 7 Feb 2000 16:58:55 -0500 Message-ID: <00a901bf71b3$32849e60$214c1f18@hawaii.rr.com> From: "Peter Hope" To: References: <37.10689ea.25d0870b@aol.com> <3.0.6.32.20000207132142.0082fde0@pacific.net> Subject: Re: Towing Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2000 11:35:04 -1000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org > >Not sure it was mentioned but remove the rear drive shaft before doing any > >towing. > > Or install free-wheeling hubs on the rear if you are planning to tow it > very often. Unlocking those is a lot easier. If you flat tow it, you can > unlock all four wheels. Excellent idea, would make a nice anti theft device also I would think. So anyone have an extra set of Warn FWH out there? Want warns to match the current ones on the front Pete From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Mon Feb 7 17:49:58 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id RAA27047 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Mon, 7 Feb 2000 17:49:58 -0500 Message-ID: <00a301bf71b3$01a46960$214c1f18@hawaii.rr.com> From: "Peter Hope" To: References: <06DEF5772893D311AAF40000F804F44C3F7621@rcexs.cobe.com> Subject: Re: Towing Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2000 11:33:42 -1000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org > Removing the prop shaft isn't all that difficult, either, but not required > like it is on a vehicle with auto box and no t-case. > I have been told, that even on the Rover, simply placing in nuetral is not enough. The output shaft of the tcase is being driven and you can get wear. Would love to know if this is true or not. Pete From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Mon Feb 7 18:16:13 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id SAA27073 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Mon, 7 Feb 2000 18:16:13 -0500 Message-ID: <06DEF5772893D311AAF40000F804F44C3F7625@rcexs.cobe.com> From: "Gomes, David" To: "'mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com'" Subject: RE: Towing Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2000 16:09:23 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org > I have been told, that even on the Rover, simply placing in nuetral is not > enough. The output shaft of the tcase is being driven and you can get > wear. > Would love to know if this is true or not. > The point is that the wear isn't any greater than is experienced when driving the vehicle. The t-case is lubed by the gears slinging oil. This will happen regardless of which direction the power is flowing in the box. And since the transfer case (not, or in addition to the transmission) is in neutral, the oil is the only resistance the gears on the output shaft see so the wear to gears and bearings should actually be a lot less than normal driving. The prop shaft removal bit comes mainly from 2WD cars with automatic transmissions. With an auto box the majority of the lubrication is accomplished by the oil pump on the input shaft. If you put an automatic in neutral and tow it around, the prop shaft will spin the tranny's tailshaft whose bearings are not being lubricated since the pump is not being turned at the front of the box. Toasted bearings and fried seals (must be almost supper time...) in very short order. It's even okay to flat tow an automatic Land Rover, as long as you can put the transfer case in neutral so the transmission bits don't turn. From this stand point, it's probably a better idea to leave the transmission in gear or, with an automatic, in Park, so that the hydraulic forces of the moving oil in the t-case don't impart unwanted motion to the tranny components. -Dave G. From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Mon Feb 7 18:25:50 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id SAA27102 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Mon, 7 Feb 2000 18:25:50 -0500 Message-ID: <06DEF5772893D311AAF40000F804F44C3F7626@rcexs.cobe.com> From: "Gomes, David" To: "'mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com'" Subject: Rear FWH Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2000 16:18:55 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org > Excellent idea, would make a nice anti theft device also I would think. > So anyone have an extra set of Warn FWH out there? Want warns to match > the > current ones on the front > Only anti theft if you can park on an absolutely flat area. Trans brake not effective with hubs unlocked. Plus, with only hub bearing resistance on such a flat surface, any teenager could push it away! One serious note, if FWHs are fitted at the rear, expect the same relative lifespan as you get with half shafts front to rear. These rear hubs will be subject to more torque all the time than the front ones see only occasionally so be prepared for them to fail much earlier than they would in a front application. Not a problem if you carry the drive flanges around with you, but get the strongest FWH you can find for use in the rear, and ask the vendor about their idea of its fitness in the application. And on a less serious note, be prepared for some social deviant like me to put a rock behind one wheel and unlock the rear hubs while you're in having a pint. I might or might not stick around to see the look on your face when you let the clutch out....... :^) -Dave G. From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Mon Feb 7 18:44:37 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id SAA27132 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Mon, 7 Feb 2000 18:44:37 -0500 Message-ID: <010501bf71c3$5fd4b480$214c1f18@hawaii.rr.com> From: "Peter Hope" To: References: <06DEF5772893D311AAF40000F804F44C3F7626@rcexs.cobe.com> Subject: Re: Rear FWH Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2000 13:30:52 -1000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org > And on a less serious note, be prepared for some social deviant like me to > put a rock behind one wheel and unlock the rear hubs while you're in having > a pint. I might or might not stick around to see the look on your face when > you let the clutch out....... :^) > Dave, LOL and thanks for the info on this and the towing thread Pete From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Mon Feb 7 19:21:56 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id TAA27163 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Mon, 7 Feb 2000 19:21:56 -0500 Message-Id: <3.0.3.32.20000207162027.00916100@flex.com> X-Sender: jhong@flex.com (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.3 (32) Date: Mon, 07 Feb 2000 16:20:27 -0800 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com From: John Subject: re:Towing Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Hi All, When I moved from EastC to WestC about 6 years ago, the cost diff for a 2 wheel dolly vs the full trailer was something like $40 ($70 vs $110ish ???) My rover frame wasn't in the best shape (visions of frame cracking in half/parts falling off half way across these United States danced through my head) so I sprung for the full trailer. Tow weight/height was greater but since I was overloading...I mean using a medium large Uhaul truck anyway...shrug. Also figured not having any of my drivetrain stuff spinning for 3k miles was worth it. John From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Mon Feb 7 19:23:53 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id TAA27173 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Mon, 7 Feb 2000 19:23:53 -0500 Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.20000207162147.0082ece0@pacific.net> X-Sender: gpool@pacific.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (32) Date: Mon, 07 Feb 2000 16:21:47 -0800 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com From: Granville Pool Subject: Re: Rear FWH In-Reply-To: <010501bf71c3$5fd4b480$214c1f18@hawaii.rr.com> References: <06DEF5772893D311AAF40000F804F44C3F7626@rcexs.cobe.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Pete, You asked if anyone had any spare Warn hubs for putting on the rear, to match your front ones. I almost mentioned in my earlier post that I had Warn hubs on the rear of a '70 Series IIA 88 for a long time. They were the old-style Warns that require the special long bolts. I could not keep the bolts tight so the hubs were alway leaking oil. A lot of oil. Got fed up with it and took 'em off. If I were to do it again, I'd try to use one of the hubs that has the body designed like the later-style Warns that use the stock drive-flange bolts. But I don't know that I'd want to use the late-style Warns themselves because I've hear that they are not that strong, that they are weaker than the old-style Warns. Can't seem to have it both ways, eh? Cheers, Granny From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Mon Feb 7 20:00:08 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id UAA27191 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Mon, 7 Feb 2000 20:00:08 -0500 From: "Kelly Minnick" To: Subject: RE: PSK31, and working on Rusty, paint Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2000 16:59:30 -0800 Message-ID: <000001bf71cf$c151dd80$6a05193f@minnick> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2173.0 In-Reply-To: <000901bf70f5$79a024e0$f5916bce@davery> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Importance: Normal Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org AcryClean (Acrylic cleaner made by PPG/Ditzler) works very well at cleaning paint between coats, before painting or whatever without softening the paint! The Omni general purpose cleaner will strip the tape glue (and the paint). The STP Tar & Bug remover seems to be able to remove glue too, but not quite as good as the AcryClean. Later, Kelly Minnick > -----Original Message----- > Subject: PSK31, and working on Rusty > > Dale said: > > Now I'm going back out to wax the car. The Coleman fuel really cleaned it > up, but I don't want to take it back out in the crummy weather without > resealing the paint. I'll get the freshly painted rear area next weekend. > > Always something to do! > > From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Mon Feb 7 20:09:24 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id UAA27206 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Mon, 7 Feb 2000 20:09:24 -0500 From: "Kelly Minnick" To: Subject: RE: good ol' days (shameless plug) Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2000 17:06:02 -0800 Message-ID: <000101bf71d0$aaf0b060$6a05193f@minnick> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2173.0 In-Reply-To: <389E6663.FA14E2A7@earthlink.net> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Importance: Normal Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Well, that is me in the hat, but I'm not sure I supervised Anything! I was probably just handing TW some tools... You can see the old series (Mehdi's now) vehicle on the left. Later, Kelly Minnick > -----Original Message----- > Subject: Re: good ol' days (shameless plug) > > This reminded me that about a year ago I was playing around with > webpages. Anyway, there are a few photos of the Panamint Valley desert > trip at > > http://home.earthlink.net/~ceyap/page7.html > > I think that may be Kelly with the hat supervising the u-bolt fix. > > Frank > From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Mon Feb 7 20:30:15 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id UAA27217 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Mon, 7 Feb 2000 20:30:15 -0500 Message-ID: <000801bf71d3$bae262e0$3371d4cc@davery> From: "Dale W. Avery" To: References: <389E6663.FA14E2A7@earthlink.net> Subject: Re: good ol' days (shameless plug) Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2000 17:27:56 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2919.6600 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2919.6600 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Frank, Thanks for sharing the photos on your website. They are great! Now I almost know what Kelly looks like ;-) I think it was 1995 that I started corresponding with everyone on Mendo. I was working on Tigger at the time. There weren't too many coilers around the list back then. Even Jim Russell made an appearance on occation. Anyone remember the name of the guy with the series who was slightly madder than the rest of us. So or other "Not a Rosa"??? I remember a photo of him sailing through the air over a snowbank. Think he even impressed Granny with his lunacy. Dale ----- Original Message ----- From: "Franklin H. Yap" To: Sent: Sunday, February 06, 2000 10:29 PM Subject: Re: good ol' days (shameless plug) > John hess wrote: > > > > It finally dawned on me that my web pages are so old that a lot of > > this stuff is on them. > > > > This reminded me that about a year ago I was playing around with > webpages. Anyway, there are a few photos of the Panamint Valley desert > trip at > > http://home.earthlink.net/~ceyap/page7.html > > I think that may be Kelly with the hat supervising the u-bolt fix. > > Frank > From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Mon Feb 7 20:42:11 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id UAA27228 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Mon, 7 Feb 2000 20:42:11 -0500 Message-ID: <001e01bf71d4$c4218600$3371d4cc@davery> From: "Dale W. Avery" To: References: Subject: Re: Vapour locke Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2000 17:35:20 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2919.6600 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2919.6600 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Do you have the Weber mounted directly to the intake manifold, or do you have the bakelite (or whatever composition it is) spacer between it and the intake? ----- Original Message ----- From: "James Howard" To: "Mendo list" Sent: Monday, February 07, 2000 8:56 AM Subject: Vapour locke > > Anyone have any solutions for vapour lock problems on a SIII with a Weber > carb? > > > From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Mon Feb 7 20:42:25 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id UAA27238 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Mon, 7 Feb 2000 20:42:25 -0500 Message-ID: <001101bf71d5$81fa4ae0$3371d4cc@davery> From: "Dale W. Avery" To: References: <37.10689ea.25d0870b@aol.com> <008701bf71ad$976012c0$214c1f18@hawaii.rr.com> Subject: Re: Towing Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2000 17:40:36 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2919.6600 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2919.6600 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Actually, if you removed only the rear drive shaft, why can't you put it into fwd and move the series under it's own power? Dale ----- Original Message ----- From: "Peter Hope" To: Sent: Monday, February 07, 2000 12:54 PM Subject: Re: Towing > > >BTW anyone have experience with the vehicle towing setups where the front > > >tires are raised off the ground, for a Series vehicle? > > > > Karen, > > > > using those Uhaul type tow dollys. Both times it > > towed very smoothly, and without any real problems ; other than the fact > of > > forgeting once that you can't back up more than 10' or so with them as > they > > begin to pivot and will jack knife, so plan ahead on parking and > especially > > when negotiating small filling stations > > Have towed my 88" and a number of other vehicles with these dollies myself. > Not sure it was mentioned but remove the rear drive shaft before doing any > towing. As far as the reversing... it is next to impossible, even with > someone sitting in the drivers seat turning the rover wheel. Ended up > rolling the vehicle off the dolly, pushing it, moving the tow vehicle, and > then remounting the rover using a comealong. > Pete > > From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Mon Feb 7 21:15:18 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id VAA27260 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Mon, 7 Feb 2000 21:15:18 -0500 From: SFmms@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2000 21:12:44 EST Subject: Re: Series Towing To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 45 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org David G wrote: << And on a less serious note, be prepared for some social deviant like me to put a rock behind one wheel and unlock the rear hubs while you're in having a pint. I might or might not stick around to see the look on your face when you let the clutch out....... :^) >> Fortunately I don't like beer and I don't have a spare set of FWH anyway. Gin & tonic (or a good wine) is more what I prefer, but then drinking that before towing would cause me to start fishtailing (as well as the trailer) long before I noticed anything :^) Seriously, I flat tow my SIII 88 alot, even once to Portland & back one time for the AFBM. I always leave the overdrive out, main shifter in fourth, transfer gearbox in neutral. The SIIa I am interested in doesn't have an overdrive, so I thought pretty much the same settings would apply otherwise. I do bungee the main shifter to keep it in 4th and would probably secure the transfer shifter as well on the new truck as the condition of the transmission is unknown. I did not think disconnecting the rear propshaft was necessary though. Are there any advantages/disadvantages of clamping an A bar to the front bumper vs the dolly? I will try to get a set of D-rings installed on the proper location on the frame in any case and use those to connect safety chains as I do currently for my SIII 88. Thanks in advance, Karen Sindir '74 SIII 88 Red Rufy '95 Disco EFE - designated tow truck '66 SIIa ? From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Mon Feb 7 21:23:16 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id VAA27283 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Mon, 7 Feb 2000 21:23:16 -0500 Message-ID: <002601bf71d9$ec2edf80$214c1f18@hawaii.rr.com> From: "Peter Hope" To: References: <37.10689ea.25d0870b@aol.com> <008701bf71ad$976012c0$214c1f18@hawaii.rr.com> <001101bf71d5$81fa4ae0$3371d4cc@davery> Subject: Re: Towing Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2000 16:12:16 -1000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org The vehicle in question was/is not in running condition, but a good idea ----- Original Message ----- From: Dale W. Avery To: Sent: Monday, February 07, 2000 15:40 Subject: Re: Towing > Actually, if you removed only the rear drive shaft, why can't you put it > into fwd and move the series under it's own power? > > Dale > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Peter Hope" > To: > Sent: Monday, February 07, 2000 12:54 PM > Subject: Re: Towing > > > > > >BTW anyone have experience with the vehicle towing setups where the > front > > > >tires are raised off the ground, for a Series vehicle? > > > > > > Karen, > > > > > > using those Uhaul type tow dollys. Both times it > > > towed very smoothly, and without any real problems ; other than the fact > > of > > > forgeting once that you can't back up more than 10' or so with them as > > they > > > begin to pivot and will jack knife, so plan ahead on parking and > > especially > > > when negotiating small filling stations > > > > Have towed my 88" and a number of other vehicles with these dollies > myself. > > Not sure it was mentioned but remove the rear drive shaft before doing any > > towing. As far as the reversing... it is next to impossible, even with > > someone sitting in the drivers seat turning the rover wheel. Ended up > > rolling the vehicle off the dolly, pushing it, moving the tow vehicle, and > > then remounting the rover using a comealong. > > Pete > > > > > From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Mon Feb 7 21:26:40 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id VAA27295 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Mon, 7 Feb 2000 21:26:40 -0500 Message-ID: <002e01bf71da$4bfacc80$214c1f18@hawaii.rr.com> From: "Peter Hope" To: References: <06DEF5772893D311AAF40000F804F44C3F7626@rcexs.cobe.com> <3.0.6.32.20000207162147.0082ece0@pacific.net> Subject: Re: Rear FWH Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2000 16:14:57 -1000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org > Warn hubs on the rear of a '70 Series IIA 88 for a long time. They were > the old-style Warns that require the special long bolts. I could not keep > the bolts tight so the hubs were alway leaking oil. A lot of oil. I am assuming I have the older hubs, because they are much longer then the hub bolts on the rear. But I have the lock tab washers on mine, so hopefully will not have the same problems. Pete From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Mon Feb 7 22:25:52 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id WAA27390 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Mon, 7 Feb 2000 22:25:52 -0500 Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2000 20:11:31 -0700 (MST) From: James Howard To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com Subject: Re: Vapour locke In-Reply-To: <001e01bf71d4$c4218600$3371d4cc@davery> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org I don't know. It is for a friend that I ask this question. Will let you know. On Mon, 7 Feb 2000, Dale W. Avery wrote: > Do you have the Weber mounted directly to the intake manifold, or do you > have the bakelite (or whatever composition it is) spacer between it and the > intake? > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "James Howard" > To: "Mendo list" > Sent: Monday, February 07, 2000 8:56 AM > Subject: Vapour locke > > > > > > Anyone have any solutions for vapour lock problems on a SIII with a Weber > > carb? > > > > > > > From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Mon Feb 7 22:34:31 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id WAA27402 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Mon, 7 Feb 2000 22:34:31 -0500 Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.20000207184805.007e32e0@mail.saber.net> X-Sender: bobnsueb@mail.saber.