From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Thu Dec 1 09:25:47 1994 Date: Thu, 01 Dec 1994 00:11:00 -0500 From: Andrew Steele Subject: Snow Plow Info - Thanks To: lro@stratus.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Status: O X-Status: Michael, Thanks for the dimensions. I think the frame mount on the Chevy will work w/ very minor modifications on a Rover. By the way, if anyone is interested, I may also have a lead on a in stock new mounting kit at a Western Plow dealer here in Dayton. Now, to find the Rover..... Andrew Dayton, OH 87 RR P.S. Thanks to everyone who responded. --- ---/ | ]--|O~~~~~O~ From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Thu Dec 1 09:26:03 1994 From: "Russell G. Dushin" Subject: Re: Imposing Winch & Starter Problems To: LANDROVER@delphi.com Date: Thu, 1 Dec 94 0:11:56 EST Cc: lro@team.net In-Reply-To: <01HK3SQILZIG94FKY8@delphi.com>; from "LANDROVER@delphi.com" at Nov 30, 94 9:37 pm Mailer: Elm [revision: 66.36.1.1] Status: O X-Status: > Hal sez... > > > Now, in my rover, I seem to have a problem with my starter coming loose > ---snip--- > > annoying. Why am I plagued with this problem?? > Mike replies: > Seriously... you say the starter is coming loose and jamming into the > flywheel?? The whole starter?? There are two bolts holding it in.. Hmmm... > Bolts come in from the flywheel housing..through the starter flange.. > lockwashers and nuts.. > Only thing I can think of is either you haven't tightened the nuts enough or > maybe the lockwashers are flattened out and don't lock anymore. these bolts are studs, yes? Not stripped (nor is the bell housing) are they? maybe it is Bad Karma. You been good lately? rd/nige From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Thu Dec 1 09:29:31 1994 From: "Russell G. Dushin" Subject: Waxoyl ingredients To: lro@team.net Date: Thu, 1 Dec 94 0:08:09 EST Mailer: Elm [revision: 66.36.1.1] Status: RO X-Status: Ok Morgan, Here it is. Finnigan's Waxoyl, The Original Rustproofing (or so it's claimed). Gosh I love the smell of this stuff. and the ingredients are......uh, not......they're naaa...not, nope not here. Gheeze, how do they get away with it?? Is there no patent protection? Too much patent protection?? Hmmm. The package claims "it's a thick, waxy fluid saturated with a very powerful rustkiller"...that supposedly contains..."rust-inhibiting molecules that cut through films of oil, grease, and dirt in seconds and cling to metal surfaces"....which... "unlike chemical inhibitors used in ordinary rustproofers, stay active indefinately." Also claims it has the ability to creep and that it is effective against multi-metal corrosion. It's thick and waxy all right. Doesn't spray worth a damn until you heat it up (in hot water-it IS flammable) or dilute it. Looks yellowish with pale wax in it when "gelled" at room temperature (my kinda room temps, anyway), and when heated it just looks yeller-like a dilute citronella candle (or don't you folks have bugs, neither?). hmmm. Wonder what this rustkiller is. If "unlike a chemical inhibitor", then what is it? Wax?? Yet another corn syrup product?? Not from mumslnd. Maybe they mean unlike *most* or *all other* rust inhibitors, maybe it's just more stable and less prone towards decomposition from air oxidation, uv light, bad gas (oooPH), and good ol' electrolyte ridden water. It's a concept-could be...I gotta look it up. This creep stuff....could be wax, I suppose. Wax wouldn't be in the name if it wasn't there. Multi-metal corrosion stopper? Maybe only 'cause it's effective against *all* corrosion on account of the fact that it seals out water so well, and not because the rustkiller or some other ingredient is especially effective against galvanic conduction. Hell, maybe wax has everything to do with it. Maybe wax seals in and protects the rust inhibitors-any ol' rust inhibitors-from the nasties of nature and does all the work. I know, I'll taste it. Gotta be able to taste wax.....There's ah, nope...no warnings on the label...says it's just like sprayin' roses...I put it in my hair, knowingly....ok..... Oh, man, yuck. How am I ever gonna get this taste outa my mouth? Where's the Scotch? Just can't trust these outa-merica labels. Don't you folks got no manners? There isn't a warning on this package that tells me not to feed this to my dog, cat, horse, or my kids (if I have any, I dunno), or not to eat it myself. Like pushin' pills on a baby. It *does* tell me not to put it in my eyes, and to keep it out of the reach of children, but I drink stuff like that. How do you folks get away with this??? Don't got no legislaaation? Too much?? (can you understand now why most americans are required to wear seatbelts? it's a wonder they let us drive at all.) I do know that the stuff is impressive. I sprayed two entire cans, non-diluted, on Nigel's underbelly (goochy, goochy, goo) and framerails for the first time about a month ago. Sixty bucks worth. Overkill. It could have been diluted and would have sprayed much easier if it had. Prior to that I used a 90wt/kerosene mix.....made quite the mess, and it didn't last forever (tell that to the DEC). It was cheap, but it dripped off and only areas within reach of my various self-lubrication devices (standard features on series models) remained well coated. This waxoyl is on like glue, everywhere, with nothing under it, and it ain't goin' nowhere. As time goes on and the remaining solvent in it evaporates, it seems to slowly spread, and not spread thin but kinda thicken. Hunkerin' down for winter. My axle housings and springs, previously rusting on the surface, have a lasting glow I could only have gotten-but never kept-with a fresh paint job. Everything underneath finally looks as it is-fresh and lubed and well maintained. I'm so happy. Nigel is so psyched he popped himself right outa gear the other day, backed his butt on down a slope and into a phone poll, just to match the dent the NYC cabbie put into the other side. Spunky boy. A 2.5L "tin" (another one for the glossery-it's a can, dammit) of Waxoyl can be bought with the pump, wand, and extension tip, which is just a hose with a fitting for the wand with a nail in one end (but very good for frame rails) for just under $50 US. That's around what I paid at Moss Motors. Replacement 2.5L tins go for about $25-30. Kinda expensive, but worth every dime. Also don't forget, you can use it in your hair, but it makes lousy toothpaste. cheers all, rd/nigel ps Not I nor anybody who pretends to be me neither supports nor dispells nothin'. That should cover it. From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Thu Dec 1 09:30:57 1994 X-Authentication-Warning: tornadic.sw.stratus.com: Host localhost.stratus.com didn't use HELO protocol To: Land-Rover-Owner@Team.Net Subject: Re: The Land Rover Owner Daily Digest In-Reply-To: Your message of "Thu, 01 Dec 94 07:55:28 GMT." <199412010755.HAA25335@chunnel.uk.stratus.com> Date: Thu, 01 Dec 94 06:17:17 -0500 From: William Caloccia Status: RO X-Status: From: "T.F. Mills" Subject: Re: Camel Trophy 95 < etc. They didn't always sponsor the Camel Trophy, but I understand that < the past 3 or 4 years they have handled all the publicity for the Camel < Trophy event. > Maybe I'm imagining it, but I think Worldwide Brands International > (WBI) has sponsored Camel Trophy from the beginning. 'Camel' (as in I'd walk a mile for a...), and the classic green and tan Camel trophy logo have been there for years... some some years ago (5-10), 'Camel' (as in the smokin' Joe kiddie brand) ceased to be the proper sponser, but handed it off to the now lucrative 'Camel Trophy Adventure Gear/Wear' to sponser, eg. the marketing of associated 'name' items had become a profit making end in it self (witness the 'Marlboro Classics' store just out side of convent garden, at your local NASCAR event, etc.) > There is a Worldwide Brands Inc in Grimbergen, Belgium, but it is a > management consulting service. (Boechoutlaan 55, Grimbergen 1853, tel things are often named for what they are not... > There is also an RJR-WBI office in Hong Kong. I can't imagine the More likely they're wholely-owned subsidiaries operating in the EMEA (Europe MiddleEast and Afrrica) and AP (Asia-Pacific) business regions, which seems to be the trend for U.S. companies [looking across the Atlantic or Pacific]. ------------------------------ From: "Stefan R. Jacob" <100043.2400@compuserve.com> Subject: Re: equipment / chains > there. IOW, on a Land Rover you *don't need chains in deep snow* . > A different thing is hard, compacted snow 'polished' by traffic (or > skiers), or icy roads. There, nothing beats chains. Another entirely different kind of snow is what happens after you get 18 to 24 inches and then it does a freezing rain bit... basically, the snow was crusted over hard enough I could walk on it (and for those of you who haven't met me, I should say bit closer to 20 stone than 10 stone) The rover (OK, so they were kind of pacifist tyres), was doing ok until John hit a slight drift on an incline. It went up a little and then managed to settle into the drift. In the middle of this sheet of ice above the snow. Some hacking to remove the obstructing ice in front and stuffed up before frame rails and it was off again. ------------------------------ European Delivery: One salesman at Keeler in Albany left me with the impression that it _was_ possible, however, that _was_ a sales droid. FYI: I rang up H.R.Owen, a (not particluarly liked) LR/RR dealer in London, and the sales droid there said that as a UK dealer, he could only order UK units. I looked about the rear of LRO, but could find no UK dealers that said they did exports. As I recall LRNA is in MD or VA, and you might want to ring them. I also recall that Rovers North advertised LR vehicles for export, so failing LRNA, you might want to give them a ring. If all that fails, find out what Beemers do, and then write to Solihul and Munich and ask why LR doesn't do the same... Stefen: still haven't sold that LHD SIII eh ? rd/nige: the digester isn't able to trim the long forwarded passages that have line splits added when wrapped, so be nice and don't forward the whole message, or don't split the lines so the digester doesn't hurl, eh ? From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Thu Dec 1 09:58:49 1994 Date: Thu, 01 Dec 1994 08:00:11 -0500 From: maloney@wings.attmail.com (maloney) Phone: 201-564-2073 Subject: Donner Pass To: LRO@stratus.com Content-Type: Text Status: O X-Status: Morgan wrote: >> I come to the check-point where the CHP and CalTrans makes sure vehicles are equiped to go through the Donner Summit including talking to drivers of ill prepared cars. I pull up, and they just chuckled and waved me through. >> I've heard a lot about Donner Pass and saw Ken Burns' brothers documentry on the Donner party, but I'm curious. What is the pass like? Has anyone driven that and Smuggler's Notch in VT also? How do they compare? Smuggler's Notch is fairly steep (no trucks/trailers allowed) and requires full lock and 1st gear on the 109 at times, but the Donner Pass is much more legendary. Sandy, have you driven both? Bill maloney@wings.attmail.com From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Thu Dec 1 10:00:41 1994 From: Mike Rooth Subject: Floyd on FWH To: lro@transfer.stratus.com Date: Thu, 1 Dec 94 12:36:29 GMT Status: O X-Status: There's a letter in the current issue of LRW (just arrived this morning...early!)on the subject of FWH,written by Ross Floyd of the Series Two Club.He hates them!Basically,his opinion is that they dont give any better fuel consumption because you tend to use the extra power available to go faster,you tend never to engage them to sling some oil around in the swivel housings, (oil?what oil)and......and this I *cant* really credit..he uses low box for parking and shunting trailers around!Without the hubs engaged,what's more,whch doesnt do his back axle an awful lot of good.I dont know what worldwide opinion is on this, but my view is he asks for all he gets.If you want better fuel consumption,then dont bleed the stuff of with speed.Driver's option,no?Point about the oil I reckon is fair enough,I dont know anyone that *does* engage the things for this purpose. I talked a mate into doing it with his S111 once,and he reckoned the noise was so incredible that he'll never do it again! As for using low box for shoving trailers around,on tarmac,well, even *I* dont have to resort to that,and I dont rate myself any particular dab hand at reversing horse boxes into spaces *just* too small for them:-((.But use low box?Be damned if I will. What do the rest of you think? Cheers Mike Rooth From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Thu Dec 1 10:00:55 1994 From: Russell Burns Subject: Re: Donner Pass To: maloney@wings.attmail.com (maloney) Date: Thu, 1 Dec 94 4:20:35 PST Cc: lro@stratus.com In-Reply-To: ; from "maloney" at Dec 1, 94 8:00 am Status: O X-Status: > > I've heard a lot about Donner Pass and saw Ken Burns' brothers documentry on > the Donner party, but I'm curious. What is the pass like? Has anyone driven > that and Smuggler's Notch in VT also? How do they compare? Smuggler's > Notch is fairly steep (no trucks/trailers allowed) and requires full lock and > 1st gear on the 109 at times, but the Donner Pass is much more legendary. > Sandy, have you driven both? > > Bill > > maloney@wings.attmail.com > I have driven, and skied smugglers notch. I don't remember the drive as overly exciting, but skiing down the road on glare ice was a blast. (We camped in the hut at the top of the notch.) Russ From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Thu Dec 1 11:21:57 1994 From: Russell Burns Subject: Re: Waxoyl ingredients To: dushinrg@pr.cyanamid.com (Russell G. Dushin) Date: Thu, 1 Dec 94 7:27:31 PST Cc: lro@stratus.com In-Reply-To: <199412010506.AAA02463@transfer.stratus.com>; from "Russell G. Dushin" at Dec 1, 94 12:08 am Status: RO X-Status: > the nasties of nature and does all the work. I know, I'll taste it. Gotta be > able to taste wax.....There's ah, nope...no warnings on the label...says it's > just like sprayin' roses...I put it in my hair, knowingly....ok..... > > Oh, man, yuck. How am I ever gonna get this taste outa my mouth? Where's the > Scotch? > > Just can't trust these outa-merica labels. Don't you folks got no manners? > There isn't a warning on this package that tells me not to feed this to my dog, > cat, horse, or my kids (if I have any, I dunno), or not to eat it myself. Like > pushin' pills on a baby. It *does* tell me not to put it in my eyes, and to > keep it out of the reach of children, but I drink stuff like that. How do you > folks get away with this??? Don't got no legislaaation? Too much?? > I think the proper application here is to dilute the waxole with cheap Scotch, or kerosene. Warm it gently, light the liqued, and drink the mixture rather rapidly.... Russ (please don't try this at home. only trained rover nuts in garages should attempt this) > From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Thu Dec 1 11:22:11 1994 Date: Thu, 1 Dec 94 08:22:19 -0800 From: "TeriAnn Wakeman" Reply-To: "TeriAnn Wakeman" To: morgan@nature.Berkeley.EDU, lro@team.net Subject: Re: Waxoyl equivalents? Status: RO X-Status: In message Morgan Hannaford writes: > > I've never seen waxoyl(sic) on the shelf, and apparently others have > received strange responses from hardware stores for asking Morgan, You can mail order Waxol from Moss Motors (800-235-6954) in Goleta CA. Ask for their Austain Healey catalogue. There are a number of electrical parts that these cars share with Land Rovers & you can get them cheaper than through Rovers North. TeriAnn Wakeman Large format photographers look at the world twakeman@apple.com upside down and backwards From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Thu Dec 1 11:22:43 1994 Date: Thu, 1 Dec 1994 11:42:29 -0500 (EST) From: Jon Humphrey To: morgan@nature.Berkeley.EDU (Morgan Hannaford), "Russell G. Dushin" Subject: Re: Waxoyl equivalents? Cc: lro@team.net In-Reply-To: <199411302111.QAA06398@transfer.stratus.com> Status: RO X-Status: Russ writes; > > rd/nige > >ps I'll check on the ingredients tonight > >pps what's the cost?? The waxoyl was $30ish a can from Moss Motors. >(and a can is a half gallon) I just got a price from one distributor here in Pittsburgh of $43.07/gallon, and $8.88/11oz. spray can. I got a price last night from another supplier of $4.70/11oz.spray can. He didn't have any gallons. Go figure? Jon From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Thu Dec 1 11:22:55 1994 Date: Thu, 1 Dec 1994 11:49:21 -0500 (EST) From: Jon Humphrey To: morgan@nature.Berkeley.EDU (Morgan Hannaford), "Russell G. Dushin" Subject: Re: Waxoyl equivalents? addendum Cc: lro@team.net In-Reply-To: <199411302111.QAA06398@transfer.stratus.com> Status: RO X-Status: >pps what's the cost?? The waxoyl was $30ish a can from Moss Motors. >(and a can is a half gallon) I just got a price from one distributor here in Pittsburgh of $43.07/gallon, and $8.88/11oz. spray can. I got a price last night from another supplier of $4.70/11oz.spray can. He didn't have any gallons. Go figure? Jon Sorry about that. These are the prices for LPS 3 HD rust inhib. Seems the utilities and the city use a lot of it on their stuff. From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Thu Dec 1 14:04:22 1994 From: "Rostykus, John" To: LRO List Subject: Re: Moss Motors picture Date: Thu, 01 Dec 94 09:58:00 PST Encoding: 15 TEXT Status: RO X-Status: >... and then Art Van der Star's ultra cool >Ser lla 109 Fire Truck. This was one of two Rovers that were purchased >and did yeomans work for an oil refinery up in Alberta, Canada. It's in >original condition and Art even gave us a demo of the 2000 gallon per >minute fire pump, throwing a supply hose into the nearby pond and >shooting a stream for a couple minutes. The truck has an original >Land Rover trailer made from the rear of a 109 chassis with a 500 gallon >water tank mounted. He really enjoys the rig and loves to talk about >it's history to all who ask. For anyone interested, this vehicle had a for-sale sign on it at the meet... Rosty john@data-io.com From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Thu Dec 1 14:04:37 1994 From: "Rostykus, John" To: LRO List Subject: RE: Hybridizing Date: Thu, 01 Dec 94 10:24:00 PST Encoding: 16 TEXT Status: O X-Status: >I am considering turning the Series IIA into a hybrid. Anyone know where >to get a cheap '90 or Range Rover chassis to play with. > >Also, has anyone in N.A. installed a non Rover deisel into their Rover >and what type of motor and costs were associated. > >James Spyker 196? SIIA Sorry about the noise, but my mailer ate your 'return address'. I put a perkins 4.182 in my '79 RR. Please e-mail me directly for more details. Rosty