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (32) Date: Mon, 07 Feb 2000 18:48:05 -0800 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com From: Bob & Sue Bernard Subject: Re: Rear FWH In-Reply-To: <002e01bf71da$4bfacc80$214c1f18@hawaii.rr.com> References: <06DEF5772893D311AAF40000F804F44C3F7626@rcexs.cobe.com> <3.0.6.32.20000207162147.0082ece0@pacific.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org At 04:14 PM 2/7/2000 -1000, you wrote: >> Warn hubs on the rear of a '70 Series IIA 88 for a long time. They were >> the old-style Warns that require the special long bolts. I could not keep >> the bolts tight so the hubs were alway leaking oil. A lot of oil. > >I am assuming I have the older hubs, because they are much longer then the >hub bolts on the rear. But I have the lock tab washers on mine, so >hopefully will not have the same problems. >Pete Hi, All three of my Rovers have the older type and lock tabs on th ebolts. No problems with loosening. Bob B > From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Mon Feb 7 22:36:30 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id WAA27413 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Mon, 7 Feb 2000 22:36:30 -0500 From: INFLOWINC@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2000 21:57:15 EST Subject: Re: Mendo_Recce digest: V2 #911 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 44 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Dear Group, As I read the messages I am grateful for all the great info. that gets exchanged and am sorry that I can't contribute given my lack of technical knowledge. But remain available to help the club out on any other planning, etc. needs. I hope someone can provide some feedback on the two foll. issues I have on my 92 Range Rover County. 1. Replacement Shocks...while the current shocks seem OK, the vehicle seems to bottom out a little too easily. I have 65K miles on orig. shocks. Any help/suggestions on good replacments. The Rover has had limited off roading experieince while I prefer a firmer ride around town and highway. 2. Dashboard idiot light out---- I noticed the orange light for brake pad wear on the dash did not illuminate when I turned the key in the ignition. All the other lights prior to cranking the engine were on. The dealer said it might just be a loose wire and not to worry about it until next service. Many thanks in advance. Hope everyone is having a great and profitable day. Vinod S. Kripalani Page Plaza, 44 Page Street, Suite #403 San Francisco, CA 94102 Phone: 1-415-565-0600 Fax: 1-415-522-5887 From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Tue Feb 8 00:01:14 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id AAA27506 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Tue, 8 Feb 2000 00:01:14 -0500 Message-ID: <001301bf71f1$0e5d0f20$9771d4cc@davery> From: "Dale W. Avery" To: References: Subject: Re: Mendo_Recce digest: V2 #911 Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2000 20:57:51 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2919.6600 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2919.6600 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Hello Vinod, I don't have an answer for the idiot light, being an idiot myself, but I do have one for the springs. If you really want to do some off-roading/back roading, I would strongly suggest replacing the originals with a set of Old Man Emu springs (OMEs) along with a set of Bilstein shocks and a Bilstein steering dampener. You can get these, along with some good advice from British Pacific, or any of the other Rover parts sources. The OMEs come in soft, medium, and heavy rates. I have ARB bumpers on my '90 RR SWB and went with the medium OMEs. I have been very happy with them both on road and off. Someone else on the list may be able to give you more advice, especially concerning springs rates and sway bars. My Rover doesn't have sway bars. Good luck and welcome aboard. Dale ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Monday, February 07, 2000 6:57 PM Subject: Re: Mendo_Recce digest: V2 #911 > Dear Group, > > As I read the messages I am grateful for all the great info. that gets > exchanged and am sorry that I can't contribute given my lack of technical > knowledge. > > But remain available to help the club out on any other planning, etc. needs. > > I hope someone can provide some feedback on the two foll. issues I have on my > 92 Range Rover County. > > 1. Replacement Shocks...while the current shocks seem OK, the vehicle seems > to bottom out a little too easily. I have 65K miles on orig. shocks. Any > help/suggestions on good replacments. The Rover has had limited off roading > experieince while I prefer a firmer ride around town and highway. > > 2. Dashboard idiot light out---- I noticed the orange light for brake pad > wear on the dash did not illuminate when I turned the key in the ignition. > All the other lights prior to cranking the engine were on. The dealer said it > might just be a loose wire and not to worry about it until next service. > > Many thanks in advance. Hope everyone is having a great and profitable day. > > Vinod S. Kripalani > > Page Plaza, 44 Page Street, Suite #403 > San Francisco, CA 94102 > > Phone: 1-415-565-0600 > Fax: 1-415-522-5887 > > From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Tue Feb 8 00:29:32 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id AAA28006 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Tue, 8 Feb 2000 00:29:32 -0500 From: msandcdg@slip.net To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com Subject: RE: Subscription Message-Id: <07020038.77261@198.83.128.2> Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2000 21:27:42 -0800 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Dino good to have you back. Welcome Mehdi --- Original Message --- LRDino@aol.com Wrote on Mon, 7 Feb 2000 23:48:59 EST ------------------ Hi! Ben. Please subscribe me. Thanks, Dino ----- Sent using MailStart.com ( http://MailStart.Com/welcome.html ) The FREE way to access your mailbox via any web browser, anywhere! From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Tue Feb 8 01:06:07 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id BAA28144 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Tue, 8 Feb 2000 01:06:07 -0500 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Sender: rlarson@mail.dsldesigns.com Message-Id: Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2000 21:54:31 -0800 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com From: Rick Larson Subject: Disco Series II experiences Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org I've got a colleague who is shopping for upper-mid range SUV. He wants something he can take off-road, but doesn't expect to do much more than fire roads. He looked at the Disco Series II. Any reviews on the quality, reliablity and/or function of the new Disco. Thanks, -Rick -Rick Rick Larson rlarson@dsldesigns.com From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Tue Feb 8 10:44:54 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id KAA28838 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Tue, 8 Feb 2000 10:44:54 -0500 Message-ID: <06DEF5772893D311AAF40000F804F44C3F762D@rcexs.cobe.com> From: "Gomes, David" To: "'mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com'" Subject: Shocks for Vinod Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2000 08:44:15 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org I think I poisoned Dale's mind with talk of springs and tires, as Vinod was asking mainly about shocks..... :^) For primarilly on-road use, the standard answer is Bilstein shocks, especially with stock springs. The Bilsteins are more road-biased than even the LR (still Woodhead???) shocks, providing better control of body roll on turns. You may notice little bumps slightly more than with the stock shocks, though. Not sure where your suspension tastes lie. The best bet is to talk with someone at British Pacific about what your tastes are and what would suit them best. I think BP sells all three of the most common replacement shocks, Bilstein, stock, and Old Man Emu. Afraid I'm also no help on the dash light, though...... -Dave G. From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Tue Feb 8 10:47:50 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id KAA28857 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Tue, 8 Feb 2000 10:47:50 -0500 Message-ID: <06DEF5772893D311AAF40000F804F44C3F762E@rcexs.cobe.com> From: "Gomes, David" To: "'mendo'" Cc: "'SPYDERS@aol.com'" Subject: RE: RR & SIII commonality, or where to store a LR? Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2000 08:48:59 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Hi Pat, There's a great group of Rover-ites in the bay area on a separate E-mail list, called mendo_recce. Some of them peruse the LRO list, but I'll forward your note to them just in case. Anybody able to help Pat out? -Dave G. > ---------- > From: SPYDERS@aol.com[SMTP:SPYDERS@aol.com] > Reply To: lro@playground.sun.com > Sent: Tuesday, February 08, 2000 6:30 AM > To: lro@playground.sun.com > Subject: RR & SIII commonality, or where to store a LR? > > > Excuse me, but would anyone on this list know what an Early Range Rover > and a > Series III share in common, partswise or otherwise? > > Someone told me this is a good place to ask. > > Ok, here's my real question, that was just to get past the major, > hopefully. > > I'm leaving Miami, after 8 years here, for points North and West to end up > > hopefully in San Francisco in early/mid-april before catching a plane > there > to go even farther west. > > have: camera, film, land rover and amoco card. > > don't have: place to store land rover in Bay Area for a few months while > life > sorts itself out. > > Can anyone not riled up by the initial question of RR/SIII commonality who > > has any suggestions on where to store a LR in the San Francisco bay area > give > me a holler directly at ? (I'm not on the real-time or > digest, but do read the list on the web when I can.) > > Thanks for any suggestions. > > Cheers to the list! > > --pat parsons. > ** 'lro' mailing list information from 'majordomo@Land-Rover.Team.Net' > ** REPLY TO LIST at: lro@Land-Rover.Team.Net > ** lro pages: http://WWW.Land-Rover.Team.Net/ > From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Tue Feb 8 10:57:12 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id KAA28890 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Tue, 8 Feb 2000 10:57:12 -0500 Mime-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2000 07:52:15 -0800 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com From: john hess Subject: who was in Davis? Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org I forgot: Saturday I saw an aluminum colored 88 on Russell Blvd in Davis. Don't know if it was 2a or 3; man driving who didn't see me in Stubby going the other way. Was it someone new in Davis? or someone on the list? cheers, John F. Hess, Davis California jfhess@dcn.davis.ca.us Land Rover Dormobile web pages: http://wheel.dcn.davis.ca.us/~jfhess/homepage.html 1968 Land Rover Dormobile "Elvis" 1960 Land Rover 88 PU "Stubby" 1966 Mercury Monterey "Tillie" From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Tue Feb 8 11:07:19 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id LAA28904 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Tue, 8 Feb 2000 11:07:19 -0500 Message-ID: <38A040DE.B992AB53@mitchellfamily.com> Date: Tue, 08 Feb 2000 08:14:23 -0800 From: Ben Mitchell X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 (Macintosh; U; PPC) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com Subject: Re: Disco Series II experiences References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org A friend of mine's got one and he seems to like it a lot. He's not the type who would tolerate a lot of the idiosyncracies that most of us aren't (overly) bothered by; so I'm thinking he's found it to be pretty solid. I do know that he had a couple of items on a "glitch list" when he first bought it, but LRRC cleared it all up, I believe. I find it to be much nicer than the SI Discos. More comfortable/roomy inside. You can see out the top of the windscreen if you're tall. Quiet, solid ride. -Ben Rick Larson wrote: > > I've got a colleague who is shopping for upper-mid range SUV. He wants > something he can take off-road, but doesn't expect to do much more than > fire roads. > > He looked at the Disco Series II. Any reviews on the quality, reliablity > and/or function of the new Disco. > > Thanks, > > -Rick > -Rick > > Rick Larson > rlarson@dsldesigns.com -- Benjamin DeWitt Mitchell It's Never Over Semio Corporation ben@mitchellfamily.com In a Rover benha@semio.com Y!Messenger: benha1 http://www.semio.com From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Tue Feb 8 11:08:13 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id LAA28922 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Tue, 8 Feb 2000 11:08:13 -0500 Message-ID: <06DEF5772893D311AAF40000F804F44C3F7630@rcexs.cobe.com> From: "Gomes, David" To: "'mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com'" Subject: RE: who was in Davis? Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2000 09:09:14 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org .....Saturday I saw an aluminum colored 88......man driving who didn't see me..... Due to the glare? :^) DG From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Tue Feb 8 13:15:54 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id NAA29009 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Tue, 8 Feb 2000 13:15:54 -0500 Message-ID: <38A05F4C.B8C052C1@ski.org> Date: Tue, 08 Feb 2000 10:24:12 -0800 From: John Brabyn X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com Subject: Re: Mendo_Recce digest: V2 #911 References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Re the idiot light -- it's one of the handy features of RRs that gives you a warning when the brake pads are worn down. Sounds like the bulb is gone, but if you have replaced your brake pads not too long ago you should be safe for a while -- til the next service as they suggest. If not it would be a good idea to visually inspect the pads. Cheers John INFLOWINC@aol.com wrote: > Dear Group, > > As I read the messages I am grateful for all the great info. that gets > exchanged and am sorry that I can't contribute given my lack of technical > knowledge. > > But remain available to help the club out on any other planning, etc. needs. > > I hope someone can provide some feedback on the two foll. issues I have on my > 92 Range Rover County. > > 1. Replacement Shocks...while the current shocks seem OK, the vehicle seems > to bottom out a little too easily. I have 65K miles on orig. shocks. Any > help/suggestions on good replacments. The Rover has had limited off roading > experieince while I prefer a firmer ride around town and highway. > > 2. Dashboard idiot light out---- I noticed the orange light for brake pad > wear on the dash did not illuminate when I turned the key in the ignition. > All the other lights prior to cranking the engine were on. The dealer said it > might just be a loose wire and not to worry about it until next service. > > Many thanks in advance. Hope everyone is having a great and profitable day. > > Vinod S. Kripalani > > Page Plaza, 44 Page Street, Suite #403 > San Francisco, CA 94102 > > Phone: 1-415-565-0600 > Fax: 1-415-522-5887 From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Tue Feb 8 13:44:05 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id NAA29047 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Tue, 8 Feb 2000 13:44:05 -0500 Date: 8 Feb 2000 10:38:37 -0800 Message-Id: From: "Michael Slade" To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com X-Sender: web79245@dreamlab.cc Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Subject: Re: Mendo_Recce digest: V2 #911 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org The idiot light. Ah yes. I had mine come on (flashing) in December coming home from SLC. Got out at the rest area to unplug the front brake sensor plug (the rears had been ripped off by branches), planning on doing pads when I returned home. I inspecte the pads later that week, the pads were fine! Over 80% left! I should have trusted myself because I had just replaced them not too long before. Anyway, I plugged the idiot plug back together and drove on my way. Every once in a while the light will flash, and I wonder if I have a short or if I should just unplug the sensor again. So, I guess it tought me a lesson or two (what they are I have no idea, but it sounded good to end with). Check your pads often! (maybe that's the lesson) Later, Michael Slade Portland, Oregon www.DreamLab.cc From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Tue Feb 8 13:55:28 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id NAA29058 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Tue, 8 Feb 2000 13:55:28 -0500 Message-ID: <006701bf7265$938fc740$6e9ae0d8@jonique> From: "Jonathan Scott Kerry-Tyerman" To: References: Subject: Re: who was in Davis? Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2000 10:50:53 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2919.6600 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2919.6600 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org I've been found out! Well John, that was me in Davis the other day. I'm new to the list, as I just bought that rover not a month ago from Nick Baggarly. A little about myself: I'm a student at Davis in my third year as a computer science major. I'm was born in England but lived in the Bay Area for ten years and then in Germany for another seven. But I remain British, and my interest in Land Rovers goes back to when my older brother bought his first one over ten years ago. Some of you on the list might have heard of him, his name is Simon Trapp, and he lives in Hawaii now. Mable is the first vehicle I've ever owned, I'm proud to admit. I was holding out for a series rover! She's a beautiful RHD 1960 Series II 88 Station Wagon with a soft top. The most fun I've ever had behind the wheel! I've been watching all the witty banter on this list for a couple weeks now, and am clearly out of my league in terms of mechanical know-how. The trips sound very exciting, however, and I'd be thrilled to get out there and get dirty with all of you sometime soon. So, now that I'm initiated, my first question: Does anyone know how to fix the turn-signal switch on the dash? Nick suspects that the switch simply needs tampering with, but I have no idea how to go about that in a productive (well, non-destructive) manner. Oh, and John, is that your rover that's parked in the lot behind Storer sometimes? cheers, Jonathan Scott Kerry-Tyerman Davis, California jskt@ucdavis.edu 1960 Land Rover 88 Series II "Mable" ----- Original Message ----- From: "john hess" To: Sent: Tuesday, February 08, 2000 7:52 AM Subject: who was in Davis? > I forgot: > > Saturday I saw an aluminum colored 88 on Russell Blvd in Davis. > Don't know if it was 2a or 3; man driving who didn't see me in > Stubby going the other way. > > Was it someone new in Davis? or someone on the list? > > cheers, > > > John F. Hess, Davis California jfhess@dcn.davis.ca.us > Land Rover Dormobile web pages: > http://wheel.dcn.davis.ca.us/~jfhess/homepage.html > 1968 Land Rover Dormobile "Elvis" 1960 Land Rover 88 PU "Stubby" > 1966 Mercury Monterey "Tillie" > From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Tue Feb 8 14:10:58 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id OAA29071 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Tue, 8 Feb 2000 14:10:58 -0500 Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2000 11:07:29 -0800 (PST) From: john hess To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com Subject: Re: who was in Davis? In-Reply-To: <006701bf7265$938fc740$6e9ae0d8@jonique> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org > > Oh, and John, is that your rover that's parked in the lot behind Storer > sometimes? > > cheers, > > Jonathan Scott Kerry-Tyerman > Davis, California > jskt@ucdavis.edu > 1960 Land Rover 88 Series II "Mable" Hiya Jonathan Mabel? was blue. Have to ask Jimmy P how to spell Mable, as he coined the name. Am I blind, or did the paint fall off somewhere? About the Rover behind Storer, nope, not me. That's Rob Kerner. Come on Rob, Speak up! About your switch: disconnect the battery, pull the dash, remove the switch, clean it and its contacts and ground, then reassemble. Come to my house, I'll show you. BTW, I have been investigating an electrical anomaly myself. Stubby's heater fan is slow. It started a couple weeks ago, when it wouldn't start up everytime you turned the switch. Sometimes it would, sometimes it wouldn't. If you gavethe fan blade a push, the fan would go but full speed. I checked the power, cleaned the ground and cleaned the switch contacts. I have not pulled the heater yet but fear that is the nextstep. The alternator seems good, voltage is good, so why does the heater fan motor A) not start, and B) not go as fast as before? Thanks, john hess, Davis, California jfhess@dcn.davis.ca.us Dormie web pages at http://dcn.davis.ca.us/~jfhess/startpoint.html From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Tue Feb 8 14:18:35 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id OAA29085 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Tue, 8 Feb 2000 14:18:35 -0500 Message-ID: <014b01bf7267$8701bfe0$214c1f18@hawaii.rr.com> From: "Peter Hope" To: References: Subject: Re: who was in Davis? Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2000 09:05:55 -1000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org > speed. I checked the power, cleaned the ground and cleaned the switch > contacts. I have not pulled the heater yet but fear that is the nextstep. > The alternator seems good, voltage is good, so why does the heater fan > motor A) not start, and B) not go as fast as before? > When it does go, any unusual noise? Try bypassing the switch and put straight power to her and see any difference. If not, I think it may be the motor windings. Pete From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Tue Feb 8 14:28:25 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id OAA29096 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Tue, 8 Feb 2000 14:28:25 -0500 Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2000 12:16:17 -0700 (MST) From: James Howard To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com Subject: Re: Mendo_Recce digest: V2 #911 In-Reply-To: <001301bf71f1$0e5d0f20$9771d4cc@davery> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org On Mon, 7 Feb 2000, Dale W. Avery wrote: > If you really want to do some off-roading/back roading, I would strongly > suggest replacing the originals with a set of Old Man Emu springs (OMEs) > along with a set of Bilstein shocks and a Bilstein steering dampener. You > can get these, along with some good advice from British Pacific, or any of > the other Rover parts sources. The OMEs come in soft, medium, and heavy > rates. Dale, do you know which rate John Benham has on his RR? From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Tue Feb 8 14:43:56 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id OAA29136 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Tue, 8 Feb 2000 14:43:56 -0500 Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.20000208113812.0080c4a0@mail.saber.net> X-Sender: bobnsueb@mail.saber.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (32) Date: Tue, 08 Feb 2000 11:38:12 -0800 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com From: Bob & Sue Bernard Subject: Re: who was in Davis? In-Reply-To: References: <006701bf7265$938fc740$6e9ae0d8@jonique> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org At 11:07 AM 2/8/2000 -0800, you wrote: >BTW, I have been investigating an electrical anomaly myself. Stubby's >heater fan is slow. It started a couple weeks ago, when it wouldn't start >up everytime you turned the switch. Sometimes it would, sometimes it >wouldn't. If you gavethe fan blade a push, the fan would go but full >speed. I checked the power, cleaned the ground and cleaned the switch >contacts. I have not pulled the heater yet but fear that is the nextstep. >The alternator seems good, voltage is good, so why does the heater fan >motor A) not start, and B) not go as fast as before? > >Thanks, >john hess, Davis, California jfhess@dcn.davis.ca.us >Dormie web pages at >http://dcn.davis.ca.us/~jfhess/startpoint.html John, Measure the voltage at the heater motor. Wasn't it a round shin burner? The switch is probably a variable resistor potentiometer. Might just need its contacts cleaned. Then try some oil in the motor bearings. Bob B From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Tue Feb 8 14:45:49 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id OAA29146 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Tue, 8 Feb 2000 14:45:49 -0500 Message-ID: <004201bf726c$6e6c77e0$4836cbcc@johnbenh> From: "John R. Benham" To: References: Subject: Re: Mendo_Recce digest: V2 #911 Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2000 11:41:01 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2919.6600 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2919.6600 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org > On Mon, 7 Feb 2000, Dale W. Avery wrote: > > > If you really want to do some off-roading/back roading, I would strongly > > suggest replacing the originals with a set of Old Man Emu springs (OMEs) > > along with a set of Bilstein shocks and a Bilstein steering dampener. You > > can get these, along with some good advice from British Pacific, or any of > > the other Rover parts sources. The OMEs come in soft, medium, and heavy > > rates. > > Dale, do you know which rate John Benham has on his RR? I have medium OMEs on my 89 R/R. Those along with Bilstein shocks make for a smooth and comfortable hwy car and yet competent off-road. I had the Rancho RS-9000s which are adjustable. On setting 4 (from 1-5), they were awesome for rock crawling, but you felt every bump on the hwy. I sold them to someone on Mendo here. I simply got tired of crawling under the car each time I needed to adjust them. FWIW, John B. From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Tue Feb 8 14:48:13 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id OAA29156 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Tue, 8 Feb 2000 14:48:13 -0500 Message-ID: <38A0752D.3226E80B@ski.org> Date: Tue, 08 Feb 2000 11:57:33 -0800 From: John Brabyn X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com Subject: Re: Mendo_Recce digest: V2 #911 References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Like nearly every idiot light on the RR, the lesson is, if it comes on, 90% of the time it is the sensor itself or the wiring to it that's at fault. BUT -- better stop and check it out just in case it really is the indicated problem (overheating, brakeless, etc)! CHeers John Cheers John Michael Slade wrote: > The idiot light. Ah yes. > > I had mine come on (flashing) in December coming home from SLC. Got out at > the rest area to unplug the front brake sensor plug (the rears had been > ripped off by branches), planning on doing pads when I returned home. > > I inspecte the pads later that week, the pads were fine! Over 80% left! I > should have trusted myself because I had just replaced them not too long > before. Anyway, I plugged the idiot plug back together and drove on my > way. Every once in a while the light will flash, and I wonder if I have a > short or if I should just unplug the sensor again. > > So, I guess it tought me a lesson or two (what they are I have no idea, but > it sounded good to end with). > > Check your pads often! (maybe that's the lesson) > > Later, > > Michael Slade > Portland, Oregon > www.DreamLab.cc From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Tue Feb 8 14:49:54 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id OAA29170 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Tue, 8 Feb 2000 14:49:54 -0500 Message-ID: <06DEF5772893D311AAF40000F804F44C3F763D@rcexs.cobe.com> From: "Gomes, David" To: "'mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com'" Subject: RE: who was in Davis? Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2000 12:50:57 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org "...Does anyone know how to fix the turn-signal switch on the dash?..." Ah! A reluctant trafficator, 'eh? Sorry, never had one apart, but I just like to use the word Trafficator, so I had to reply.. :^) Others more knowledgeable have already given the correct advice anyway. If you didn't get them with the truck, keep an eye out for a used set of factory workshop manuals. I have a duplicate of one half (can't remember whether it's the engine, or non-engine half) that's pretty ratty, but better than nothing. I'd be happy to donate it to such a worthy cause. Once you're armed with those books, and the advice of the fine folks on the mendo and lro lists, there's nothing the Land Rover needs that you can't do yourself with a little thought, care, and humility. If you don't have the last part yet, it will be induced by the vehicle shortly! You're lucky to know about your fondness for Land Rovers so early in life. It took me 15 years and about as many other vehicles before I "got religion". But I didn't become a real "holy roller" till I got the 109 from Zack Arbios last year. Some entertainment here: http://www.d-90.com/trail/index.html Under "Desert Trek 1999" Very nice to make your e-acquaintance, Jonathan, -Dave G. -Bailey, CO From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Tue Feb 8 15:00:43 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id PAA29181 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Tue, 8 Feb 2000 15:00:43 -0500 Message-ID: <38A07615.3F34EA5A@slip.net> Date: Tue, 08 Feb 2000 12:01:25 -0800 From: Mehdi and Christine X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (Win95; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com Subject: Re: Springtime Desert Trip References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Christine, Ariana and I are interested also. Mehdi From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Tue Feb 8 15:01:44 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id PAA29193 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Tue, 8 Feb 2000 15:01:44 -0500 Message-ID: <000501bf7270$08a81500$7500000a@kpk01> From: "Kevin Kelly" To: "Mendo List" Subject: 1992 Range Rover Questions Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2000 09:33:32 -0800 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2120.0 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2120.0 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Vinod Kripalani wrote: :Replacement Shocks...while the current shocks seem OK, :the vehicle seems to bottom out a little too easily. I have :65K miles on orig. shocks. Any help/suggestions on good :replacements. The Rover has had limited off roading :experience while I prefer a firmer ride around town and highway. I strongly recommend the Bilstein shocks for any coil sprung Land Rover with a stock suspension. Bilstein also makes a great steering stabilizer, odds are if your shocks are bad it's also time to replace the steering stabilizer. :Dashboard idiot light out---- I noticed the orange light for :brake pad wear on the dash did not illuminate when I turned :the key in the ignition. All the other lights prior to cranking the :engine were on. The dealer said it might just be a loose wire :and not to worry about it until next service. It may be a burned out bulb, you can pop the back off the dash pod and swap bulbs in under a minute (make sure to keep the red base bulb in the same socket). If swapping bulbs does not work you have a typical Range Rover that does not light ALL the lights during the check bulb sequence at start up. My Range Rover usually lights most of the lights (all the bulbs are good) but sometimes only lights half of them. This is a common Range Rover fault, but not something to care about since the lights will still come on when they are supposed to. Kevin Kelly From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Tue Feb 8 15:02:02 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id PAA29203 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Tue, 8 Feb 2000 15:02:02 -0500 Message-ID: <000401bf7270$07725420$7500000a@kpk01> From: "Kevin Kelly" To: "Mendo List" Subject: AcryClean Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2000 09:11:43 -0800 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2120.0 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2120.0 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Kelly M wrote: :AcryClean (Acrylic cleaner made by PPG/Ditzler) works very :well at cleaning paint between coats Any idea if this stuff goes bad, I have some that I have been using before I spray paint stuff for years. It just occurred to me that it was almost 20 years ago that I bought it at San Carlos Paint to do the prep and body work on my 1965 Mustang (I had Miracle in San Mateo do the final paint with one of their 99.99 coupons). Kevin Kelly From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Tue Feb 8 15:06:48 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id PAA29218 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Tue, 8 Feb 2000 15:06:48 -0500 Message-ID: <06DEF5772893D311AAF40000F804F44C3F7640@rcexs.cobe.com> From: "Gomes, David" To: "'mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com'" Subject: RE: Springtime Desert Trip Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2000 13:07:37 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org I told TAW, but not the list I guess. If I can tack this onto one end or the other of one of my San Diego trips (about every other week) I'd like to see if I can do a ride along with someone. This mountain boy is suffering desert withdrawl! Only not-doable weekends for me right now are 2/26 and 3/11, but don't let me be a factor in your decision. -Dave G. From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Tue Feb 8 15:40:25 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id PAA29237 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Tue, 8 Feb 2000 15:40:25 -0500 Message-ID: <16D03631929FD311BC5D009027D0CBB24ADA@vegmail.ucdavis.edu> From: "Kerner, Rob" To: "'mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com'" Subject: re:whowas in Davis Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2000 12:40:02 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Yes that would be Regent. I am in class all week and because of the way they have the network setup, we get no internet connection, hence no email. Anyway. I am in 148 Asmundson hall, come by sometime. Regent is staying home for now becuase his newly rebuilt alterntor stopped alternating. As for trafficators, David, the Rovers don't have them. If you want to see trafficator take a look at an old Morris Minor. Trafficator= an arm like device that points to your direction(kind of a mechanical version of sticking your arm out the window. THe morris had them with a nice light at the end just behind the driver in the dooor post. -Rob From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Tue Feb 8 15:48:44 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id PAA29247 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Tue, 8 Feb 2000 15:48:44 -0500 Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.20000208124333.0080e460@mail.saber.net> X-Sender: bobnsueb@mail.saber.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (32) Date: Tue, 08 Feb 2000 12:43:33 -0800 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com From: Bob & Sue Bernard Subject: re:whowas in Davis In-Reply-To: <16D03631929FD311BC5D009027D0CBB24ADA@vegmail.ucdavis.