john@data-io.com From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Thu Dec 1 14:05:12 1994 Posted-Date: Thu, 1 Dec 1994 10:51:18 -0800 To: lro@team.net Subject: Re: Floyd on FWH In-Reply-To: Your message of "Thu, 01 Dec 1994 12:36:29 GMT." <9412011236.AA08590@hpc.lut.ac.uk> Date: Thu, 01 Dec 1994 10:51:10 -0800 From: Benjamin Allan Smith Status: O X-Status: Mike Rooth wrote: > you tend never to > engage them to sling some oil around in the swivel housings, > (oil?what oil)and... [snip] > Point about the oil I reckon is fair enough,I dont > know anyone that *does* engage the things for this purpose. > I talked a mate into doing it with his S111 once,and he reckoned > the noise was so incredible that he'll never do it again! I'm tring to take better care of my Rover from now on. I've been engaging the hubs and driving a few miles once a week to sling the oil around. Of course in the weeks that I go off road I can ignore this. Since I'm putting 300 to 400 miles on the Rover every week I figures that this would be a good idea. But we'll see how long I actually keep remembering in do it. I'm also tring to get into the habit of changing the oil every 3000miles instead of every 5000. Which reminds me, I should change the oil tomorrow. -Benjamin Smith ---------------- Science Applications Internation Corporation China Lake Naval Air Weapons Center bens@archimedes.vislab.navy.mil 1972 Land Rover Series III 88 From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Thu Dec 1 14:06:32 1994 X-Msmail-Message-Id: 910B1B2B X-Msmail-Conversation-Id: 910B1B2B From: Mike Dryfoos To: lro@team.net Date: Thu, 1 Dec 94 11:06:38 TZ Subject: Range Rover owner goes retro Status: O X-Status: Well, inspired in part by you lot, and the sheer funky charm of the beast, I've gone out and acquired a '71 Series IIA 88", to keep the '92 Range Rover company. The previous owner bought the thing in somewhat sad shape, and spent a couple of years restoring bits and pieces of engine, brakes, suspension, attacking rust spots, repainting it the original poppy red and limestone, and rebuilding the interior. It is fully dressed with accessories, to wit, a Superwinch overdrive, Dualmatic FWHs, Warn winch, safari roof, roof-line air intake snorkel, and even a radio. It needs new parking brake shoes now, new tires soon, and and engine rebuild in a couple of years. The odometer shows about 115,000 miles. My wife and I are training two search and rescue dogs, which involves frequent trips to the mountains for exercises. We've been using the RR for transport, but the dogs are pretty hard on it. We'll now be using the LR instead -- after all, what is there for the dogs to destroy, anyway? I don't have a lot of experience with automotive mechanics, so this is going to be a big learning experience for me. I figured with the old Rover's reputation as an easy-to-work-on vehicle, this would be a good place to start. I'm sure I'll have lots of questions for the old hands among you. Any words of encouragment or warning about what I should be watching out for now? Any Seattle-area folks willing to provide hands-on advice to a novice owner? From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Fri Dec 2 09:05:38 1994 Date: Thu, 1 Dec 94 12:08:23 PST From: labranch@sybase.com (Jason LaBranch) To: lro@team.net Subject: A few thoughts on Winches Content-Length: 1390 Status: O X-Status: I have just a few thoughts on winches since this seems to be the subject lately. If you have say a 8,000lb winche you can actually increase this to 16,000lb by simple adding an appropriatly weighted pully. When doing this you want to make sure that all the components will handle the strain. The cable should be fine as is because you are effectively doubling it over. Have an extra long length of chain or cable that can handle 16,000lbs that you could attach one end to an achor and one end to the pully. Pull your cable all the way out, wrap it around the pully and attach the hook end back on you vehicle. The speed of the winche will be cut in half but you will have lots of pulling power. Another Idea is that if you have the proper fittings you can use your high lift jack as a hand winche thus eliminating the need for a power winche. It is good to have these fittings any way incase your powered winche fails mechanically. My last thought is personal. Be very careful about what you attach the end of the cables to. Take caution of where you stand and where others are standing in relation to the vehicle and the achor. This is especially true for streaching ropes. A young boy I knew was watching as a vehicle was pulling a platform out of a lake and was killed instantly when a piece of an anchor riped off and shoved his nose into his brain. Jason LaBranch From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Fri Dec 2 09:06:31 1994 Posted-Date: Thu, 1 Dec 1994 12:30:43 -0800 To: lro@team.net Subject: Re: A few thoughts on Winches In-Reply-To: Your message of "Thu, 01 Dec 1994 12:08:23 PST." <9412012008.AA12308@yeola.sybgate.sybase.com> Date: Thu, 01 Dec 1994 12:30:36 -0800 From: Benjamin Allan Smith Status: O X-Status: Jason LaBranch wrote: > If you have say a 8,000lb winche you can actually increase this > to 16,000lb by simple adding an appropriatly weighted pully. When Yup. Warn sells a kit with a snatch block (pulley), tree strap, a length of chain, gloves and shackle (for attaching the snatch block to the tree strap). The snatch block is also useful for times when you can't get a straight line pull from your vehicle to the anchor that you are using. The snatch block can be used to put a bend in the cable. > Another Idea is that if you have the proper fittings you can use > your high lift jack as a hand winche thus eliminating the need > for a power winche. It is good to have these fittings any way > incase your powered winche fails mechanically. Although this takes a bloody long time. But it works in a pinch. > My last thought is personal. Be very careful about what you attach > the end of the cables to. Take caution of where you stand and > where others are standing in relation to the vehicle and the achor. Just be careful. Ropes and cables can break and when they do they will cut through people. When I use the winch, I toss a blanket on top of the cable. This way if the cable severs or the anchor pulls out, there is some mass trying to keep the cable on the ground. I'd much rather loose a foot than my head. Another safety recommendation is to put the hood of your vehicle up when you are doing heavy winching. That way the hood (and tyre for Land Rovers) takes the impact instead of the windshield and possibly your head. -Benjamin Smith ---------------- Science Applications Internation Corporation China Lake Naval Air Warfare Center bens@archimedes.vislab.navy.mil 1972 Land Rover Series III 88 From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Fri Dec 2 09:07:15 1994 Date: Thu, 1 Dec 94 12:35:25 -0800 From: "TeriAnn Wakeman" Reply-To: "TeriAnn Wakeman" To: john@dspmail.Data-IO.COM, LRO@apple.com, List@apple.com, lro@transfer.stratus.com Subject: Re: Moss Motors picture Status: O X-Status: In message <2EDE0EAE@dspmail.data-io.com> "Rostykus, John" writes: > > >... and then Art Van der Star's ultra cool > >Ser lla 109 Fire Truck. This was one of two Rovers that were purchased > >and did yeomans work for an oil refinery up in Alberta, Canada. It's in > >original condition and Art even gave us a demo of the 2000 gallon per > >minute fire pump, throwing a supply hose into the nearby pond and > >shooting a stream for a couple minutes. The truck has an original > >Land Rover trailer made from the rear of a 109 chassis with a 500 gallon > >water tank mounted. He really enjoys the rig and loves to talk about > >it's history to all who ask. > > For anyone interested, this vehicle had a for-sale sign on it at the meet... > > Rosty > john@data-io.com Dare I ask how much was asked for the LR??? A neighbor's house, 1/4 mi away through the forrest, went up in flames a week ago. Had everything not been wet from a recent rain, the whole neighborhood could have had gone up. Watching the neighbor trying to fight the fire with a gargen hose as the fire was engulfing the garage then going to the house while the fire department was going back & forth on a nearby road trying to find the correct road did not inspire confidence. TeriAnn Wakeman Large format photographers look at the world twakeman@apple.com upside down and backwards From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Fri Dec 2 09:07:44 1994 From: "Rostykus, John" To: TeriAnn Wakeman Cc: LRO List Subject: Re: Moss Motors picture Date: Thu, 01 Dec 94 13:51:00 PST Encoding: 21 TEXT Status: O X-Status: >> >... and then Art Van der Star's ultra cool >> >it's history to all who ask. >> >> For anyone interested, this vehicle had a for-sale sign on it at the meet... >> >> Rosty >> john@data-io.com > >Dare I ask how much was asked for the LR??? Vague recollection says $10,000 canadian. b.t.w. I have no intention of representing this vehicle, but would be glad to help anyone interested in contacting the owner (I do not know Art personally, but know folks who do). Rosty john@data-io.com From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Fri Dec 2 09:07:54 1994 Date: Thu, 1 Dec 94 16:40:43 CST From: jahoff@heartland.bradley.edu (Janice Hoffart) To: lro@stratus.com Subject: Unsubscribe Reply-To: jahoff@heartland.bradley.edu Status: O X-Status: Please unsubscribe jahoff@heartland.bradley.edu Thank you... -- Benjamin J. Freeman Lanf"Land Rover Fanatice!" 73' Series III , Owner From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Fri Dec 2 09:08:48 1994 From: dkenner@emr.ca (Dixon Kenner) Subject: Re: Imposing Winch & Starter Problems To: halightw@FLASH.LakeheadU.CA (Hal A. Lightwood) Date: Thu, 1 Dec 1994 18:42:39 -0500 (EST) Cc: lro@stratus.com In-Reply-To: from "Hal A. Lightwood" at Nov 30, 94 04:10:13 pm Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 641 Status: O X-Status: > I received the Rovers North Newsletter today, and noticed a familiar name > from this list had the "most imposing winch". (Dixon Kenner) Very nice! A Koenig pto winch. There are a bunch in OVLR and on the list. > Actually, this is more than slightly inconvenient, it is very very very > annoying. Why am I plagued with this problem?? 1. How are the studs? 2. How are the lock washers? (flat?) 3. Try brass nuts that get tighter are they heat up, thus should not loosen. 4. Are the studs stripped at the endwhere they should be tight? 5. Are the nuts semi-stripped? Not to many reasons why this can happen... Rgds, From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Fri Dec 2 09:08:56 1994 Date: Thu, 1 Dec 1994 16:38:09 +0800 From: William.Grouell@Eng.Sun.COM (William L. Grouell) To: lro@stratus.com Subject: Re: Imposing Winch & Starter Problems X-Sun-Charset: US-ASCII Content-Length: 244 Status: O X-Status: > > Actually, this is more than slightly inconvenient, it is very very very > > annoying. Why am I plagued with this problem?? Put new lock washers on it. Put nylon stop nuts (aircraft) on it. They are 3/8-24 (AF). Do both. R, bg From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Fri Dec 2 09:11:38 1994 From: "Russell G. Dushin" Subject: waxoyl vs. LPS To: morgan@nature.Berkeley.EDU (Morgan Hannaford) Date: Thu, 1 Dec 94 19:48:44 EST Cc: lro@team.net In-Reply-To: ; from "Morgan Hannaford" at Nov 30, 94 12:52 (noon) Mailer: Elm [revision: 66.36.1.1] Status: RO X-Status: OK, one more time Morgan saiz LPS has > Ingedients: (get out your chem. 1A text) > Aliphatic hydrocarbon, petrolium oil, Dipropylene glycol monomethyl ether No need for the chem text, this is basic stuff. Aliphatic hydrocarbons could mean lotsa stuff, but here they probably mean a mixture of things like pentanes, hexanes, heptanes, octanes, nonanes, decanes, etc, etc....basically all solvents. Petro oil-ahh, lube. Anything from vasoline to 5 wt and back to wheel bearing grease. Probably a crude mix taken straight from the hull of a ship. Dipropylene glycol monomethyl ether.....CH3OCH2CH2CH2OCH2CH2CH2OH, and isomers thereof. Just for kicks I looked up what this stuff is used for. Apparently, it is used in the ink industry rather extensively (and several of the abstracts of papers and patents I read mentioned that the resulting ink when used in ball point pens prevents the corrosion of the ball point-but there were other things in the ink that could have been responsible for the anti-corrosive properties) One paper was entitled "Two-component permanent-waving composition for human hair", ....so maybe this IS the magic ingredient in waxoyl! But no mention of wax or parrafin itself, aye?? > If anyone has a waxoyl jug handy, let's compare ingredients. Well, as I said, whatever it is it ain't on the label. I made a brief attempt to look up waxoyl. Got nothin'. Looked up hammerite (even though it isn't claimed to be in waxoyl, but waxoyl is made by the same folks-the Hammerite Corporation, or something to that effect-that market hammerite). It turned up one reference to a Copper-lead-bismuth sulfide complex, but it was on the crystal forms of this stuff (which is apparently mined...and therefore might not be considered "chemical" but rather "mineral" to the marketing folk who wrote the label I described earlier) and what "point group" they fall into. Nothing about its use. I then spoke with an information specialist here at work...a library dude. He said that the composition was probably a trade secret, and suggested the best he or I would come up with would be to find out who makes the stuff...and we already know that. He then went on to tell a story about his grad school advisor that got so hung up on the composition of a gas additive (that he couldn't find out from the patent literature) that he had one of his students inject the stuff into a gc.....they basically watched peak after peak come off for the rest of the day. I don't think I'll be injecting any waxoyl into my gc. so there you have it-it's a trade secret. But if you are "hooked on phonics" and barely literate, you could probably figure out that it has wax and oil in it. If and when I find some parafin lying around I think I'll toss it into some hexane, spray it on my fume hood on a metal area, park some nasty acid under it, and see if the sprayed part offers any protection. If it works, how much you wanna buy?? rd/nigel From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Fri Dec 2 09:14:38 1994 From: jpappa01@interserv.com Date: Thu, 1 Dec 1994 20:04:56 -0800 To: Land-Rover-Owner@team.net, LRO-Digest@uk.stratus.com Subject: Re: The Land Rover Owner Daily Digest Status: RO X-Status: DEFENDER 90 UPDATES: ITS HERE AT LONG LAST!! The GRP H A R D T O P is finally a reality!! It can now be ordered through any authorized dealer. Hard price is not known but around $2,000. It looks GREAT! Official ship date was 11/29. Any bad news? Oh sure. Yes, ANOTHER WAITING LIST. Dealers being RATIONED initially to FIVE tops/month. Better scurry on down now if you want one for this winter! First color ad showing the top is featured in the latest AUTOMOBILE magazine (BMW M3 cover). And in equally exciting news... the (gasp!) ALUMINUM HARDTOP DEFENDER 90 is now in the port and being shipped to dealers... AS WE SPEAK! You think that demand for the DEFENDER 110 was bad? What about 40(!!) aluminum hardtop models!!! Yep. A-bud-ia, bud-ia, bud-ia - that's all, folks! 1 RED, 2 WHITE, and 37 CONNISTON GREEN units. A strategic source has informed me that although NOTHING is FOREVER, that the 40 units is it! Take that for what its worth. FORTY units! And 87 dealers! Guess what? Here we go again, another feeding frenzy! I know who has a deposit on the first unit to be shipped to the local dealership around here (NO - IT IS NOT ME, OK?). I'll blow his cover if he takes delivery of it in THE ROVER REFERENCE. PRICE? N/A. BODY COLOR SIDES, ALPINE WHITE TOP SECTION. GET THIS -- SERIES ONE (ONE!!) UPPER TAILGATE LID!! YES! LR HAD TO DIG UP THE TOOLING FROM SOME PRIVATE CITIZEN IN UK WHO PURCHASED SAME A JILLION YEARS AGO! WOW! I LOVE IT... I hope to scoff a complete photo shoot of the first unit and make the shots available via Club newsletter. Guess what else (decadence, here we come...)? Yes, a POWERED SUBWOOFER/CD CHANGER FOR DEFENDER 90 AS AN ACCESSORY! Which means that DEFENDER 110 owners are LIBERATED as well. Should work via existing head unit in 90/110! 1995 DEFENDER 90 to come with a partial soft top standard in lieu of tonneau cover. No more AIRIES BLUE for `95. BELUGA BLACK to be regular production color instead. That's all I know for now. Nothing on 1995 prices. Shouldn't be too bad since DISCO increase was nominal. Stay tuned. ROVER TIMEOUT. Jim Pappas BSROA jpappa01@interserv.com From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Fri Dec 2 09:15:52 1994 From: LANDROVER@delphi.com Date: Fri, 02 Dec 1994 00:17:34 -0500 (EST) Subject: Re: Range Rover owner goes retro To: mikedr@microsoft.com, lro@team.net X-Vms-To: INTERNET"mikedr@microsoft.com" X-Vms-Cc: INTERNET"lro@team.net" Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Status: O X-Status: Mike sees the light and goes leafsprung... > > Well, inspired in part by you lot, and the sheer funky charm of the > beast, I've gone out and acquired a '71 Series IIA 88", to keep the '92 > Range Rover company. --snip--- > among you. Any words of encouragment or warning about what I should be > watching out for now? Mike... Congrats on your new addition... I'm not from Seattle but I'll add my two cents... 1. Watch those Dualmatic hubs... (They have the bar you pull out and turn, right?? If not, ignore this!) More than one person has said that the bar can pop out by itself and give you assorted problems. 