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org At 12:40 PM 2/8/2000 -0800, you wrote: >Yes that would be Regent. I am in class all week and because of the way >they have the network setup, we get no internet connection, hence no email. >Anyway. I am in 148 Asmundson hall, come by sometime. Regent is staying >home for now becuase his newly rebuilt alterntor stopped alternating. > >As for trafficators, David, the Rovers don't have them. If you want to see >trafficator take a look at an old Morris Minor. Trafficator= an arm like >device that points to your direction(kind of a mechanical version of >sticking your arm out the window. THe morris had them with a nice light at >the end just behind the driver in the dooor post. > >-Rob Some in England do have Trafficators, and Mabel came from there. Bob B From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Tue Feb 8 16:15:29 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id QAA29261 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Tue, 8 Feb 2000 16:15:29 -0500 From: Zaxcoinc@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2000 16:11:26 EST Subject: Re: who was in Davis? To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 45 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org In a message dated 2/8/00 7:56:18 AM Pacific Standard Time, jfhess@dcn.davis.ca.us writes: > Was it someone new in Davis? or someone on the list? That would be Sacramentan Richard Green, a real estate guy developer and finance related. It is a Series Three, I talked to him last summer (his daughter is in horse shows with my wife), and he was installing an Iron Duke or somesuch. He had a connection to some guys in Oregon who were installing them in some racing vehicle. Zack From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Tue Feb 8 16:31:14 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id QAA29279 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Tue, 8 Feb 2000 16:31:14 -0500 Message-ID: <06DEF5772893D311AAF40000F804F44C3F7641@rcexs.cobe.com> From: "Gomes, David" To: "'mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com'" Subject: RE: who was in Davis Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2000 14:31:33 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org "...As for trafficators, David, the Rovers don't have them....." Oh, really? I thought the arms were called "semaphores", like the trains use as switch/crossing signals. I thought I'd even seen pictures of some early Series Is with these mounted to the top corners of the windscreen. Where is my continental dictionary! :^) I originally picked up the trafficator term when riding with dad in the old '52 Jag. It had a little lever on the dash, like some LRs, and when you turned the lever, a light on the dash would flash with the letters "TRF". When this, at the time, 7ish year old mind had trouble with the link from TRF to turn signals, Dad explained that it stood for "Trafficator", a brit term for turn signals. I never fully explored the roots of the terminology. Maybe it was just a hold over from the term for semaphores used on cars.....hmmm :^) -Dave G. From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Tue Feb 8 16:33:26 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id QAA29289 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Tue, 8 Feb 2000 16:33:26 -0500 Message-Id: <200002082128.NAA21627@proxy4.ba.best.com> Comments: Authenticated sender is From: "Tom Walsh" To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2000 13:26:56 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Re: who was in Davis? X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.31) Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org > The alternator seems good, voltage is good, so why does the heater fan > motor A) not start, and B) not go as fast as before? > Could be bearings on the motor are mostly shot... Mynes the same way After the big rebuild last year. I thought it some how broke... Turns out it the wires were never re-hooked back up.. I hooked it up and it it still didn't work ( So I gave it a slight smack... ( no... "a special" smack. don't try it at home unless you know what your doing! This was similar to an old misbehaving TV smack, but its for motors! ) ) At any rate it started up, it runs good enough now, but its a tad noisy.. I suspect a GM heater fan is in my future! ( plus who needs heat! This is California! ) TomW > Thanks, > > > > john hess, Davis, California jfhess@dcn.davis.ca.us > Dormie web pages at > http://dcn.davis.ca.us/~jfhess/startpoint.html > > > *---------*---------* "Tonka" Truck, Lil Buggar, Lt Brigade, Posh,.. LandRovers "I love the smell of Null pointers in the morning" tomw@best.com, twalsh@redback.com From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Tue Feb 8 16:40:58 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id QAA29300 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Tue, 8 Feb 2000 16:40:58 -0500 From: Zaxcoinc@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2000 16:35:13 EST Subject: Re: who was in Davis? To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 45 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org In a message dated 2/8/00 1:14:13 PM Pacific Standard Time, Zaxcoinc@aol.com writes: > That would be Sacramentan Richard Green This would make me look a bit foolish, but what the heck! Based on the prior posts anyway. What is the world coming to though, In the Central Valley of the great State of California, we have TWO polished aluminum Series vehicles. I think that this is just too unthinkable. In the great eccentric Rover Owner tradition, I suggest humbly that one of them get a really cool metalflake paint job, with flames and racing stripe, so that we can tell these people apart. Zack It's not that which we know, it what we know that is just plain wrong. From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Tue Feb 8 16:43:05 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id QAA29310 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Tue, 8 Feb 2000 16:43:05 -0500 Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.20000208134215.008291c0@pacific.net> X-Sender: gpool@pacific.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (32) Date: Tue, 08 Feb 2000 13:42:15 -0800 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com From: Granville Pool Subject: Shocks, was Re: 1992 Range Rover Questions In-Reply-To: <000501bf7270$08a81500$7500000a@kpk01> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Vinod Kripalani wrote: >:Replacement Shocks...while the current shocks seem OK, >:the vehicle seems to bottom out a little too easily. I have >:65K miles on orig. shocks. Any help/suggestions on good >:replacements. The Rover has had limited off roading >:experience while I prefer a firmer ride around town and highway. Kevin Kelly wrote: >I strongly recommend the Bilstein shocks for any coil sprung Land Rover >with a stock suspension. Bilstein also makes a great steering >stabilizer, odds are if your shocks are bad it's also time to replace >the steering stabilizer. I said about the same thing and so did some others. Bilsteins are popular among those on this list. However, I just ran across a comparison discussion on BP's website that is sort of interesting reading. It's at: http://britpac.frazmtn.com/icaweb/britpac.nsf/b141befe8fb1c2ea882564360001be 0c/4ff98194c7f235ec8825687f0063af15?OpenDocument Or if you can't follow that complicated URL, go to http://britpac.frazmtn.com then click on the FAQ button, then follow the links for, "Why don't we carry Bilsteins?" or similar. One point made by BP in that comparison I can attest to, namely, that Bilsteins are harsher than the Woodheads on small bumps. My wife complains about that every time we hit a bump. Cheers, Granny who has Bilsteins on his '92 RR From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Tue Feb 8 17:20:56 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id RAA29342 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Tue, 8 Feb 2000 17:20:56 -0500 Message-ID: <06DEF5772893D311AAF40000F804F44C3F7646@rcexs.cobe.com> From: "Gomes, David" To: "'mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com'" Subject: RE: who was in Davis? Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2000 15:20:56 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org > Zack > It's not that which we know, it what we know that is just plain wrong. > Yer killin' me! :^) I vote purple 'flake w. neon green flames.... DG From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Tue Feb 8 17:43:14 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id RAA29357 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Tue, 8 Feb 2000 17:43:14 -0500 Message-ID: <38A09CCC.6BA535D6@ski.org> Date: Tue, 08 Feb 2000 14:46:36 -0800 From: John Brabyn X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com Subject: Re: Shocks, was Re: 1992 Range Rover Questions References: <3.0.6.32.20000208134215.008291c0@pacific.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Well said Granny -- The Bilsteins are probably best if you like a "sportier" ride and I expect the aftermarket folks sell a lot of them to people who are used to firmer riding vehicles. Personally I like the soft ride of the original which, in the immortal words of Four Wheeler magazine in Feb 1989, "whomps a Caddy". Cheers John Granville Pool wrote: > Vinod Kripalani wrote: > > >:Replacement Shocks...while the current shocks seem OK, > >:the vehicle seems to bottom out a little too easily. I have > >:65K miles on orig. shocks. Any help/suggestions on good > >:replacements. The Rover has had limited off roading > >:experience while I prefer a firmer ride around town and highway. > Kevin Kelly wrote: > > >I strongly recommend the Bilstein shocks for any coil sprung Land Rover > >with a stock suspension. Bilstein also makes a great steering > >stabilizer, odds are if your shocks are bad it's also time to replace > >the steering stabilizer. > > I said about the same thing and so did some others. Bilsteins are popular > among those on this list. However, I just ran across a comparison > discussion on BP's website that is sort of interesting reading. It's at: > http://britpac.frazmtn.com/icaweb/britpac.nsf/b141befe8fb1c2ea882564360001be > 0c/4ff98194c7f235ec8825687f0063af15?OpenDocument > > Or if you can't follow that complicated URL, go to > http://britpac.frazmtn.com then click on the FAQ button, then follow the > links for, "Why don't we carry Bilsteins?" or similar. > > One point made by BP in that comparison I can attest to, namely, that > Bilsteins are harsher than the Woodheads on small bumps. My wife complains > about that every time we hit a bump. > > Cheers, > > Granny who has Bilsteins on his '92 RR From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Tue Feb 8 18:04:25 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id SAA29382 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Tue, 8 Feb 2000 18:04:25 -0500 Message-ID: <06DEF5772893D311AAF40000F804F44C3F7649@rcexs.cobe.com> From: "Gomes, David" To: "'mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com'" Subject: RE: Shocks, was Re: 1992 Range Rover Questions Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2000 15:44:43 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org ....."whomps a Caddy".... Proves my certifiable insanity, as I'm trying to get my Disco to ride more like my old Defender.... :^( -Dave G. From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Tue Feb 8 18:05:19 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id SAA29392 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Tue, 8 Feb 2000 18:05:19 -0500 Message-ID: From: "Rose, Randy" To: "'mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com'" Subject: Series II turn sigmal repair Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2000 14:55:15 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Jonathan, I've periodically rebuilt mine, and if yours is similar, the following applies: Inside is a leather plunger like an old bicycle pump, which provides the time delay turn off function. How fast it returns to the off position depends on how much air is let through the hole in the back. Adjustment is made by turning the turning the small brass screw in the hole in the center of the back. The screw is cone shaped on the inside, and compress a bit of cotton to control the air flow back in. The oil on the leather diaphragm usually dries out over time, and the leather either binds or doesn't keep an air seal any longer, making the switch return to off immediately. It's pretty straight forward to disassemble. Remove from the panel, and I think there are three screws on the back. They may be under the wire retaining screws. Clean the leather and rejuvenate it with oil. I've also used Vaseline, but it seems to dry out again after a few years. The last time, I used grease to lubricate the leather and parts. Clean out the air vent in the back and check the cotton. Adjust for a suitable return speed. One word of caution: be very gentle on the nut fixing the switch to the dash. The threaded bushing that goes through the mounting hold is brittle Bakelite and part of the switch body. Don't over tighten it! Randy '57 107 Station Wagon, Pasadena -----Original Message----- From: Jonathan Scott Kerry-Tyerman [mailto:jskt@ucdavis.edu] Sent: Tuesday, February 08, 2000 10:51 AM To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com Subject: Re: who was in Davis? So, now that I'm initiated, my first question: Does anyone know how to fix the turn-signal switch on the dash? Nick suspects that the switch simply needs tampering with, but I have no idea how to go about that in a productive (well, non-destructive) manner. Oh, and John, is that your rover that's parked in the lot behind Storer sometimes? cheers, Jonathan Scott Kerry-Tyerman Davis, California jskt@ucdavis.edu 1960 Land Rover 88 Series II "Mable" From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Tue Feb 8 18:32:23 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id SAA29412 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Tue, 8 Feb 2000 18:32:23 -0500 Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2000 16:14:23 -0700 (MST) From: James Howard To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com Subject: Re: Shocks, was Re: 1992 Range Rover Questions In-Reply-To: <3.0.6.32.20000208134215.008291c0@pacific.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org On Tue, 8 Feb 2000, Granville Pool wrote: > One point made by BP in that comparison I can attest to, namely, that > Bilsteins are harsher than the Woodheads on small bumps. My wife complains > about that every time we hit a bump. Since Kelly has a herniated disc in her neck, when we leave the pavement, we can't drive more than an hour or so before she starts complaining about the pain. We are running OEM Woodheads, but have Discovery springs in the rear which are significantly stiffer. They were free, however, so I used them. Real soon now, I want to put the proper rear springs into our 89 RR. From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Tue Feb 8 20:23:42 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id UAA29498 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Tue, 8 Feb 2000 20:23:42 -0500 Message-Id: <200002090121.RAA07446@blackie.cruzers.com> Subject: RE: who was in Davis Date: Tue, 8 Feb 00 17:24:38 -0800 x-sender: twakeman@mail.cruzers.com x-mailer: Claris Emailer 2.0, March 15, 1997 From: TeriAnn Wakeman To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org >"...As for trafficators, David, the Rovers don't have them....." Trafficators are the little turn signal switches that are mounted on the instrument panels of series I and II (not A) Land Rovers. With the Series IIA Rover switched to a column mounted turn signal lever. Semaphores are the doo dads that stick out the side instead of turn signal lamps on the wings. TeriAnn http://www.overlander.net The world's most complete set of links connecting Rover 4X4 owners with Rover parts, service, accessory & sales companies world wide. From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Tue Feb 8 22:31:29 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id WAA29530 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Tue, 8 Feb 2000 22:31:29 -0500 From: GElam30092@aol.com Message-ID: <99.1046132.25d22589@aol.com> Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2000 21:06:01 EST Subject: Re: Springtime Desert Trip To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 45 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org In a message dated 2/8/00 1:05:56 PM US Mountain Standard Time, David.Gomes@us.gambro.com writes: << Only not-doable weekends for me right now are 2/26 and 3/11, but don't let me be a factor in your decision. >> That doesn't exclude March 17th which is a date suggested. Others? Get yer calendars out....... Cheers, Gerry From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Tue Feb 8 22:43:55 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id WAA29541 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Tue, 8 Feb 2000 22:43:55 -0500 Message-ID: <000201bf72a4$25c78920$7500000a@kpk01> From: "Kevin Kelly" To: "Mendo List" Subject: Bilstein Shocks Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2000 16:03:49 -0800 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2120.0 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2120.0 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Response to BPs Bilstein comments: Steve wrote: :British Pacific tries to carry only OEM quality or better, regardless :of the source or manufacturer It is not tough to get better than OEM since I have never heard of a worse shock than the OEM Woodhead. I am amazed how often Woodhead shocks with under 20K totally fail (not just wear out, but have no dampening) this is based on personal observation and reports from people on the net over the past five years. The Woodhead shocks that the PO of my RR had installed at the dealer (who charged him more per shock than Bilsteins cost) not only failed, but they made gurgling sounds (only one of the four had a little bit of dampening left). :The fist thing you'll notice is how much smaller in diameter the Bilstein :is than the other two. it's also much lighter: the Bilstein weighs 5 lbs.+ADs- :the stock replacement weighs 6 lbs Guess what the Bilstein is a gas shock and the Woodhead is an oil shock, I bet the oil weighs more than the gas. The Bilstein is also a monotube (IMHO superior) design so it is smaller. I have never heard of a stock coil sprung Land Rover breaking a shock and after reading the BMW and Land Rover lists for 5 years the only Bilstein problem I can remember was on Scott Bronson's Range Rover where they were spinning (and replaced under warrantee for free). :Secondly look at the bushings: Blistiens have these very small :rubber bushes. The stock one has rubber bushes almost 50 percent :larger, and of course the Emu's come with polyurethane The Bilsteins have smaller bushings, because that is as big as they need to be. Woodhead must buy their rubber from the same place Land Rover gets it since the bushings seem to rot a lot faster than the rubber Bilstein uses. Unless you are building a race car (or want to avoid the nightmare of series rubber leaf spring bushing removal) I would stay away from polyurethane as a bushing material. Rubber is great at absorbing small vibrations while poly transmits vibrations. Factory bac ked race cars from BMW and MBZ don't even use poly bushings (they use hard rubber) since the extra vibrations from poly make the already rough ride rougher for the drivers. :While Bilsteins do come with a lifetime warranty (compared to 2 :years with Emu and one year for Genuine) we haven't had more :than half a dozen Emu shocks replaced in the last 3 years On line it seems like I have heard of at least a dozen people with early OME failure. Kevin Kelly No I don't work for Bilstein, I've just been buying them for 15 years. Bilsteins have such a great reputation (and the lifetime warrantee) that they often add to resale value years after you buy them. From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Tue Feb 8 23:26:23 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id XAA29557 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Tue, 8 Feb 2000 23:26:23 -0500 Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2000 19:43:02 -0700 (MST) From: James Howard To: Mendo List Subject: Re: Bilstein Shocks In-Reply-To: <000201bf72a4$25c78920$7500000a@kpk01> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org The set of Woodheads on our 89 RR when we bought her lasted for another 25,000 miles. When I pulled them off, they were very hard to move by hand, but the action was smooth over the travel of the damper. However, the front axle would get a real workout on less than perfect roads at 75. The second set of fronts lasted for 50K miles, and they seem fine when I pulled them off, except for the same hop at speed. The rears have 60K on them now and still seem fine. I don't know if I will change brands of dampers the next time I need them, or not. It would be nice to do a side by side comparison, though. From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Tue Feb 8 23:43:59 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id XAA29568 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Tue, 8 Feb 2000 23:43:59 -0500 From: GElam30092@aol.com Message-ID: <68.156f70b.25d224b6@aol.com> Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2000 21:02:30 EST Subject: Re: Springtime Desert Trip To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 45 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org In a message dated 2/8/00 12:59:45 PM US Mountain Standard Time, msandcdg@slip.net writes: << Christine, Ariana and I are interested also. >> Excellent...... anyone want to suggest a date?! Cheers, Gerry From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Wed Feb 9 00:18:40 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id AAA30078 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Wed, 9 Feb 2000 00:18:40 -0500 Message-ID: <002d01bf72a7$efcf2c20$8371d4cc@davery> From: "Dale W. Avery" To: References: Subject: Re: Mendo_Recce digest: V2 #911 Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2000 