2. If you ever have to top off the brake or clutch fluids.. use CASTROL brake fluid only!! (Unless you converted to silicone.) Some American brake fluids have a nasty habit of destroying the rubber componants in the hydraulic system. Cheers Michael Loiodice E-MAIL landrover@delphi.com 166 W.Fulton St. VOICE (518) 773-2697 Gloversville NY, 12078 1972 Ser III 88 Petrol (Fern) 7 1971 Ser IIa 88 Petrol #:-}> 1965 Ser IIa 88 Petrol From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Fri Dec 2 09:16:44 1994 Posted-Date: Thu, 1 Dec 1994 21:34:44 -0800 >From: Benjamin Allan Smith To: lro@team.net Subject: riding in back of a Land Rover Reply-To: bens@archimedes.vislab.navy.mil Date: Thu, 01 Dec 1994 21:34:38 -0800 From: Benjamin Allan Smith Status: O X-Status: I've been meaning to send this out all week, but its been one of those weeks.... So last weekend I was driving around the Salton Sea area with friends. We had a diverse collection of vecicles. My Land Rover, a ~91 Jeep Wranger, and older Land Cuiser, a large Chevy pickup (I forget which model) and a dune buggy. We all headed out along some really rough roads. The thing that got me was where the people decided to sit. There were 2 each in the jeep and dune buggy; and one each in the Land Cruiser and Pickup; and 5 in my Land Rover?!? The other 4 were the 16 or 17 year old daughter of the Land Cruise owner and her friends. I still can't believe that all 4 would voluntarily sit in the back while I drove off road. I did have the hardtop off, but the ride in back, especially with two people per jump seat, leaves a lot to be desired. One thing that I did learn on the trip was that if you have P235/75 R15 tyres, and youare driving down some railroad tracks, you can get stuck with the plate that the Ubolts bolt to hung up on one of the rails and the tyres on that side having traction when they are one the ties and free spinning between the ties. Just don't stop... Luckily for me the rail line was an abandoned one... -Benjamin Smith ---------------- Science Applications Internation Corporation China Lake Naval Air Weapons Center bens@archimedes.vislab.navy.mil 1972 Land Rover Series III 88 From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Fri Dec 2 09:17:06 1994 From: LANDROVER@delphi.com Date: Fri, 02 Dec 1994 01:04:50 -0500 (EST) Subject: Re: waxoyl vs. LPS To: dushinrg@pr.cyanamid.com, lro@team.net X-Vms-To: INTERNET"dushinrg@pr.cyanamid.com" X-Vms-Cc: INTERNET"lro@team.net" Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Status: RO X-Status: Another mystery almost solved.... > From: IN%"dushinrg@pr.cyanamid.com" "Russell G. Dushin" 1-DEC-1994 > > > Aliphatic hydrocarbon, petrolium oil, Dipropylene glycol monomethyl > ether > > No need for the chem text, this is basic stuff. Aliphatic hydrocarbons Basic for you maybe... just so much gobbledegook to me.. > could mean lotsa stuff, but here they probably mean a mixture of things > like pentanes, hexanes, heptanes, octanes, nonanes, decanes, etc, > etc....basically all solvents. Petro oil-ahh, lube. Anything from > vasoline to 5 wt and back to wheel bearing grease. Probably a > crude mix taken straight from the hull of a ship. Dipropylene glycol > monomethyl ether.....CH3OCH2CH2CH2OCH2CH2CH2OH, and isomers thereof. Ah,ha... lotsa C's and H's and O's... CH, CH, CHOO CHOO... Howzat? I think I finally understand Russell... you did way too many chemicals... Well anyway.. thanks for your in-debth anaylsis of fine rust inhibitors and hair tonic.. I think we can all rest easier knowing this. (Quick... call the boys down at the state hospital... yeah, yeah, get the one with the funny hair...) Cheers! Michael Loiodice E-MAIL landrover@delphi.com 166 W.Fulton St. VOICE (518) 773-2697 Gloversville NY, 12078 1972 Ser III 88 Petrol (Fern) 7 1971 Ser IIa 88 Petrol #:-}> 1965 Ser IIa 88 Petrol From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Fri Dec 2 09:19:47 1994 Posted-Date: Thu, 1 Dec 1994 22:15:56 -0800 >From: Benjamin Allan Smith To: lro@team.net Subject: California Desert Protection Act Reply-To: bens@archimedes.vislab.navy.mil Date: Thu, 01 Dec 1994 22:15:50 -0800 From: Benjamin Allan Smith Status: RO X-Status: A few weeks ago someone asked if I knew anything about this new law that President Clinton signed. At the time I didn't, but now I do so I thought I would pass it on... The is from _Ecological 4 Wheeling_ Dec 1994, Vol IX, No. 9 and the author is Harry Lewellyn. -------include article----------- California Desert Protection Act ================================ The California Desert Protection Act, as recently signed into law by President Clinton "Did not affect the majority of Off-Highway-Vehicle (OHV) areas" according to BLM [Bureau of Land Managment -Ben] officials. There are thousands of miles of designated, Limited Use Routes availible throughout the California Desert District, for street legal 4WD vehicles and motorcycles. Due to the efforts of many OHV organizations, the Act preserved a number of areas popular with the Green Sticker crowd. Green Sticker vehicles are those registered with the California Department of Motor Vehicles, but not legal for highway use. In particular, the majority of the Imperial Dunes, Dumont Dunes, Stoddard and Johnson Valleys, Jawbone/Dove Springs and Spangler Hills areas remain open. The Act changed Death Valley and Joshua Tree National Monuments to National Parks. In addition, it created the 1.4 million-acre Mojave National Preserve where vehicular travel will also be limited to street legal vehicles only. Under BLM definition, the newly created Wilderness areas do not allow motorized or mechanized equipment use. A Wilderness area must be accepted largely on its own terms. Modern facilities for comfort and convenience are excluded. In addition to the BLM OHV areas, California Department of Parks and Recreation, Off-Highway Vehicle Recreation Division, Cliff Glidden explains that the state operates two off-highway vehicle parks in southern California. Ocotillo Wells State Vehicular Recreation Area (SVRA), located in eastern San Diego County, offers more than 40,000 acres of PHV riding opportunites. Use (619) 767-5391 for additional information. Hungry Valley SVRA, located at Tejon Pass near the town of Gorman, has many challenges for all types of OHVs and all levels of experience on the 19,000 acre facility. There are also extensive OHV opportunites in the adjoining Los Padres National Forest. Call (805) 248-7000 for more information on Hungry Valley. --------end article------------- The article also included a map of southern California and showed the areas that are affected and listed a bunch of BLM and National Park Service contacts for more information. From looking at the map: The Mojave National Preserve: take the triangle defined by I-15, I-40 and the California/Nevada border. The Preserve stretches from the I-15 to the I-40 and occupies most of the eastern half of the triangle. The western border of this preserve also has an attached BLM wilderness area (also borders the I-40). So pretty much the eastern 2/3 of this triangle is affected. Also the corner near Needles is BLM Wilderness. The Borders of Joshua Tree and Death Valley I believe are already fairly well defined. Other BLM Wilderness Areas: There is only one area west of the 395/I-15 line and that is up near me in Ridgecrest. It looks like it borders state 395 and state 14 where they meet and extends up into the hills. There are a few small globs of wilderness (3) that exist on the line between Barstow and Ridgecrest. Large chuncks of land ajoining Death Valley are now BLM Wilderness. Define the box of the Nevada/California border, I-15 from the Nevada border to halfway to Barstow, to the South East corner of the Death Valley Nat'l Park, and the Nat'l Park bounday up to where is joins the Nevada border. Most (like 80%) of this land is now Wilderness. Now for the box of I-15 (on the west), I-40 on the north, I-10 on the south and the California boarder on the east. The eastern half of this box is about 50% BLM wilderness (lots of separate chunks--looks like a checker board). The western part of this box is mostly free. There are two chucks of BLM wilderness east of Joshua tree and two chunks East-South-East of Barstow. Next the box of I-15,I-10, I-8 and the California/Arizona border. From About where Joshua Tree Nat'l Park starts to the Arizona border along I-40 (south of) is mostly BLM wilerness. There are a few BLM wilderness along the CA/AZ border. 4 chunks of BLM Wilderness exist north of I-8 about halfway between El Centro and the I-15 and one south of I-8 that extends all the way to the Mexico border. I hope this is mostly clear. (I've been here at work for 13.5 hours and I'm beat) I have the map, so if any of you want a photocopy, drop me email with your snailmail address. -Benjamin Smith ---------------- Science Applications Internation Corporation China Lake Naval Air Weapons Center bens@archimedes.vislab.navy.mil 1972 Land Rover Series III 88 From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Fri Dec 2 09:20:21 1994 Date: Thu, 1 Dec 1994 23:00:57 -0800 From: Roger Sinasohn To: lro@stratus.com Subject: Rita, Rita, (Kilo)Metre Maid Cc: sinasohn@netcom.com, sos@mercury.sfsu.edu, babs@uclink2.berkeley.edu Status: O X-Status: A favor to ask... If anyone see's a college girl in a white subaru wagon with straps holding down the bonnet and a ton of stuff, (hopefully) headed east on hwy 80 from Maine to California, Could you sorta make sure she's pointed in the right direction? My sister Rita is supposed to be on her way home from college in Rhode Island (by way of Maine -- it's a horse thing), but we haven't heard from her for a couple of days... No big deal, but my lunatic mother loves to panic, so I thought I'd put a note on the net. BTW, she'll definitely wave back. Thanks in advance! --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad sinasohn@crl.com that none but madmen know." Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates San Francisco, California From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Fri Dec 2 09:20:44 1994 Date: Thu, 1 Dec 1994 23:00:54 -0800 From: Roger Sinasohn To: lro@stratus.com Subject: Ascii Rovers Status: O X-Status: Thought I'd do something useful with my time, so I came up with this: .---------------------------------. / ___________________ \ ,|________/ _______________ \________|, | .---. | / \ | .