18:46:30 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2919.6600 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2919.6600 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Hi James, I don't think John has OME's on his '89. Dale ----- Original Message ----- From: "James Howard" To: Sent: Tuesday, February 08, 2000 11:16 AM Subject: Re: Mendo_Recce digest: V2 #911 > > On Mon, 7 Feb 2000, Dale W. Avery wrote: > > > If you really want to do some off-roading/back roading, I would strongly > > suggest replacing the originals with a set of Old Man Emu springs (OMEs) > > along with a set of Bilstein shocks and a Bilstein steering dampener. You > > can get these, along with some good advice from British Pacific, or any of > > the other Rover parts sources. The OMEs come in soft, medium, and heavy > > rates. > > Dale, do you know which rate John Benham has on his RR? > > From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Wed Feb 9 01:20:52 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id BAA30233 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Wed, 9 Feb 2000 01:20:52 -0500 From: LRDino@aol.com Message-ID: <70.fbf4ac.25d25fe3@aol.com> Date: Wed, 9 Feb 2000 01:14:59 EST Subject: Re: Mendo_Recce digest: V2 #913 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 47 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Hey Mehdi. Good to be back. Still own the 95 5 speed Disco which turned 81,000 miles today. Cya on trail soon. Dino From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Wed Feb 9 02:05:25 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id CAA30250 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Wed, 9 Feb 2000 02:05:25 -0500 From: "Kelly Minnick" To: Subject: RE: AcryClean Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2000 23:06:34 -0800 Message-ID: <000001bf72cc$32d86300$3505193f@minnick> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2173.0 In-Reply-To: <000401bf7270$07725420$7500000a@kpk01> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Importance: Normal Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org I used up some I had back in '79 when I painted my first car. Used it up a summer or 2 ago. Worked fine. It doesn't seem to flash like solvents, so I imagine if the cap has been in place, it will work just fine. Later, Kelly Minnick > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com > [mailto:owner-mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com]On Behalf Of Kevin Kelly > Sent: Tuesday, February 08, 2000 9:12 AM > To: Mendo List > Subject: AcryClean > > > Kelly M wrote: > > :AcryClean (Acrylic cleaner made by PPG/Ditzler) works very > :well at cleaning paint between coats > > Any idea if this stuff goes bad, I have some that I have been using > before I spray paint stuff for years. It just occurred to me that it > was almost 20 years ago that I bought it at San Carlos Paint to do the > prep and body work on my 1965 Mustang (I had Miracle in San Mateo do the > final paint with one of their 99.99 coupons). > > Kevin Kelly > > > From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Wed Feb 9 09:44:00 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id JAA30555 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Wed, 9 Feb 2000 09:44:00 -0500 Message-Id: <200002091441.GAA07586@blackie.cruzers.com> Subject: Re: Bilstein Shocks Date: Wed, 9 Feb 00 06:44:25 -0800 x-sender: twakeman@mail.cruzers.com x-mailer: Claris Emailer 2.0, March 15, 1997 From: TeriAnn Wakeman To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org >It is not tough to get better than OEM since I have never heard of a >worse shock than the OEM Woodhead. I am amazed how often Woodhead >shocks with under 20K totally fail (not just wear out, but have no >dampening) this is based on personal observation and reports from people >on the net over the past five years. Here is another data point: When I purchased The Green Rover in '78 most everything was worn out. I went through the car replacing worn parts & tightning things up. When I got to the Woodhead shocks, I noticed that they still had lots of resistance and just replaced the worn elongated bushings leaving the shocks in place. In the mid eighties I was driving through a field to cut some firewood and located a bunch of old barbed wire left in a pile from being removed from a fence. The grass had grown higher then the pile of loose wire. The wire wound itself around multiple wheels & axles and brought the Rover to a halt. One shock was bent. As a result, I replaced a pair of Woodhead shocks with a new pair. The shocks on the other end were still OK. In 1997 I switched to one ton springs and extended shackles. Because of the added height, I needed to install longer shocks. I finaly replaced a pair of Woodhead shocks that was on the car when I purchased her 19 years previously, and the pair I purchased in the mid eighties. All four Woodhead shocks were still in very good working condition. I replaced the old Woodhead shocks with new Woodheads spec'ed for military 109s that had the long shackles from the factory. In the following year (end Aug '97 to end Aug '98) I spent a total of 20 weeks living in The Green Rover in the field on long trips. To date the longer Woodhead shocks are working just fine. >The Bilsteins have smaller bushings, because that is as big as they need >to be. Woodhead must buy their rubber from the same place Land Rover >gets it since the bushings seem to rot a lot faster than the rubber >Bilstein uses. I have replaced a lot of woodhead shock bushings over the years using new genuine bushings. I've never seen rotted rubber. What I have seen is an enlargening and elongating of the centre hole. I'm certainly not a materials engineer but this may have more to do with elasticity of the rubber bushings. I believe the elasticity also affects dampening of high frequency shocks. Since shock bushings are easy to replace I've just looked at them as suspension consumables on a threeish year replacment schedule. >No I don't work for Bilstein, I've just been buying them for 15 years. >Bilsteins have such a great reputation (and the lifetime warrantee) that >they often add to resale value years after you buy them. Hmm It never occured to me to sell the old shocks afer removing them. Well 22 years of owning and driving the same LR, I have gone through 6 Woodhead shocks, A pair from the rear end because I broke one and replaced it as a pair, and four good shocks because I needed longer shocks. I have never had one go soft. Just another data point. TeriAnn Wakeman If you send me direct mail, please Santa Cruz, California start the subject line with TW - twakeman@cruzers.com I will be sure to read the message http://www.shadow-catcher.net <- Photography for sale http://www.overlander.net <- Web directory for Land Rover http://www.cruzers.com/~twakeman <- My personal web site "In the world of type A & type B drivers consider me a type C gypsy traveler. Destinations are optional and not necessarily desirable." From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Wed Feb 9 10:25:17 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id KAA30641 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Wed, 9 Feb 2000 10:25:17 -0500 Message-ID: <06DEF5772893D311AAF40000F804F44C3F7654@rcexs.cobe.com> From: "Gomes, David" To: "'mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com'" Subject: RE: Bilstein Shocks Date: Wed, 9 Feb 2000 08:25:36 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org A few, inconsequential points..... ".....Guess what the Bilstein is a gas shock and the Woodhead is an oil shock, > I bet the oil weighs more than the gas......" > Both use oil as the damping fluid. The gas shock just charges the air space above the oil with a pressurized gas to keep the oil from aerating under high speed cycling. Not effecting the weight much. Kevin was right, it's the monotube package that make's 'em smaller and lighter (and more efficient at dissipating the shock's worst enemy...heat). But, this comes at the price of being a little more fragile, as a, say, rock hit, to the outer body directly effects the tube the piston is riding in. On a dual-tube shock there's an oil space between the outer tube and the one the piston's riding in, so a hit to the body may not effect the shock's operation. TAW had great experiences with the Woodheads on the Green Rover. But, I think the Range Rover shock sees quite a bit different working environment on the coiler, especially with regard to speed (which again is a major contributor to heat in the shock), and small high frequency movements. It could be that the design of the Woodheads is ideally suited to the work they see on a series LR, where a more modern design might better serve the demands of the Rangie. On the bit about rubber bushings, It sure would be interesting to go back and get in the designer's heads about why they are the size they are. There are a million possible explanations. But, I couldn't help thinking, that maybe, if they weren't so big, there might not be as much rubber to give way, and the holes might not round out so fast. Anybody wanna sleeve the eyes and try a smaller bushing? :^) Probably not a good idea as the big bushings probably serve a lot of purposes that would be compromised in that quest for longevity. I love to remember that the series trucks were designed in a time when owners manuals had a list of a dozen things to check before every TRIP, the weekly maintenance list was as long as your arm, and there was a grease gun mounted under the hood. (the '50 Jag, which also had a 14qt. sump of engine oil to be changed monthly) :^) Land Rovers are more robust than most from their era, but disposable components were part of the plan. Morning musings...... -Dave G. From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Wed Feb 9 17:50:45 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id RAA31166 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Wed, 9 Feb 2000 17:50:45 -0500 Date: 9 Feb 2000 14:38:30 -0800 Message-Id: From: "Michael Slade" To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com X-Sender: web79245@dreamlab.cc Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Subject: PSP (Pierced Steel Planking) Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org All, These guys have those cool 'sand ladders' but are made out of steel. I have a pair that Ben Smith donated while visiting Oregon several years ago, and I use them for scaffolding. Some use them for getting out of mud or sand. Anyway, to look at the stuff, and maybe even buy some, check out... http://www.harvestsite.com/calumet/psp.htm Don't ask how I found it.... Michael Slade Portland, Oregon www.DreamLab.cc From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Wed Feb 9 20:58:28 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id UAA31433 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Wed, 9 Feb 2000 20:58:28 -0500 Message-ID: <001f01bf7368$be751380$f9916bce@davery> From: "Dale W. Avery" To: References: <06DEF5772893D311AAF40000F804F44C3F7654@rcexs.cobe.com> Subject: Axles gone in RR Date: Wed, 9 Feb 2000 17:47:08 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2919.6600 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2919.6600 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org I thought everyone would like to know about this. My '90 RR now has just over 101 K on the clock. I had it out to the Land Rover dealership here in Spokane to repair/replace a swivel seal and a rear seal. Here's what I got. First the swivel seal was leaking because it, and several other parts had been poorly installed by a local mechanic. He had even forgotten to tighten the lock washer! I had had a different repair shop do work on the rear diff. about a year ago. They had screwed up the installation of the dust guard and rear seals. When the local LR mechanic got into the thing, he noticed a LOT of wear on the rear axle and hub. He checked out the right side also and found the same thing. Both hubs were full of cracks and were beginning to break apart, the teeth on the axles were heavily worn and I could see where they were deforming. I remember all this talk about series rigs having trouble with axle wear. I just want to warn all my coiler friends to check their axles/hubs too. fortunately for me, the situation wass corrected before anything gave way. It could have become pretty costly in a hurry and/or left me out in the boonies! I have learned (again!) a very important lesson from all this. I would have saved a lot of money had I brought my RR into the dealership for the servicing in the first place. As it is, I ended up double paying for a lot of parts and labor. The local dealership gives a pretty good discount to members of PCRC and drops a significant amount off the hourly charge for labor. Iwas also charged only for hours worked. Hopefully the axles will now be good for another 100 K :-) Dale ----- Original Message ----- From: "Gomes, David" To: Sent: Wednesday, February 09, 2000 7:25 AM Subject: RE: Bilstein Shocks > A few, inconsequential points..... > > ".....Guess what the Bilstein is a gas shock and the Woodhead is an > oil shock, > > I bet the oil weighs more than the gas......" > > > Both use oil as the damping fluid. The gas shock just charges the air space > above the oil with a pressurized gas to keep the oil from aerating under > high speed cycling. Not effecting the weight much. Kevin was right, it's > the monotube package that make's 'em smaller and lighter (and more efficient > at dissipating the shock's worst enemy...heat). But, this comes at the > price of being a little more fragile, as a, say, rock hit, to the outer body > directly effects the tube the piston is riding in. On a dual-tube shock > there's an oil space between the outer tube and the one the piston's riding > in, so a hit to the body may not effect the shock's operation. > > TAW had great experiences with the Woodheads on the Green Rover. But, I > think the Range Rover shock sees quite a bit different working environment > on the coiler, especially with regard to speed (which again is a major > contributor to heat in the shock), and small high frequency movements. It > could be that the design of the Woodheads is ideally suited to the work they > see on a series LR, where a more modern design might better serve the > demands of the Rangie. > > On the bit about rubber bushings, It sure would be interesting to go back > and get in the designer's heads about why they are the size they are. There > are a million possible explanations. But, I couldn't help thinking, that > maybe, if they weren't so big, there might not be as much rubber to give > way, and the holes might not round out so fast. Anybody wanna sleeve the > eyes and try a smaller bushing? :^) Probably not a good idea as the big > bushings probably serve a lot of purposes that would be compromised in that > quest for longevity. > > I love to remember that the series trucks were designed in a time when > owners manuals had a list of a dozen things to check before every TRIP, the > weekly maintenance list was as long as your arm, and there was a grease gun > mounted under the hood. (the '50 Jag, which also had a 14qt. sump of engine > oil to be changed monthly) :^) Land Rovers are more robust than most from > their era, but disposable components were part of the plan. > > Morning musings...... > > -Dave G. > > From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Wed Feb 9 21:30:37 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id VAA31470 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Wed, 9 Feb 2000 21:30:37 -0500 Message-Id: <4.1.20000209181926.00b50c00@mail.halcyon.com> X-Sender: clarkebw@mail.halcyon.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.1 Date: Wed, 09 Feb 2000 18:23:44 -0800 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com From: Clarke Williams Subject: Re: Axles gone in RR In-Reply-To: <001f01bf7368$be751380$f9916bce@davery> References: <06DEF5772893D311AAF40000F804F44C3F7654@rcexs.cobe.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Dale, I would say you that you failed to learn the MOST important lesson about Land Rover products: LR axle parts are poorly made and will not last under every day wear and tear. This pattern has gotten worse. Second Big Lesson you might want to learn: the best aftermarket parts are LESS expensive than the OEM parts. For instance, GBR axles come in pairs and INCLUDE the hubs. OE axles are sold "per each"; hubs are NOT included in the price. Why? Ask LRNA and RN. Clarke (just my opinion) At 05:47 PM 09-02-00 -0800, you wrote: >I thought everyone would like to know about this. My '90 RR now has just >over 101 K on the clock. *snip* >I have learned (again!) a very important lesson from all this. I would have >saved a lot of money had I brought my RR into the dealership for the >servicing in the first place. As it is, I ended up double paying for a lot >of parts and labor. The local dealership gives a pretty good discount to >members of PCRC and drops a significant amount off the hourly charge for >labor. Iwas also charged only for hours worked. Hopefully the axles will >now be good for another 100 K :-) > >Dale >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Gomes, David" >To: >Sent: Wednesday, February 09, 2000 7:25 AM >Subject: RE: Bilstein Shocks > > >> A few, inconsequential points..... >> >> ".....Guess what the Bilstein is a gas shock and the Woodhead is an >> oil shock, >> > I bet the oil weighs more than the gas......" >> > >> Both use oil as the damping fluid. The gas shock just charges the air >space >> above the oil with a pressurized gas to keep the oil from aerating under >> high speed cycling. Not effecting the weight much. Kevin was right, it's >> the monotube package that make's 'em smaller and lighter (and more >efficient >> at dissipating the shock's worst enemy...heat). But, this comes at the >> price of being a little more fragile, as a, say, rock hit, to the outer >body >> directly effects the tube the piston is riding in. On a dual-tube shock >> there's an oil space between the outer tube and the one the piston's >riding >> in, so a hit to the body may not effect the shock's operation. >> >> TAW had great experiences with the Woodheads on the Green Rover. But, I >> think the Range Rover shock sees quite a bit different working environment >> on the coiler, especially with regard to speed (which again is a major >> contributor to heat in the shock), and small high frequency movements. It >> could be that the design of the Woodheads is ideally suited to the work >they >> see on a series LR, where a more modern design might better serve the >> demands of the Rangie. >> >> On the bit about rubber bushings, It sure would be interesting to go back >> and get in the designer's heads about why they are the size they are. >There >> are a million possible explanations. But, I couldn't help thinking, that >> maybe, if they weren't so big, there might not be as much rubber to give >> way, and the holes might not round out so fast. Anybody wanna sleeve the >> eyes and try a smaller bushing? :^) Probably not a good idea as the big >> bushings probably serve a lot of purposes that would be compromised in >that >> quest for longevity. >> >> I love to remember that the series trucks were designed in a time when >> owners manuals had a list of a dozen things to check before every TRIP, >the >> weekly maintenance list was as long as your arm, and there was a grease >gun >> mounted under the hood. (the '50 Jag, which also had a 14qt. sump of >engine >> oil to be changed monthly) :^) Land Rovers are more robust than most from >> their era, but disposable components were part of the plan. >> >> Morning musings...... >> >> -Dave G. >> >> From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Wed Feb 9 22:24:21 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id WAA31508 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Wed, 9 Feb 2000 22:24:21 -0500 Message-ID: <003101bf7375$836586a0$f9916bce@davery> From: "Dale W. Avery" To: References: <06DEF5772893D311AAF40000F804F44C3F7654@rcexs.cobe.com> <4.1.20000209181926.00b50c00@mail.halcyon.com> Subject: Re: Axles gone in RR Date: Wed, 9 Feb 2000 19:18:33 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2919.6600 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2919.6600 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Clarke, Fortunately for me, I had a spare set of axles from the rear diff I bought over a year ago. You may remember back then when my axle housing rusted through and LR wanted $7480 for a new one!!! I purchased a complete rear axle, used, from AAA in TX for about $550 with shipping. So feel pretty good about that at any rate. I still have the rear rotors and some ancillary brake components left, along with the complete rear gear set. Only ~41,000 miles on them. I do agree with you about some of the LR parts now-a-days. And I think the stuff coming out of GBR is pretty spiffy. I was really shocked at how the splines were worn and deformed on the axle. Oh, well...... Dale ----- Original Message ----- From: "Clarke Williams" To: Sent: Wednesday, February 09, 2000 6:23 PM Subject: Re: Axles gone in RR > Dale, > > I would say you that you failed to learn the MOST important lesson about Land Rover products: > > LR axle parts are poorly made and will not last under every day wear and tear. This pattern has gotten worse. > > Second Big Lesson you might want to learn: the best aftermarket parts are LESS expensive than the OEM parts. For instance, GBR axles come in pairs and INCLUDE the hubs. OE axles are sold "per each"; hubs are NOT included in the price. Why? Ask LRNA and RN. > > Clarke (just my opinion) > > At 05:47 PM 09-02-00 -0800, you wrote: > >I thought everyone would like to know about this. My '90 RR now has just > >over 101 K on the clock. *snip* > >I have learned (again!) a very important lesson from all this. I would have > >saved a lot of money had I brought my RR into the dealership for the > >servicing in the first place. As it is, I ended up double paying for a lot > >of parts and labor. The local dealership gives a pretty good discount to > >members of PCRC and drops a significant amount off the hourly charge for > >labor. Iwas also charged only for hours worked. Hopefully the axles will > >now be good for another 100 K :-) > > > >Dale > >----- Original Message ----- > >From: "Gomes, David" > >To: > >Sent: Wednesday, February 09, 2000 7:25 AM > >Subject: RE: Bilstein Shocks > > > > > >> A few, inconsequential points..... > >> > >> ".....Guess what the Bilstein is a gas shock and the Woodhead is an > >> oil shock, > >> > I bet the oil weighs more than the gas......" > >> > > >> Both use oil as the damping fluid. The gas shock just charges the air > >space > >> above the oil with a pressurized gas to keep the oil from aerating under > >> high speed cycling. Not effecting the weight much. Kevin was right, it's > >> the monotube package that make's 'em smaller and lighter (and more > >efficient > >> at dissipating the shock's worst enemy...heat). But, this comes at the > >> price of being a little more fragile, as a, say, rock hit, to the outer > >body > >> directly effects the tube the piston is riding in. On a dual-tube shock > >> there's an oil space between the outer tube and the one the piston's > >riding > >> in, so a hit to the body may not effect the shock's operation. > >> > >> TAW had great experiences with the Woodheads on the Green Rover. But, I > >> think the Range Rover shock sees quite a bit different working environment > >> on the coiler, especially with regard to speed (which again is a major > >> contributor to heat in the shock), and small high frequency movements. It > >> could be that the design of the Woodheads is ideally suited to the work > >they > >> see on a series LR, where a more modern design might better serve the > >> demands of the Rangie. > >> > >> On the bit about rubber bushings, It sure would be interesting to go back > >> and get in the designer's heads about why they are the size they are. > >There > >> are a million possible explanations. But, I couldn't help thinking, that > >> maybe, if they weren't so big, there might not be as much rubber to give > >> way, and the holes might not round out so fast. Anybody wanna sleeve the > >> eyes and try a smaller bushing? :^) Probably not a good idea as the big > >> bushings probably serve a lot of purposes that would be compromised in > >that > >> quest for longevity. > >> > >> I love to remember that the series trucks were designed in a time when > >> owners manuals had a list of a dozen things to check before every TRIP, > >the > >> weekly maintenance list was as long as your arm, and there was a grease > >gun > >> mounted under the hood. (the '50 Jag, which also had a 14qt. sump of > >engine > >> oil to be changed monthly) :^) Land Rovers are more robust than most from > >> their era, but disposable components were part of the plan. > >> > >> Morning musings...... > >> > >> -Dave G. > >> > >> > > From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Thu Feb 10 10:06:50 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id KAA32684 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Thu, 10 Feb 2000 10:06:50 -0500 Message-Id: <4.1.20000210062929.00d18140@mail.halcyon.com> X-Sender: clarkebw@mail.halcyon.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.1 Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2000 06:51:36 -0800 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com From: Clarke Williams Subject: Re: Axles gone in RR In-Reply-To: <003101bf7375$836586a0$f9916bce@davery> References: <06DEF5772893D311AAF40000F804F44C3F7654@rcexs.cobe.com> <4.1.20000209181926.00b50c00@mail.halcyon.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Dale, I had forgotten that it was you who had had the treacherous luck to have an axle housing rust through. I confess to being astounded that an axle housing could fail in such a fashion. It is as incredible as the price quoted by LR for a replacement. On re-reading my original post to you I sound a little personal; I did not intend any personal affront or offense. >From my own experience and conversations with various sources, including Bill Davis at GBR and Timm Cooper, it appears that LR is not properly hardening the hubs. This (apparent fact -- I have not personally hardness tested the axles nor hubs by rigorous means. I have only used a "file test") together with the 10 tooth spline result in failures that are, IMO, ridiculously premature. I find TAW's opinion that "axles are expendable parts" offensive. On a par with replacing a good horse's leg bones every few years. "We bred these horses for speed. What does it matter that their legs are too weak to last less than the horse's reasonable lifetime." I know it must seem to some that, from some of my posts, I hate Land Rovers. Nothing could be further from the truth. The old beasts (and to lesser extent, new ones too) are beyond doubt my favorite vehicles. I would not willingly drive anything else. But from my long and treasured association with these "anti-christs" I find myself having ever growing concern regarding the shoddiness of some aspects of their construction. Particularly in light of LRNA's ever upward push of their cost and the increasing complexity and fragility of the base vehicles. The original designers and engineers that labored so diligently to create these wonderful vehicles must truly be deeply offended by such cavalier treatment of their creation. Yours, Clarke At 07:18 PM 09-02-00 -0800, you wrote: >Clarke, > >Fortunately for me, I had a spare set of axles from the rear diff I bought >over a year ago. You may remember back then when my axle housing rusted >through and LR wanted $7480 for a new one!!! I purchased a complete rear >axle, used, from AAA in TX for about $550 with shipping. So feel pretty >good about that at any rate. I still have the rear rotors and some >ancillary brake components left, along with the complete rear gear set. >Only ~41,000 miles on them. > >I do agree with you about some of the LR parts now-a-days. And I think the >stuff coming out of GBR is pretty spiffy. > >I was really shocked at how the splines were worn and deformed on the axle. >Oh, well...... > >Dale >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Clarke Williams" >To: >Sent: Wednesday, February 09, 2000 6:23 PM >Subject: Re: Axles gone in RR > > >> Dale, >> >> I would say you that you failed to learn the MOST important lesson about >Land Rover products: >> >> LR axle parts are poorly made and will not last under every day wear and >tear. This pattern has gotten worse. >> >> Second Big Lesson you might want to learn: the best aftermarket parts are >LESS expensive than the OEM parts. For instance, GBR axles come in pairs >and INCLUDE the hubs. OE axles are sold "per each"; hubs are NOT included >in the price. Why? Ask LRNA and RN. >> >> Clarke (just my opinion) >> >> At 05:47 PM 09-02-00 -0800, you wrote: >> >I thought everyone would like to know about this. My '90 RR now has just >> >over 101 K on the clock. *snip* >> >I have learned (again!) a very important lesson from all this. I would >have >> >saved a lot of money had I brought my RR into the dealership for the >> >servicing in the first place. As it is, I ended up double paying for a >lot >> >of parts and labor. The local dealership gives a pretty good discount to >> >members of PCRC and drops a significant amount off the hourly charge for >> >labor. Iwas also charged only for hours worked. Hopefully the axles >will >> >now be good for another 100 K :-) >> > >> >Dale >> >----- Original Message ----- >> >From: "Gomes, David" >> >To: >> >Sent: Wednesday, February 09, 2000 7:25 AM >> >Subject: RE: Bilstein Shocks >> > >> > >> >> A few, inconsequential points..... >> >> >> >> ".....Guess what the Bilstein is a gas shock and the Woodhead is an >> >> oil shock, >> >> > I bet the oil weighs more than the gas......" >> >> > >> >> Both use oil as the damping fluid. The gas shock just charges the air >> >space >> >> above the oil with a pressurized gas to keep the oil from aerating >under >> >> high speed cycling. Not effecting the weight much. Kevin was right, >it's >> >> the monotube package that make's 'em smaller and lighter (and more >> >efficient >> >> at dissipating the shock's worst enemy...heat). But, this comes at the >> >> price of being a little more fragile, as a, say, rock hit, to the outer >> >body >> >> directly effects the tube the piston is riding in. On a dual-tube >shock >> >> there's an oil space between the outer tube and the one the piston's >> >riding >> >> in, so a hit to the body may not effect the shock's operation. >> >> >> >> TAW had great experiences with the Woodheads on the Green Rover. But, >I >> >> think the Range Rover shock sees quite a bit different working >environment >> >> on the coiler, especially with regard to speed (which again is a major >> >> contributor to heat in the shock), and small high frequency movements. >It >> >> could be that the design of the Woodheads is ideally suited to the work >> >they >> >> see on a series LR, where a more modern design might better serve the >> >> demands of the Rangie. >> >> >> >> On the bit about rubber bushings, It sure would be interesting to go >back >> >> and get in the designer's heads about why they are the size they are. >> >There >> >> are a million possible explanations. But, I couldn't help thinking, >that >> >> maybe, if they weren't so big, there might not be as much rubber to >give >> >> way, and the holes might not round out so fast. Anybody wanna sleeve >the >> >> eyes and try a smaller bushing? :^) Probably not a good idea as the >big >> >> bushings probably serve a lot of purposes that would be compromised in >> >that >> >> quest for longevity. >> >> >> >> I love to remember that the series trucks were designed in a time when >> >> owners manuals had a list of a dozen things to check before every TRIP, >> >the >> >> weekly maintenance list was as long as your arm, and there was a grease >> >gun >> >> mounted under the hood. (the '50 Jag, which also had a 14qt. sump of >> >engine >> >> oil to be changed monthly) :^) Land Rovers are more robust than most >from >> >> their era, but disposable components were part of the plan. >> >> >> >> Morning musings...... >> >> >> >> -Dave G. >> >> >> >> >> >> From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Thu Feb 10 10:34:31 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id KAA00326 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Thu, 10 Feb 2000 10:34:31 -0500 Message-ID: <06DEF5772893D311AAF40000F804F44C3F7666@rcexs.cobe.com> From: "Gomes, David" To: "'mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com'" Subject: RE: Axles gone in RR Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2000 08:29:02 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Dale, When you say, ".....Both hubs were full of cracks and were beginning to break apart....." Did you mean the hub? The about 12lb chunk of iron that has the wheel bearings in it and allows the wheel to spin on the stub axle? Or did you mean the drive flange? The bit that has the circle of bolts surrounding a center hole and is splined to mate with the drive axle? A hub being ready to crack apart would be a WAY major problem! A drive flange, more likely, but not as catastrophic. But, I don't know, as I've never looked that closely at rangie drive line. I thought my Defender came with the drive flange as one piece with the axle in the rear, so that was throwing me off....unless you were talking about the diff-end splines....Sorry....I'm confused... :^) -Dave G. From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Thu Feb 10 11:12:36 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id LAA00404 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Thu, 10 Feb 2000 11:12:36 -0500 Message-ID: <006501bf73de$f6d5bd80$214c1f18@hawaii.rr.com> From: "Peter Hope" To: References: Subject: Re: PSP (Pierced Steel Planking) Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2000 05:53:24 -1000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org > These guys have those cool 'sand ladders' but are made out of steel. > Anyway, to look at the stuff, and maybe even buy some, check out... > > http://www.harvestsite.com/calumet/psp.htm > Mike, thanks for the link. The offer 2 types of matting. The PSP everyone is familiar with is is 22$ for 10', not too shabby. Unfortunately it will cost me $120 per piece to ship to Hawaii. arrgh. Anyway, as you mention this is gov surplus steel planking, not the aluminum stuff so often seen in the rover parts places. Anyone have experience with the steel stuff? Wondering about strength versus the alum. Thanks Pete From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Thu Feb 10 11:42:50 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id LAA00474 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Thu, 10 Feb 2000 11:42:50 -0500 Message-Id: <200002101619.LAA00436@guinness.ovlr.org> To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com Subject: Re: PSP (Pierced Steel Planking) In-Reply-To: Your message of "Thu, 10 Feb 2000 05:53:24 -1000." <006501bf73de$f6d5bd80$214c1f18@hawaii.rr.com> Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2000 11:19:48 -0500 From: Benjamin Smith Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org In message <006501bf73de$f6d5bd80$214c1f18@hawaii.rr.com>you write: > Anyway, as you mention this is gov surplus steel planking, not the aluminum > stuff so often seen in the rover parts places. Anyone have experience with > the steel stuff? Wondering about strength versus the alum. It's at least twice as heavy. The thing is that neither PAP or PSP is used for strength. It is used to spread weight over a soft surface like mud or sand. Both PAP and PSP will easily bend under the weight of a Land-Rover. Ben From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Thu Feb 10 12:10:48 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id MAA00559 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Thu, 10 Feb 2000 12:10:48 -0500 Message-Id: <4.1.20000210084032.009fb8c0@mail.halcyon.com> X-Sender: clarkebw@mail.halcyon.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.1 Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2000 08:42:06 -0800 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com From: Clarke Williams Subject: RE: Axles gone in RR In-Reply-To: <06DEF5772893D311AAF40000F804F44C3F7666@rcexs.cobe.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Dave G., Whoops! I meant "drive flange", NOT "hubs". Good catch. Don't know for sure but suspect Dale meant same. Clarke At 08:29 AM 10-02-00 -0700, you wrote: >Dale, > >When you say, ".....Both hubs were full of cracks and were beginning to >break apart....." Did you mean the hub? The about 12lb chunk of iron that >has the wheel bearings in it and allows the wheel to spin on the stub axle? >Or did you mean the drive flange? The bit that has the circle of bolts >surrounding a center hole and is splined to mate with the drive axle? > >A hub being ready to crack apart would be a WAY major problem! A drive >flange, more likely, but not as catastrophic. But, I don't know, as I've >never looked that closely at rangie drive line. I thought my Defender came >with the drive flange as one piece with the axle in the rear, so that was >throwing me off....unless you were talking about the diff-end >splines....Sorry....I'm confused... :^) > >-Dave G. From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Thu Feb 10 12:13:30 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id MAA00573 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Thu, 10 Feb 2000 12:13:30 -0500 Date: 10 Feb 2000 09:06:44 -0800 Message-Id: From: "Michael Slade" To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com X-Sender: web79245@dreamlab.cc Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Subject: Re: PSP (Pierced Steel Planking) Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org >> These guys have those cool 'sand ladders' but are made out of steel. >> Anyway, to look at the stuff, and maybe even buy some, check out... >> >> http://www.harvestsite.com/calumet/psp.htm >> >Mike, >thanks for the link. The offer 2 types of matting. The PSP everyone is >familiar with is is 22$ for 10', not too shabby. Unfortunately it will cost >me $120 per piece to ship to Hawaii. arrgh. > >Anyway, as you mention this is gov surplus steel planking, not the aluminum >stuff so often seen in the rover parts places. Anyone have experience with >the steel stuff? Wondering about strength versus the alum. >Thanks >Pete Pete, I did call and ask the lady (very nice), about getting the aluminum stuff. She said they get it 'every once in a while', so I guess my best advice would be to check back often. This batch of steel planking was from an airfield at Fort Bragg, and two from Florida. Apparently they go and dismantle the airfields and then purchase it for resale. Interesting way to make a living. I do have two sections of the steel planking, and I use it for scaffolding between two saw horses. I can stand directly in the middle of the section with minor deflection (bowing) with the stands between 3.5 and 4 feet apart. I don't know if that tells you anything, but I feel comfortable standing up there and painting/pruning/whatever-ing. I thought about using them for sand ladders, but with a winch and usually 2 or 3 other trucks around, I couldn't justify carrying around all that weight (and I'm top heavy already). We did find some really cool expanded steel that was in 3foot by 12 foot sections that is very flexible, but actually offers better traction than the sand ladders. Absolutely no load bearing capacity, but if your'e just looking for traction over a short distance these work pretty well. What about Coconut matting? Doesn't that have pretty good traction? You wouldnt' have to pay for shipping at least. :) Later, Michael Slade Portland, Oregon www.DreamLab.cc From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Thu Feb 10 13:07:06 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id NAA00682 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Thu, 10 Feb 2000 13:07:06 -0500 Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.20000210100120.007c0990@pacific.net> X-Sender: gpool@pacific.