---. | | | | | | |'%,| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | ,---, | | | | | | | | | | ,---, `---'\| `---' | `-----------------' | `---' |/'---' ,'-------| ___ |-------`, | | /__,| '%, | | (o) | `---' | (o) | | (o) | .-----. | (o) | |.------.| | O | | | ||INDY 1|| | O O | | | |`------'| `-----' '%, | |________|_____________________|________| ~~~~'----------,_________,----------'~~~~ | \~/ | | \~/ | | \~/ | | \~/ | | \~/ | | \~/ | |_____| |_____| Any thoughts or suggestions? P.S. I have been snagging rovers from .sig's, so if anyone's interested, I could compile them and post them. I'm afraid I've not kept track of the artists, though. --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad sinasohn@crl.com that none but madmen know." Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates San Francisco, California From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Fri Dec 2 09:20:52 1994 Via: uk.ac.edinburgh.castle; Fri, 2 Dec 1994 08:26:14 +0000 From: Mr Ian Stuart Organization: Vet-lab,The Univ of Edinburgh To: lro@stratus.com Date: Fri, 2 Dec 1994 08:26:02 +0000 Subject: Re: Ascii Rovers Reply-To: Ian.Stuart@edinburgh.ac.uk Priority: normal Status: O X-Status: > P.S. I have been snagging rovers from .sig's, so if anyone's interested, I > could compile them and post them. I'm afraid I've not kept track of the > artists, though. Wrap them up and ship it off to the two 'Web sights :-) ----** Ian Stuart (Computing Officer) +44 31 650 6205 Royal (Dick) School of Veterinary Studies, Edinburgh University. WWW sites: Work -- Play -- #======================================================================# I'm not a computing nerd, I'm a computing geek. |Land Rover owners do Geeks are much higher up the evolutionary chain. | it in the mud. From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Fri Dec 2 09:21:10 1994 Via: uk.ac.edinburgh.castle; Fri, 2 Dec 1994 08:39:38 +0000 From: Mr Ian Stuart Organization: Vet-lab,The Univ of Edinburgh To: lro@stratus.com Date: Fri, 2 Dec 1994 08:39:09 +0000 Subject: A telly program all about the Land Rover Reply-To: Ian.Stuart@edinburgh.ac.uk Priority: normal Status: O X-Status: Here in the UK one of our motoring programs (Top Gear) recently ran a series called "The Car's the Star". This looked at classic cars, tracing their history and talking to owners, builders and designers. The next series will include the Land Rover (which has been filmed!) Keep an eye out for it... ----** Ian Stuart (Computing Officer) +44 31 650 6205 Royal (Dick) School of Veterinary Studies, Edinburgh University. WWW sites: Work -- Play -- #======================================================================# I'm not a computing nerd, I'm a computing geek. |Land Rover owners do Geeks are much higher up the evolutionary chain. | it in the mud. From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Fri Dec 2 09:23:06 1994 To: mlist-lro@nntp-server.caltech.edu From: rsrose@cco.caltech.edu (Randolph Rose) Newsgroups: mlist.lro Subject: Re: The Land Rover Owner Daily Digest Date: 2 Dec 1994 10:03:04 GMT Organization: California Institute of Technology, Pasadena Status: O X-Status: Well, digest mode has is a pain is that it's hard to respond to only one posting at a time, so I have not chimed in at al when I have wanted to. No problems are boring, but the '57 107 has been doing faithful duty as a daily driver...no big problems for thre years now, knock on wood! Southern Califonia is no winter challenge, (as Ben can probably back up) with temperatures rarely below 40F. Although I would not mind the trips to Salton Sea -- or Death Valley. Some talk of whiches has gone by. The best Winch IMHO, from experience has been a power take off (from the trans where the overdrive is) made by Koenig. You get 4 winch speeds through the trans, control from the cab. I've found control of the winch while sitting in the cab the best, wish I still had my Koenig. I have a hydrolic Rover Winch still to be fitted -- see if it has the same flexibility. I won't forget the time I came upon another 4wd vehicle that had tried to winch another up a slope. Had an elecric winch attached. The load was too much, the winch motor burned out, and it was stuck -- could not go up or douwn. With a PTO winch, I've broken the cable, but I haven't been left stranded attached to another truck, not able to winch in or out... I've found (preffered) the Koenig PTO to be another good choice for another reason: the drum is tall and wide. You don't have to worry about cable binding while winching. FWD hubs: the Fairy hubs with a hex nut on the otside for engage/release have a tendance to slip on hard load - with an un-nerving bang. For the transmission the jumps out of 2nd. If it is a IIa type, been there . Worn 2nd Gear dog mainshaft or slider. Series III trans, probably worn dog on the mainshft gear. Randy on the mainshaft gear. C C C C another up to From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Fri Dec 2 09:23:16 1994 From: Russell Burns Subject: LRO hard top To: jpappa01@interserv.com Date: Fri, 2 Dec 94 3:20:25 PST Cc: lro@stratus.com In-Reply-To: <199412020404.AA02276@interserv.com>; from "jpappa01@interserv.com" at Dec 1, 94 8:04 pm Status: O X-Status: > > DEFENDER 90 UPDATES: > > ITS HERE AT LONG LAST!! The GRP H A R D T O P is finally a reality!! It can > now be ordered through any authorized dealer. Hard price is not known but > around $2,000. It looks GREAT! Official ship date was 11/29. Any bad news? Oh Do you have a Rover part number so I can put my dealership to work? Russ > > From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Fri Dec 2 09:24:01 1994 From: "Mr T.stevenson" Subject: Re: Freewheeling Hubs To: M.J.Rooth@loughborough.ac.uk (Mike Rooth) Date: Fri, 2 Dec 1994 12:34:17 +0000 (GMT) Cc: @nsfnet-relay.ac.uk:land-rover-owner@team.net In-Reply-To: <9411291427.AA00966@hpc.lut.ac.uk> from "Mike Rooth" at Nov 29, 94 02:27:16 pm Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 851 Status: O X-Status: When I had a SIII I used to keep the hubs engaged all the time when driving on the island and only disengage them when I went over to the mainland. This was partly to keep the oil/water gloop in the swivels circulating, but mainly because I always hated getting out of the vehicle into ankle deep slurry/mud/water to engage the hubs whenever I needed 4WD. I never used low range without the hubs engaged (except accidentally) even though the SIII had a salisbury rear axle. I must confess though that now I have a 90 I use low range with the diff unlocked quite a lot for maneuvering trailers etc, and for travelling at 1 mph in traffic jams across the Kingston Bridge on the odd excursion to Glasgow. Cheers -- Tom Stevenson: gbfv08@udcf.gla.ac.uk University Marine Biological Station, Isle of Cumbrae, Scotland Tel:(0475) 530581 Fax:(0475) 530601 From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Fri Dec 2 09:25:07 1994 Date: Fri, 02 Dec 1994 09:28:53 EST From: CXKS46A@prodigy.com (MR ALEXANDER P GRICE) To: land-rover-owner@team.net Subject: Discovery Purchase Status: O X-Status: In yesterday's post, I mentioned the possibility of a friend purchasing a Discovery while on vacation in the UK. As Discoveries are in short supply on this side of the pond, and with but one dealership in the various metropolitan areas, its very much an example of the laws of supply and demand, i.e., low supply + high demand = high prices +long waits. Presumably in the UK, vehicle prices would be lower (excluding the V.A.T., of course) because there are more dealers and vehicles and the cost of shipping across an ocean is not involved...or does it not work that way? Over here, another friend just availed himself of the "Auto Locater" service, and on-line computer service that will find any vehicle for you. Specify vehicle, color, options, etc., and the service will locate that vehicle (new or used) at the best price. If unable to locate one, the service will buy it direct from the factory at the *guaranteed* lowest price. With such information in hand, he purchased a new Ford from a local dealer for a mere fraction over the dealer's *actual* cost. No haggling, no hassle, and saved a bundle. Does such a service exist in the UK or are prices so tightly controlled by Solihull that one dealer's list price is the same as another's. Does competition/sales volume ever enter into the equation? Could a direct factory purchase even be made? Inquiring minds want to know. "I'm not saying I'm over the hill, but I got a pretty darned good view of the valley...." *----"Jeep may be famous, LAND-ROVER is Legendary"-----* | | | Sandy Grice, Rover Owners' Association of Virginia | | E-Mail: CXKS46A@prodigy.com FAX: 804-622-7056 | | Voice: 804-622-7054 (Days) 804-423-4898 (Evenings) | | 1633 Melrose Pkwy., Norfolk, VA, 23508-1730 USA | *------------------------------------------------------* From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Fri Dec 2 09:25:35 1994 Date: Fri, 02 Dec 94 08:02:17 MST From: DEBROWN@SRP.GOV To: lro@team.net, Offroad@ai.gtri.gatech.edu Subject: NEED a CD changer for LR Discovery. Status: O X-Status: FROM: David Brown Internet: debrown@srp.gov Computer Graphics Specialist * Mapping Services & Engr Graphics PAB219 (602)236-3544 - Pager:6486 External (602)275-2508 #6486 SUBJECT: NEED a CD changer for LR Discovery. HELP!!! I am looking for a CD changer to interface with a '94 Land Rover Discovery. The factory unit ($800) is a Pioneer CDX-M65. I can't find a stereo dealer that lists one, and the closest in any catalog is a '93 model CDX-M6 but is not available to any of their sources. I tried a CDX-M30, but it doesn't communicate with the LR radio "head unit". I'd rather not get an FM modulated (universal fit) unit, but as a last resort.... I'll buy a used one if anyone has one!!! The plug is rectangular with 2 rows of pins, approximately 18 pins. The CDX-M30 had the correct plug, but didn't interface. :( I know there are some stereo experts out there... Please HELP!!! #=====# Never doubt that a small group of individuals |___|__\___ can change the world... indeed, it's the only | _ | |_ | thing that ever has. "(_)""""(_)" -Margaret Mead From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Fri Dec 2 10:18:33 1994 From: jpappa01@interserv.com Date: Thu, 1 Dec 1994 20:04:56 -0800 To: Land-Rover-Owner@team.net, LRO-Digest@uk.stratus.com Subject: Re: The Land Rover Owner Daily Digest Status: O X-Status: DEFENDER 90 UPDATES: ITS HERE AT LONG LAST!! The GRP H A R D T O P is finally a reality!! It can now be ordered through any authorized dealer. Hard price is not known but around $2,000. It looks GREAT! Official ship date was 11/29. Any bad news? Oh sure. Yes, ANOTHER WAITING LIST. Dealers being RATIONED initially to FIVE tops/month. Better scurry on down now if you want one for this winter! First color ad showing the top is featured in the latest AUTOMOBILE magazine (BMW M3 cover). And in equally exciting news... the (gasp!) ALUMINUM HARDTOP DEFENDER 90 is now in the port and being shipped to dealers... AS WE SPEAK! You think that demand for the DEFENDER 110 was bad? What about 40(!!) aluminum hardtop models!!! Yep. A-bud-ia, bud-ia, bud-ia - that's all, folks! 1 RED, 2 WHITE, and 37 CONNISTON GREEN units. A strategic source has informed me that although NOTHING is FOREVER, that the 40 units is it! Take that for what its worth. FORTY units! And 87 dealers! Guess what? Here we go again, another feeding frenzy! I know who has a deposit on the first unit to be shipped to the local dealership around here (NO - IT IS NOT ME, OK?). I'll blow his cover if he takes delivery of it in THE ROVER REFERENCE. PRICE? N/A. BODY COLOR SIDES, ALPINE WHITE TOP SECTION. GET THIS -- SERIES ONE (ONE!!) UPPER TAILGATE LID!! YES! LR HAD TO DIG UP THE TOOLING FROM SOME PRIVATE CITIZEN IN UK WHO PURCHASED SAME A JILLION YEARS AGO! WOW! I LOVE IT... I hope to scoff a complete photo shoot of the first unit and make the shots available via Club newsletter. Guess what else (decadence, here we come...)? Yes, a POWERED SUBWOOFER/CD CHANGER FOR DEFENDER 90 AS AN ACCESSORY! Which means that DEFENDER 110 owners are LIBERATED as well. Should work via existing head unit in 90/110! 1995 DEFENDER 90 to come with a partial soft top standard in lieu of tonneau cover. No more AIRIES BLUE for `95. BELUGA BLACK to be regular production color instead. That's all I know for now. Nothing on 1995 prices. Shouldn't be too bad since DISCO increase was nominal. Stay tuned. ROVER TIMEOUT. Jim Pappas BSROA jpappa01@interserv.com From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Fri Dec 2 13:45:09 1994 Date: Fri, 2 Dec 94 08:48:44 -0800 From: "TeriAnn Wakeman" Reply-To: "TeriAnn Wakeman" To: dushinrg@pr.cyanamid.com, morgan@nature.Berkeley.EDU, Morgan@apple.com, Hannaford@apple.com, lro@team.net Subject: Re: waxoyl vs. LPS Status: RO X-Status: In message <199412020048.TAA04925@transfer.stratus.com> "Russell G. Dushin" writes: > > I then spoke with an information specialist here at work...a library > dude. He said that the composition was probably a trade secret, and > suggested the best he or I would come up with would be to find out > who makes the stuff...and we already know that. He then went on to > tell a story about his grad school advisor that got so hung up on > the composition of a gas additive (that he couldn't find out from > the patent literature) that he had one of his students inject the > stuff into a gc.....they basically watched peak after peak come > off for the rest of the day. I don't think I'll be injecting > any waxoyl into my gc. > > > rd/nigel > > So contact Moss and ask for a MSDS for Waxol. You might get some better hints as to what's inside, if you can use it as a gravy thickner or hair wax. TeriAnn Wakeman Large format photographers look at the world twakeman@apple.com upside down and backwards From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Fri Dec 2 13:46:03 1994 Date: Fri, 2 Dec 94 09:38:36 -0800 From: "TeriAnn Wakeman" Reply-To: "TeriAnn Wakeman" To: DEBROWN@SRP.GOV, lro@team.net, Offroad@ai.gtri.gatech.edu Subject: Re: NEED a CD changer for LR Discovery. Status: RO X-Status: In message <199412021503.KAA10277@transfer.stratus.com> writes: > FROM: David Brown Internet: debrown@srp.gov > Computer Graphics Specialist * Mapping Services & Engr Graphics > PAB219 (602)236-3544 - Pager:6486 External (602)275-2508 #6486 > SUBJECT: NEED a CD changer for LR Discovery. > HELP!!! I am looking for a CD changer to interface with a '94 Land Rover > Discovery. The factory unit ($800) is a Pioneer CDX-M65. I can't find a > stereo dealer that lists one, and the closest in any catalog is a '93 > model CDX-M6 but is not available to any of their sources. I tried a > CDX-M30, but it doesn't communicate with the LR radio "head unit". I'd > rather not get an FM modulated (universal fit) unit, but as a last > resort.... I'll buy a used one if anyone has one!!! > > The plug is rectangular with 2 rows of pins, approximately 18 pins. The > CDX-M30 had the correct plug, but didn't interface. :( Thanks for the discription of the LR head unit. I've been toying with the concept of putting a radio in a Land Rover. The concept requires a major paradigm shift. But as I get older, I tend to like luxuries a little more, and maybe a radio could be nice company. Now that I know what to look for, I just might spring for one to put in my 109. The big question of course is if I should get one with a tape player or just a radio. I'm afraid that the off road dust could jam up a tape player & cause scratches on tapes. I would have to find a place to put it where it wouldn't get soaked when I clean out the interior with a garden hose. You say the factory used a Japanese radio. Well I guess I'm not suprised. I just picked up a pair of unipart U joints for the TR3. The Unipart label said made in Japan. > I know there are some stereo experts out there... Please HELP!!! Stereo... Thats a thought. In a Land Rover yet? What will they think of next? :*) with appologies to David, but I couldn't help myself ;^) (I wave at Discoverys) TeriAnn Wakeman Large format photographers look at the world twakeman@apple.com upside down and backwards From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Fri Dec 2 13:46:10 1994 Date: Fri, 2 Dec 94 10:11:59 PST From: brabyn@skivs.ski.org (John Brabyn) To: LRO-Digest@uk.stratus.com, Land-Rover-Owner@team.net, jpappa01@interserv.com Subject: Re: The Land Rover Owner Daily Digest Status: O X-Status: CD changers are great, but when are they going to give us such a basic amenity as an armrest on the door? John Brabyn From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Fri Dec 2 13:46:23 1994 Date: Fri, 2 Dec 94 10:11:59 PST From: brabyn@skivs.ski.org (John Brabyn) To: LRO-Digest@uk.stratus.com, Land-Rover-Owner@team.net, jpappa01@interserv.com Subject: Re: The Land Rover Owner Daily Digest Status: O X-Status: CD changers are great, but when are they going to give us such a basic amenity as an armrest on the door? John Brabyn From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Fri Dec 2 13:48:00 1994 Date: Fri, 2 Dec 1994 10:24:03 -0800 (PST) From: Morgan Hannaford To: lro@team.net Subject: LPS and underwater Disco Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Status: O X-Status: I don't want to sound like I'm pushing this LPS 3 thing, I just wanted to see if it was similar to this waxoyl stuff. BUT, if you saw photos of the last Transylvania Trophy in LRO or Off-Road 4wheel drive magazines, the ex Camel Discovery that is sunk half-way up the windscreen has a big LPS sponsor/advert. label on the back-side window. If LPS 3 helps reduce corrosion after this kind of activity, I'll buy the 55 gal. drum. Screw it!!!! If any executives from LPS read this, offer me a job, quick, I'm on a roll!!!! Morgan H. ecology grad student at Cal., but willing to work in industry if my company car is a new Land-Rover. please? From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Fri Dec 2 13:48:57 1994 Date: Fri, 02 Dec 94 11:27:11 MST From: DEBROWN@SRP.GOV To: lro@team.net Subject: Thanks TeriAnn... I wave at ALL Land Rovers! Status: O X-Status: FROM: David Brown Internet: debrown@srp.gov Computer Graphics Specialist * Mapping Services & Engr Graphics PAB219 (602)236-3544 - Pager:6486 External (602)275-2508 #6486 SUBJECT: Thanks TeriAnn... I wave at ALL Land Rovers! Thanks TeriAnn! I DO appreciate your humor, as well as your driving a 109. My 15 yr old son has become interested in 4WD vehicles as of late, and before I got my Disco, he wanted a (gulp, get ready,) "Jeep Wrangler". (What can I say... he's just a kid!) Well, as fate would have it, he IS maturing. He can identify a LR from about 1/2 mile away, and is CONSTANTLY pointing out ANY that I happen not to mention as we drive around. He even identifies Hella lights from an AMAZING distance. (I REALLY must get my glasses/eyes