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (32) Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2000 10:01:20 -0800 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com From: Granville Pool Subject: BP Special: Series Rubber Boots In-Reply-To: <06DEF5772893D311AAF40000F804F44C3F7654@rcexs.cobe.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Thursday, 10 February 2000 Rubber Boot Set for Series II/IIA/III Ol' Punxatawney Phil says there's some more winter ahead, and if your truck has torn or missing boots your air conditioner [?] is on full. Keep at least some of the cold air and water out of the cab by fitting a new set of rubbers. Today we're offering this complete set for what some others charge for just one! $14 for all 3! [The three are for the main gearbox shifter, the transfer box shifter, and the hand brake lever.] From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Thu Feb 10 13:07:50 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id NAA00696 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Thu, 10 Feb 2000 13:07:50 -0500 Message-ID: <0560141A7916D211A64A00A0C9C9A8150211AE8A@nwms15.chinalake.navy.mil> From: "Minnick, Kelly T" To: "Mendo (E-mail)" Subject: transmitters Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2000 10:01:25 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org A guy at work saw these and was wondering if the frequency used is any good for anything... Any ideas? These are found on C & H's web page (http://www.aaaim.com/CandH/index.htm). Later, Kelly Minnick TRANSMITTER AND RECEIVER SET Set consisting of #AN/PRT-4 transmitter and companion receiver #AN/PRT-9 (XE-9). Compact solid state receiver. Designed to be mounted on military helmet. Supplied with optional plug-in earphone. Frequency range 47-57 mHz. FM crystal controlled. Requires 3.2 V military battery Type BA-4534/U for operation. (Not supplied nor can C&H Sales supply.) Unit is supplied with misc. accessories, manual and antenna. These units are new. Note cautions about use - may be prohibited by FCC regulations. Sold by C&H Sales as a military collectible, only. Stock #ME9503 $65.00 COMPACT MILITARY SOLID STATE HANDHELD TRANSMITTER #AN/PRT-4. Has two output channels for tone and voice. FM modulated. Freq. range 47-57 mHz. Output power channel 1: 4-50 mW. Output power channel 2: 50-250 mW. Crystal controlled. Requires 12 V battery Type BA-399/U for operation (not supplied nor can C&H Sales supply). Provided with misc. accessories, manual and antenna. NOTE: These units operate on military frequencies and operation may be prohibited by FCC regulations. Check with FCC office in your area before attempting operation. Sold by C&H Sales as a military collectible only. These units are new. Dimensions: 7-7/8" high x 3" width x 2" deep. Stock #ME9500 $25.00 Kelly Minnick NAWCWD 478200D 1 Administration Circle China Lake, CA 93555-6100 Phone: (760) 939-7647, DSN 437-7647 Fax: (760) 939-7708, DSN 437-7708 Email: MinnickKT@navair.navy.mil From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Thu Feb 10 13:23:07 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id NAA00711 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Thu, 10 Feb 2000 13:23:07 -0500 Message-ID: <0560141A7916D211A64A00A0C9C9A8150211AE92@nwms15.chinalake.navy.mil> From: "Minnick, Kelly T" To: "Mendo (E-mail)" Subject: C & H Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2000 10:05:21 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org BTW, the infrared tank periscope looks pretty interesting, but at $200, I think I will pass. Not sure where I would mount this on my R.Rover anyhow! Kelly Minnick NAWCWD 478200D 1 Administration Circle China Lake, CA 93555-6100 Phone: (760) 939-7647, DSN 437-7647 Fax: (760) 939-7708, DSN 437-7708 Email: MinnickKT@navair.navy.mil From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Thu Feb 10 13:30:56 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id NAA00747 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Thu, 10 Feb 2000 13:30:56 -0500 Message-ID: <38A301D3.6D9193A7@slip.net> Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2000 10:22:11 -0800 From: Jeremy Bartlett X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en]C-CCK-MCD NSCPCD47 (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: mendo recce Subject: Free Disco B-Bar Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Anyone who wants a free, used Disco. 1 brush bar contact me. You will have to arrange to pick it up unless you're near the north S.F. Bay. It has lamp guards attached. There is about a 1"x3" scrape/rust on the powder coating and a couple 1" scrapes as well as a small ding (about 1") in one front bar. Nothing that couldn't be tidied up. Let me know soon or it goes to the scrap yard. Jeremy From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Thu Feb 10 18:49:47 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id SAA01280 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Thu, 10 Feb 2000 18:49:47 -0500 Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2000 17:36:56 -0600 From: Bryan Deel Subject: Charles Irvin is headin west To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com Message-id: <38A34B98.9BE5E889@netscape.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.61 [en] (Win95; I) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Charles wanted me to let the group know he's homeward bound. He expects to be in Albuquerque late tonight and in Phoenix in another day; that is if he Arkansas Highway Patrol dosn't nab him for reasons I'm sure he'll tell you about. Happy Rovering, Bryan Memphis From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Thu Feb 10 19:29:31 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id TAA01309 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Thu, 10 Feb 2000 19:29:31 -0500 Message-ID: <000d01bf7425$5a14fc80$d5916bce@davery> From: "Dale W. Avery" To: References: <06DEF5772893D311AAF40000F804F44C3F7654@rcexs.cobe.com><4.1.20000209181926.00b50c00@mail.halcyon.com> <4.1.20000210062929.00d18140@mail.halcyon.com> Subject: Re: Axles gone in RR Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2000 16:17:15 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2919.6600 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2919.6600 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org As always, a entertaining reply! I guess I am disappointed more than anything else in the continuing disintegration of the supposedly "greatest off-road vehicle in the world's" various parts on my vehicle. My god, my son and daughter both have well over 100 K on their truck and car without the rear axles going out. I don't drive that hard. My Mazda pu went well over a 100 K and I took it out more often and to more bizarre places than I have ever tried in the RR and it never needed this much attention. What are all the big bucks for?? ----- Original Message ----- From: "Clarke Williams" To: Sent: Thursday, February 10, 2000 6:51 AM Subject: Re: Axles gone in RR > Dale, > > I had forgotten that it was you who had had the treacherous luck to have an axle housing rust through. I confess to being astounded that an axle housing could fail in such a fashion. It is as incredible as the price quoted by LR for a replacement. > > On re-reading my original post to you I sound a little personal; I did not intend any personal affront or offense. > > From my own experience and conversations with various sources, including Bill Davis at GBR and Timm Cooper, it appears that LR is not properly hardening the hubs. This (apparent fact -- I have not personally hardness tested the axles nor hubs by rigorous means. I have only used a "file test") together with the 10 tooth spline result in failures that are, IMO, ridiculously premature. I find TAW's opinion that "axles are expendable parts" offensive. On a par with replacing a good horse's leg bones every few years. "We bred these horses for speed. What does it matter that their legs are too weak to last less than the horse's reasonable lifetime." > > I know it must seem to some that, from some of my posts, I hate Land Rovers. Nothing could be further from the truth. The old beasts (and to lesser extent, new ones too) are beyond doubt my favorite vehicles. I would not willingly drive anything else. But from my long and treasured association with these "anti-christs" I find myself having ever growing concern regarding the shoddiness of some aspects of their construction. Particularly in light of LRNA's ever upward push of their cost and the increasing complexity and fragility of the base vehicles. The original designers and engineers that labored so diligently to create these wonderful vehicles must truly be deeply offended by such cavalier treatment of their creation. > > Yours, > Clarke > > At 07:18 PM 09-02-00 -0800, you wrote: > >Clarke, > > > >Fortunately for me, I had a spare set of axles from the rear diff I bought > >over a year ago. You may remember back then when my axle housing rusted > >through and LR wanted $7480 for a new one!!! I purchased a complete rear > >axle, used, from AAA in TX for about $550 with shipping. So feel pretty > >good about that at any rate. I still have the rear rotors and some > >ancillary brake components left, along with the complete rear gear set. > >Only ~41,000 miles on them. > > > >I do agree with you about some of the LR parts now-a-days. And I think the > >stuff coming out of GBR is pretty spiffy. > > > >I was really shocked at how the splines were worn and deformed on the axle. > >Oh, well...... > > > >Dale > >----- Original Message ----- > >From: "Clarke Williams" > >To: > >Sent: Wednesday, February 09, 2000 6:23 PM > >Subject: Re: Axles gone in RR > > > > > >> Dale, > >> > >> I would say you that you failed to learn the MOST important lesson about > >Land Rover products: > >> > >> LR axle parts are poorly made and will not last under every day wear and > >tear. This pattern has gotten worse. > >> > >> Second Big Lesson you might want to learn: the best aftermarket parts are > >LESS expensive than the OEM parts. For instance, GBR axles come in pairs > >and INCLUDE the hubs. OE axles are sold "per each"; hubs are NOT included > >in the price. Why? Ask LRNA and RN. > >> > >> Clarke (just my opinion) > >> > >> At 05:47 PM 09-02-00 -0800, you wrote: > >> >I thought everyone would like to know about this. My '90 RR now has just > >> >over 101 K on the clock. *snip* > >> >I have learned (again!) a very important lesson from all this. I would > >have > >> >saved a lot of money had I brought my RR into the dealership for the > >> >servicing in the first place. As it is, I ended up double paying for a > >lot > >> >of parts and labor. The local dealership gives a pretty good discount to > >> >members of PCRC and drops a significant amount off the hourly charge for > >> >labor. Iwas also charged only for hours worked. Hopefully the axles > >will > >> >now be good for another 100 K :-) > >> > > >> >Dale > >> >----- Original Message ----- > >> >From: "Gomes, David" > >> >To: > >> >Sent: Wednesday, February 09, 2000 7:25 AM > >> >Subject: RE: Bilstein Shocks > >> > > >> > > >> >> A few, inconsequential points..... > >> >> > >> >> ".....Guess what the Bilstein is a gas shock and the Woodhead is an > >> >> oil shock, > >> >> > I bet the oil weighs more than the gas......" > >> >> > > >> >> Both use oil as the damping fluid. The gas shock just charges the air > >> >space > >> >> above the oil with a pressurized gas to keep the oil from aerating > >under > >> >> high speed cycling. Not effecting the weight much. Kevin was right, > >it's > >> >> the monotube package that make's 'em smaller and lighter (and more > >> >efficient > >> >> at dissipating the shock's worst enemy...heat). But, this comes at the > >> >> price of being a little more fragile, as a, say, rock hit, to the outer > >> >body > >> >> directly effects the tube the piston is riding in. On a dual-tube > >shock > >> >> there's an oil space between the outer tube and the one the piston's > >> >riding > >> >> in, so a hit to the body may not effect the shock's operation. > >> >> > >> >> TAW had great experiences with the Woodheads on the Green Rover. But, > >I > >> >> think the Range Rover shock sees quite a bit different working > >environment > >> >> on the coiler, especially with regard to speed (which again is a major > >> >> contributor to heat in the shock), and small high frequency movements. > >It > >> >> could be that the design of the Woodheads is ideally suited to the work > >> >they > >> >> see on a series LR, where a more modern design might better serve the > >> >> demands of the Rangie. > >> >> > >> >> On the bit about rubber bushings, It sure would be interesting to go > >back > >> >> and get in the designer's heads about why they are the size they are. > >> >There > >> >> are a million possible explanations. But, I couldn't help thinking, > >that > >> >> maybe, if they weren't so big, there might not be as much rubber to > >give > >> >> way, and the holes might not round out so fast. Anybody wanna sleeve > >the > >> >> eyes and try a smaller bushing? :^) Probably not a good idea as the > >big > >> >> bushings probably serve a lot of purposes that would be compromised in > >> >that > >> >> quest for longevity. > >> >> > >> >> I love to remember that the series trucks were designed in a time when > >> >> owners manuals had a list of a dozen things to check before every TRIP, > >> >the > >> >> weekly maintenance list was as long as your arm, and there was a grease > >> >gun > >> >> mounted under the hood. (the '50 Jag, which also had a 14qt. sump of > >> >engine > >> >> oil to be changed monthly) :^) Land Rovers are more robust than most > >from > >> >> their era, but disposable components were part of the plan. > >> >> > >> >> Morning musings...... > >> >> > >> >> -Dave G. > >> >> > >> >> > >> > >> > > From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Thu Feb 10 19:54:16 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id TAA01390 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Thu, 10 Feb 2000 19:54:16 -0500 Message-ID: <002b01bf7426$61b9a980$d5916bce@davery> From: "Dale W. Avery" To: References: <0560141A7916D211A64A00A0C9C9A8150211AE8A@nwms15.chinalake.navy.mil> Subject: Re: transmitters Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2000 16:24:37 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2919.6600 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2919.6600 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org I wouldn't waste any money on them. I will check my freq. chart tomorrow and see who "owns" 47-52 MHz. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Minnick, Kelly T" To: "Mendo (E-mail)" Sent: Thursday, February 10, 2000 10:01 AM Subject: transmitters > A guy at work saw these and was wondering if the frequency used is any good > for anything... Any ideas? These are found on C & H's web page > (http://www.aaaim.com/CandH/index.htm). Later, > > Kelly Minnick > > TRANSMITTER AND RECEIVER SET Set consisting of #AN/PRT-4 transmitter and > companion receiver #AN/PRT-9 (XE-9). > Compact solid state receiver. Designed to be mounted on military helmet. > Supplied with optional plug-in earphone. Frequency > range 47-57 mHz. FM crystal controlled. Requires 3.2 V military battery Type > BA-4534/U for operation. (Not supplied nor can > C&H Sales supply.) Unit is supplied with misc. accessories, manual and > antenna. These units are new. Note cautions about use > - may be prohibited by FCC regulations. Sold by C&H Sales as a military > collectible, only. Stock #ME9503 $65.00 > > COMPACT MILITARY SOLID STATE HANDHELD TRANSMITTER #AN/PRT-4. Has two output > channels for tone and voice. FM > modulated. Freq. range 47-57 mHz. Output power channel 1: 4-50 mW. Output > power channel 2: 50-250 mW. Crystal controlled. > Requires 12 V battery Type BA-399/U for operation (not supplied nor can C&H > Sales supply). Provided with misc. accessories, manual > and antenna. NOTE: These units operate on military frequencies and operation > may be prohibited by FCC regulations. Check with FCC > office in your area before attempting operation. Sold by C&H Sales as a > military collectible only. These units are new. Dimensions: 7-7/8" > high x 3" width x 2" deep. Stock #ME9500 $25.00 > > > Kelly Minnick > NAWCWD 478200D > 1 Administration Circle > China Lake, CA 93555-6100 > > Phone: (760) 939-7647, DSN 437-7647 > Fax: (760) 939-7708, DSN 437-7708 > Email: MinnickKT@navair.navy.mil > > From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Thu Feb 10 19:56:53 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id TAA01405 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Thu, 10 Feb 2000 19:56:53 -0500 Message-ID: <001301bf7425$c4849b20$d5916bce@davery> From: "Dale W. Avery" To: References: <06DEF5772893D311AAF40000F804F44C3F7666@rcexs.cobe.com> Subject: Re: Axles gone in RR Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2000 16:20:12 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2919.6600 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2919.6600 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Dave, You are correct. I meant the drive flange. It was brittle! I am becoming a little unhappy with these British gems. I think I'll side with the Irish for a while. Pull in my boots, drink a couple bottles of stout, and dream of Jeeps. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Gomes, David" To: Sent: Thursday, February 10, 2000 7:29 AM Subject: RE: Axles gone in RR > Dale, > > When you say, ".....Both hubs were full of cracks and were beginning to > break apart....." Did you mean the hub? The about 12lb chunk of iron that > has the wheel bearings in it and allows the wheel to spin on the stub axle? > Or did you mean the drive flange? The bit that has the circle of bolts > surrounding a center hole and is splined to mate with the drive axle? > > A hub being ready to crack apart would be a WAY major problem! A drive > flange, more likely, but not as catastrophic. But, I don't know, as I've > never looked that closely at rangie drive line. I thought my Defender came > with the drive flange as one piece with the axle in the rear, so that was > throwing me off....unless you were talking about the diff-end > splines....Sorry....I'm confused... :^) > > -Dave G. > > From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Thu Feb 10 20:28:50 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id UAA01449 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Thu, 10 Feb 2000 20:28:50 -0500 Message-ID: <38A361D9.346A3B57@wenet.net> Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2000 17:11:53 -0800 From: "Bruce R. Bonar" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com Subject: Re: transmitters References: <0560141A7916D211A64A00A0C9C9A8150211AE8A@nwms15.chinalake.navy.mil> <002b01bf7426$61b9a980$d5916bce@davery> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org "Dale W. Avery" wrote: > I wouldn't waste any money on them. I will check my freq. chart tomorrow > and see who "owns" 47-52 MHz. 50-52 MHz is 6 meters isn't it? Bruce From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Thu Feb 10 20:34:12 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id UAA01486 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Thu, 10 Feb 2000 20:34:12 -0500 Message-ID: <06DEF5772893D311AAF40000F804F44C3F7680@rcexs.cobe.com> From: "Gomes, David" To: "'mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com'" Subject: RE: Axles gone in RR Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2000 18:04:03 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org I think that's why I bought an extended warranty for the Disco. Paying my money up front, as it were, but I agree, its easy to get discouraged when the Suzuki Samurai across the street fires up and goes every day for 15 years without a hitch.......character schmaracter! -Dave G. > ---------- > From: Dale W. Avery[SMTP:davery@ior.com] > Reply To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com > Sent: Thursday, February 10, 2000 5:20 PM > To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com > Subject: Re: Axles gone in RR > > Dave, > > You are correct. I meant the drive flange. It was brittle! > > I am becoming a little unhappy with these British gems. I think I'll side > with the Irish for a while. Pull in my boots, drink a couple bottles of > stout, and dream of Jeeps. > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Gomes, David" > To: > Sent: Thursday, February 10, 2000 7:29 AM > Subject: RE: Axles gone in RR > > > > Dale, > > > > When you say, ".....Both hubs were full of cracks and were beginning to > > break apart....." Did you mean the hub? The about 12lb chunk of iron > that > > has the wheel bearings in it and allows the wheel to spin on the stub > axle? > > Or did you mean the drive flange? The bit that has the circle of bolts > > surrounding a center hole and is splined to mate with the drive axle? > > > > A hub being ready to crack apart would be a WAY major problem! A drive > > flange, more likely, but not as catastrophic. But, I don't know, as > I've > > never looked that closely at rangie drive line. I thought my Defender > came > > with the drive flange as one piece with the axle in the rear, so that > was > > throwing me off....unless you were talking about the diff-end > > splines....Sorry....I'm confused... :^) > > > > -Dave G. > > > > > From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Thu Feb 10 20:48:26 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id UAA01534 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Thu, 10 Feb 2000 20:48:26 -0500 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <38A34B98.9BE5E889@netscape.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2000 17:10:48 -0800 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com From: Russ Wilson Subject: Re: Charles Irvin is headin west Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org >Charles wanted me to let the group know he's homeward bound. He expects >to be in Albuquerque late tonight and in Phoenix in another day; that is >if he Arkansas Highway Patrol dosn't nab him for reasons I'm sure he'll >tell you about. Happy Rovering, >Bryan >Memphis You can tell if Charles has been to your house if your fridge is empty, the cat is pregnant and the dog won't come to you anymore when you call it. Just kidding. Charles is a great guy and I just wish I had the time, cash and b*lls to make the trip he's doing. 3000 miles with a towbar?!?!? This has to qualify for some sort of award. The Ottawa Valley Land Rover Club from Canada has an award that they give out each year to the member who has made the longest trip to retreive a dead rover. It's called the "towball award" I think. I would have to say that if he were a member, 3000 miles would certainly put him right at the top of the list. Continued Good Luck to Charles on his Trip....... p.s. He's still Crazy..... Russ and Leslie Wilson "Expertise was best defined in terms not of what the expert already knew, but of how easily the expert could find things out." - Nathaniel Borenstein From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Thu Feb 10 20:50:52 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id UAA01549 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Thu, 10 Feb 2000 20:50:52 -0500 Message-ID: <38A368E3.6AA36104@wenet.net> Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2000 17:41:55 -0800 From: "Bruce R. Bonar" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com Subject: Re: transmitters References: <12.19bcf1a.25d4c119@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org GElam30092@aol.com wrote: > << 50-52 MHz is 6 meters isn't it? >> > > Give that man a gold star! 50.0 to 54.0 Mhz. I'll settle for a General License. Of course that means I need to start studying before April. Bruce From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Thu Feb 10 20:58:19 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id UAA01565 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Thu, 10 Feb 2000 20:58:19 -0500 From: GElam30092@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2000 20:44:24 EST Subject: Re: transmitters To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 45 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org In a message dated 2/10/00 6:41:50 PM US Mountain Standard Time, brbonar@wenet.net writes: << I'll settle for a General License. Of course that means I need to start studying before April. >> There is another alternative: don't study. Spend 30 minutes a day taking the on-line test at http://www.hamtest.com/test/index.html While you won't *learn* much, you'll know the answers. Or, the alternative is to study the areas where you need a little more knowledge and/or reinforcement. I'll take the general before April 15 also. Good luck..... Gerry From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Thu Feb 10 21:05:11 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id VAA01582 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Thu, 10 Feb 2000 21:05:11 -0500 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <38A361D9.346A3B57@wenet.net> References: <0560141A7916D211A64A00A0C9C9A8150211AE8A@nwms15.chinalake.navy.mil> <002b01bf7426$61b9a980$d5916bce@davery> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2000 17:24:47 -0800 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com From: Russ Wilson Subject: Re: transmitters Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org >"Dale W. Avery" wrote: > >> I wouldn't waste any money on them. I will check my freq. chart tomorrow >> and see who "owns" 47-52 MHz. > >50-52 MHz is 6 meters isn't it? > >Bruce The big thing to check with any of this stuff is what battery does it use?? Some of the comm gear will use a lithium(sp?) battery that you can't just walk into your local Radio Shack and buy. Good Luck Russ and Leslie Wilson "Expertise was best defined in terms not of what the expert already knew, but of how easily the expert could find things out." - Nathaniel Borenstein From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Thu Feb 10 21:08:04 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id VAA01602 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Thu, 10 Feb 2000 21:08:04 -0500 From: GElam30092@aol.com Message-ID: <12.19bcf1a.25d4c119@aol.com> Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2000 20:34:17 EST Subject: Re: transmitters To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 45 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org In a message dated 2/10/00 6:24:05 PM US Mountain Standard Time, brbonar@wenet.net writes: << 50-52 MHz is 6 meters isn't it? >> Give that man a gold star! 50.0 to 54.0 Mhz. Cheers, Gerry From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Thu Feb 10 22:54:35 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id WAA01712 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Thu, 10 Feb 2000 22:54:35 -0500 From: SFmms@aol.com Message-ID: <4.1151762.25d4d9c6@aol.com> Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2000 22:19:34 EST Subject: Re: Mendo_Recce digest: V2 #917 To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 45 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Dale Avery wrote: << What are all the big bucks for?? >> We are wondering the same thing with our '95 Disco. It frightens us to think about the fact that the warranty extension runs out in June. We've already made inquiries about independent garages that can handle it, as our experience with dealers down here in LA has been dismal. Good Luck, Karen Sindir '74 SIII 88 Red Rufy '95 Disco EFE From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Fri Feb 11 00:40:55 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id AAA02378 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Fri, 11 Feb 2000 00:40:55 -0500 From: "Kelly Minnick" To: Subject: RE: PSP (Pierced Steel Planking) Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2000 21:39:40 -0800 Message-ID: <000101bf7452$6442c160$a305193f@minnick> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2173.0 In-Reply-To: <006501bf73de$f6d5bd80$214c1f18@hawaii.rr.com> Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org You mean the strength it takes to lift it, right! :) Not sure it would take a tank's weight, but maybe... Maybe it comes in different thickness'? You are talking about landing mat, right? Kelly Minnick > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com > [mailto:owner-mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com]On Behalf Of Peter Hope > Sent: Thursday, February 10, 2000 7:53 AM > To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com > Subject: Re: PSP (Pierced Steel Planking) > > > > These guys have those cool 'sand ladders' but are made out of steel. > > Anyway, to look at the stuff, and maybe even buy some, check out... > > > > http://www.harvestsite.com/calumet/psp.htm > > > Mike, > thanks for the link. The offer 2 types of matting. The PSP everyone is > familiar with is is 22$ for 10', not too shabby. Unfortunately > it will cost > me $120 per piece to ship to Hawaii. arrgh. > > Anyway, as you mention this is gov surplus steel planking, not > the aluminum > stuff so often seen in the rover parts places. Anyone have > experience with > the steel stuff? Wondering about strength versus the alum. > Thanks > Pete > > From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Fri Feb 11 00:41:36 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id AAA02392 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Fri, 11 Feb 2000 00:41:36 -0500 From: "Kelly Minnick" To: Subject: RE: Axles gone in RR Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2000 21:34:47 -0800 Message-ID: <000001bf7451$b54f2860$a305193f@minnick> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2173.0 In-Reply-To: <000d01bf7425$5a14fc80$d5916bce@davery> Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Can happen to anything, I think. My brother has a '86 Ford PU (150) he's owned since new. He's babied the thing. It has 88K miles on it (in 14 years...). The rod bearing started making noise today. New engine at 88K? Even my old RR made it to 105K and still passes smog. (I won't say any more in case he's listening). I think it's all those jumps you've been doing, Dale! That dynamic loading is terrible... Kelly Minnick > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com > [mailto:owner-mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com]On Behalf Of Dale W. Avery > Sent: Thursday, February 10, 2000 4:17 PM > To: mendo_recce@moab.off-road.com > Subject: Re: Axles gone in RR > > > As always, a entertaining reply! I guess I am disappointed more than > anything else in the continuing disintegration of the supposedly "greatest > off-road vehicle in the world's" various parts on my vehicle. My god, my > son and daughter both have well over 100 K on their truck and car without > the rear axles going out. I don't drive that hard. My Mazda pu went well > over a 100 K and I took it out more often and to more bizarre > places than I > have ever tried in the RR and it never needed this much > attention. What are > all the big bucks for?? > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Clarke Williams" > To: > Sent: Thursday, February 10, 2000 6:51 AM > Subject: Re: Axles gone in RR > > > > Dale, > > > > I had forgotten that it was you who had had the treacherous luck to have > an axle housing rust through. I confess to being astounded that an axle > housing could fail in such a fashion. It is as incredible as the > price quoted by LR for a replacement. > > > > On re-reading my original post to you I sound a little > personal; I did not > intend any personal affront or offense. > > > > From my own experience and conversations with various sources, including > Bill Davis at GBR and Timm Cooper, it appears that LR is not properly > hardening the hubs. This (apparent fact -- I have not personally hardness > tested the axles nor hubs by rigorous means. I have only used a "file > test") together with the 10 tooth spline result in failures that are, IMO, > ridiculously premature. I find TAW's opinion that "axles are expendable > parts" offensive. On a par with replacing a good horse's leg bones every > few years. "We bred these horses for speed. What does it matter > that their > legs are too weak to last less than the horse's reasonable lifetime." > > > > I know it must seem to some that, from some of my posts, I hate Land > Rovers. Nothing could be further from the truth. The old beasts (and to > lesser extent, new ones too) are beyond doubt my favorite > vehicles. I would > not willingly drive anything else. But from my long and treasured > association with these "anti-christs" I find myself having ever growing > concern regarding the shoddiness of some aspects of their construction. > Particularly in light of LRNA's ever upward push of their cost and the > increasing complexity and fragility of the base vehicles. The original > designers and engineers that labored so diligently to create > these wonderful > vehicles must truly be deeply offended by such cavalier treatment of their > creation. > > > > Yours, > > Clarke > > > > At 07:18 PM 09-02-00 -0800, you wrote: > > >Clarke, > > > > > >Fortunately for me, I had a spare set of axles from the rear diff I > bought > > >over a year ago. You may remember back then when my axle > housing rusted > > >through and LR wanted $7480 for a new one!!! I purchased a > complete rear > > >axle, used, from AAA in TX for about $550 with shipping. So > feel pretty > > >good about that at any rate. I still have the rear rotors and some > > >ancillary brake components left, along with the complete rear gear set. > > >Only ~41,000 miles on them. > > > > > >I do agree with you about some of the LR parts now-a-days. And I think > the > > >stuff coming out of GBR is pretty spiffy. > > > > > >I was really shocked at how the splines were worn and deformed on the > axle. > > >Oh, well...... > > > > > >Dale > > >----- Original Message ----- > > >From: "Clarke Williams" > > >To: > > >Sent: Wednesday, February 09, 2000 6:23 PM > > >Subject: Re: Axles gone in RR > > > > > > > > >> Dale, > > >> > > >> I would say you that you failed to learn the MOST important lesson > about > > >Land Rover products: > > >> > > >> LR axle parts are poorly made and will not last under every day wear > and > > >tear. This pattern has gotten worse. > > >> > > >> Second Big Lesson you might want to learn: the best > aftermarket parts > are > > >LESS expensive than the OEM parts. For instance, GBR axles > come in pairs > > >and INCLUDE the hubs. OE axles are sold "per each"; hubs are NOT > included > > >in the price. Why? Ask LRNA and RN. > > >> > > >> Clarke (just my opinion) > > >> > > >> At 05:47 PM 09-02-00 -0800, you wrote: > > >> >I thought everyone would like to know about this. My '90 RR now has > just > > >> >over 101 K on the clock. *snip* > > >> >I have learned (again!) a very important lesson from all this. I > would > > >have > > >> >saved a lot of money had I brought my RR into the dealership for the > > >> >servicing in the first place. As it is, I ended up double > paying for > a > > >lot > > >> >of parts and labor. The local dealership gives a pretty > good discount > to > > >> >members of PCRC and drops a significant amount off the hourly charge > for > > >> >labor. Iwas also charged only for hours worked. Hopefully > the axles > > >will > > >> >now be good for another 100 K :-) > > >> > > > >> >Dale > > >> >----- Original Message ----- > > >> >From: "Gomes, David" > > >> >To: > > >> >Sent: Wednesday, February 09, 2000 7:25 AM > > >> >Subject: RE: Bilstein Shocks > > >> > > > >> > > > >> >> A few, inconsequential points..... > > >> >> > > >> >> ".....Guess what the Bilstein is a gas shock and the > Woodhead is an > > >> >> oil shock, > > >> >> > I bet the oil weighs more than the gas......" > > >> >> > > > >> >> Both use oil as the damping fluid. The gas shock just charges the > air > > >> >space > > >> >> above the oil with a pressurized gas to keep the oil from aerating > > >under > > >> >> high speed cycling. Not effecting the weight much. Kevin was > right, > > >it's > > >> >> the monotube package that make's 'em smaller and lighter (and more > > >> >efficient > > >> >> at dissipating the shock's worst enemy...heat). But, > this comes at > the > > >> >> price of being a little more fragile, as a, say, rock hit, to the > outer > > >> >body > > >> >> directly effects the tube the piston is riding in. On a dual-tube > > >shock > > >> >> there's an oil space between the outer tube and the one > the piston's > > >> >riding > > >> >> in, so a hit to the body may not effect the shock's operation. > > >> >> > > >> >> TAW had great experiences with the Woodheads on the Green Rover. > But, > > >I > > >> >> think the Range Rover shock sees quite a bit different working > > >environment > > >> >> on the coiler, especially with regard to speed (which again is a > major > > >> >> contributor to heat in the shock), and small high frequency > movements. > > >It > > >> >> could be that the design of the Woodheads is ideally suited to the > work > > >> >they > > >> >> see on a series LR, where a more modern design might better serve > the > > >> >> demands of the Rangie. > > >> >> > > >> >> On the bit about rubber bushings, It sure would be > interesting to go > > >back > > >> >> and get in the designer's heads about why they are the size they > are. > > >> >There > > >> >> are a million possible explanations. But, I couldn't > help thinking, > > >that > > >> >> maybe, if they weren't so big, there might not be as much > rubber to > > >give > > >> >> way, and the holes might not round out so fast. Anybody wanna > sleeve > > >the > > >> >> eyes and try a smaller bushing? :^) Probably not a good idea as > the > > >big > > >> >> bushings probably serve a lot of purposes that would be > compromised > in > > >> >that > > >> >> quest for longevity. > > >> >> > > >> >> I love to remember that the series trucks were designed in a time > when > > >> >> owners manuals had a list of a dozen things to check before every > TRIP, > > >> >the > > >> >> weekly maintenance list was as long as your arm, and there was a > grease > > >> >gun > > >> >> mounted under the hood. (the '50 Jag, which also had a > 14qt. sump of > > >> >engine > > >> >> oil to be changed monthly) :^) Land Rovers are more robust than > most > > >from > > >> >> their era, but disposable components were part of the plan. > > >> >> > > >> >> Morning musings...... > > >> >> > > >> >> -Dave G. > > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> > > >> > > > > > From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Fri Feb 11 00:57:01 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id AAA02412 for mendo_recce-outgoing; Fri, 11 Feb 2000 00:57:01 -0500 From: "Kelly Minnick" To: Subject: RE: transmitters Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2000 21:43:38 -0800 Message-ID: <000201bf7452$f21584a0$a305193f@minnick> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2173.0 In-Reply-To: Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Sender: owner-mendo_recce@fourfold.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: mendo_recce@fourfold.org Is it General or Novice that I should be looking into? Kelly Minnick > Subject: Re: transmitters > << I'll settle for a General License. Of course that means I > need to start > studying before April. >> > > There is another alternative: don't study. Spend 30 minutes a > day taking > the on-line test at http://www.hamtest.com/test/index.html > > While you won't *learn* much, you'll know the answers. Or, the > alternative > is to study the areas where you need a little more knowledge and/or > reinforcement. > > I'll take the general before April 15 also. > > Good luck..... > Gerry > From bens@guinness.ovlr.org Fri Feb 11 01:11:23 2000 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by guinness.ovlr.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id