checked!) Lately, he is asking a lot of questions about the series trucks, and is starting to want one of those, rather than the "ugh! Jeep"! (There IS a God!!!) I too, would like an old 88 or 109 someday, that I can get rough and totally rowdy with, and just hose it out when done, and keep the Disco for my daily driver, and dates. (I AM single, but don't wish to remain in this condition. ;) ) Only 71 more payments, and the Disco's mine! :{ Oh yeah... I wave at ALL Land Rovers! Sometimes the "Rangie's" don't wave back, and I VERY RARELY see a "series" rover around the Phoenix Arizona area. :( TeriAnn, I'm glad you're there, and didn't leave when you threatened to many months back! Dave Brown - '94 Disco - Phoenix AZ. USA (Single, looking for a "Roverette") #=====# Never doubt that a small group of individuals |___|__\___ can change the world... indeed, it's the only | _ | |_ | thing that ever has. "(_)""""(_)" -Margaret Mead From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Fri Dec 2 13:49:30 1994 X-Authentication-Warning: tornadic.sw.stratus.com: Host localhost.stratus.com didn't use HELO protocol To: lro@team.net Cc: Chrisste@cerf.net (Chris Stevens) Subject: Re: Rover Pix Are Great In-Reply-To: Your message of "Thu, 01 Dec 94 14:45:09 EST." <199412011942.LAA09031@nic.cerf.net> Date: Fri, 02 Dec 94 13:37:51 -0500 From: William Caloccia Status: O X-Status: Ok, you folks in the US, if you're somewhere between Albany, NY and Baltimore, MD, and see a blue+limestone S.IIa 88" with temporary tags, give a big wave (or a hand :-) to Chris Stevens, as he is headed south with what used to be mine. [And hopefully for both him and I, there won't be any stories about it, unless he tries to get home by going off-road :-) ] Chris, I reckon this could go on your .sig now :-) R 1 3 2 H "Land Rover's first, becuase +--|--| | | Land Rovers last." 2 4 4 L '69 S.IIa 88" Cheers, --bill caloccia@Team.Net caloccia@Stratus.Com 1 3 dl OD L "Land Rover's first, becuase |--|--+ o | | Land Rovers last." 2 4 R N H '72 Range Rover ++ ('69 S.IIa 88")-- PS There is still a rather well, used, XR4Ti back in upstate NY that I'd like to sell, though I don't reckon anyone on this list would be keen on it. From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Fri Dec 2 13:49:40 1994 Date: Fri, 2 Dec 1994 13:47:01 -0500 (EST) From: Jon Humphrey To: lro@team.net, Morgan Hannaford Subject: Re: LPS and underwater Disco In-Reply-To: Status: O X-Status: Morgan sez; > >Screw it!!!! If any executives from LPS read this, offer me a job, quick, >I'm on a roll!!!! > >Morgan H. >ecology grad student at Cal., but willing >to work in industry if my company car >is a new Land-Rover. please? Morgan, are you sure you want to live and reside in beautiful Tucker, Georgia? Just a thought Jon From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Fri Dec 2 13:50:04 1994 From: dkenner@emr.ca (Dixon Kenner) Subject: Re: To: brabyn@skivs.ski.org (John Brabyn) Date: Fri, 2 Dec 1994 14:03:53 -0500 (EST) Cc: lro@stratus.com In-Reply-To: <9412021811.AA16704@skivs.ski.org> from "John Brabyn" at Dec 2, 94 10:11:59 am Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 641 Status: O X-Status: > CD changers are great, but when are they going to give us such a basic > amenity as an armrest on the door? ??? The '64 109 of mine has armrests on the door. I just worry that adding the CD changer will cause strange problems. Having a positive earth vehicle where everything is reversed, the one and zero's on the CD platter are going to get played back the opposite way. I get the suspicion that the end result won't be much different than when I convinced Dale that the Microsoft NT/SQL CD sounded real cool and had him put it in his CD player to play as romantic music when his new girlfriend was over. Rgds, Dixon From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Fri Dec 2 13:50:25 1994 From: "Rostykus, John" To: LRO List Subject: RE: Range Rover owner goes retro Date: Fri, 02 Dec 94 11:30:00 PST Encoding: 17 TEXT Status: O X-Status: Sorry about the noise folks, but my mailer eats return addresses. (I really appreciate the folks who list their names and e-mail addresses in their posts!) To the new LR owner in Seattle, who writes: >... Any words of encouragment or warning about what I should be >watching out for now? Any Seattle-area folks willing to provide >hands-on advice to a novice owner? I live in the Seattle area, and would like to get in touch with you. There are quite a number of LR's in the area, and an active local club. In fact, the annual snow run/holiday party is tomorrow (Sat. Dec. 3rd.). This is a great chance to meet people. John Rostykus john@data-io.com From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Fri Dec 2 14:24:01 1994 From: "Russell G. Dushin" Subject: Re: MSDS, Healy catalogs To: twakeman@apple.com ("TeriAnn Wakeman" ) Date: Fri, 2 Dec 94 14:56:20 EST Cc: lro@team.net In-Reply-To: <9412021648.AA24003@apple.com>; from "TeriAnn Wakeman" at Dec 2, 94 8:48 am Mailer: Elm [revision: 66.36.1.1] Status: O X-Status: > So contact Moss and ask for a MSDS for Waxol. You might get some better hints > as to what's inside, if you can use it as a gravy thickner or hair wax. > > > TeriAnn Wakeman Large format photographers look at the world > twakeman@apple.com upside down and backwards Great idea, but it didn't work...they ain't got the MSDS (material safety data sheet....the one that *would* have told me not to taste it), and the MSDSes that I can search on line from here at work don't list waxoyl either (but it is a limited subset of MSDSes). As per the austin healey catalog....I asked them about it and they said there were two (one for the sprite, one for the "big" healeys). Which models share the common electrical components with rovers?? thanks, rd From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Fri Dec 2 14:26:20 1994 Date: Fri, 02 Dec 1994 13:42:34 EST From: CXKS46A@prodigy.com (MR ALEXANDER P GRICE) To: land-rover-owner@team.net Subject: Pass the Donners, please... Status: O X-Status: Bill Maloney asks about making passes...particualrly the Donner. Donner Pass (the Sierra Nevada summit in California for our overseas members) is basically a straight shot on Interstate 80. It's the weather that makes the run interesting. (For non-American readers, the pass was named for the Donner party, a group of California-bound settlers that got trapped here in October of 1850[?], the snowiest winter of the century. Forced into cannibalism to survive, most of the men died but the women survived.) On each of my three times through, in blizzards each time and once just before it closed (we got two feet of "Sierra cement" that night), the Rover was waved through the chain-law check point without even having to slow down. Smugglers' Notch in Vermont is *very* tight and twisty at the top where one lane slaloms through house-sized boulders. I've skied it, but it is physically blocked (chained) to keep fools off it in winter. The Stowe side is the steep one. Hazen's Notch further north in Vermont was a challenge. Not blocked off, we made it to the summit from the north side before turning around as daylight was fading and the temperature was already below zero. For thrills, try Teton Pass in winter, where avalanches add an extra measure of excitement...or how about the "seven sisters" of Loveland Pass? Nothing like standing on your roof racks and *still* not being able to see over the roadside snowbanks. You have excellent traction in dry, untracked snow: I've plowed (downhill, mind you) through 50 yards of bonnet-deep powder drifts far from the highway and once, with urging from the back seat passengers (*always* a dangerous situation), blasted through a roof-high solitary drift (kinda like a tiny Sarahan sief dune) that formed in an otherwise cleared parking lot at the Jay Peak ski area in Vermont. Looking at the hole afterwards "...say, there coulda been a VW in there...." However, in *wet* snow, no can move when it's deeper that the diffs...and when you get stuck with chains on all four wheels, you are *stuck*. *----"Jeep may be famous, LAND-ROVER is Legendary"-----* | | | Sandy Grice, Rover Owners' Association of Virginia | | E-Mail: CXKS46A@prodigy.com FAX: 804-622-7056 | | Voice: 804-622-7054 (Days) 804-423-4898 (Evenings) | | 1633 Melrose Pkwy., Norfolk, VA, 23508-1730 USA | *------------------------------------------------------* From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Fri Dec 2 14:26:27 1994 Date: Fri, 2 Dec 94 12:10:54 -0800 From: "TeriAnn Wakeman" Reply-To: "TeriAnn Wakeman" To: brabyn@skivs.ski.org, LRO-Digest@uk.stratus.com, Land-Rover-Owner@team.net, jpappa01@interserv.com Subject: Re: The Land Rover Owner Daily Digest Status: O X-Status: In message <9412021811.AA16704@skivs.ski.org> John Brabyn writes: > CD changers are great, but when are they going to give us such a basic > amenity as an armrest on the door? > > John Brabyn ?????????????????????????? My Land Rover came with arm rests in the door. I thought they all did TeriAnn Wakeman Large format photographers look at the world twakeman@apple.com upside down and backwards From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Fri Dec 2 14:26:32 1994 Date: Fri, 2 Dec 94 12:10:54 -0800 From: "TeriAnn Wakeman" Reply-To: "TeriAnn Wakeman" To: brabyn@skivs.ski.org, LRO-Digest@uk.stratus.com, Land-Rover-Owner@team.net, jpappa01@interserv.com Subject: Re: The Land Rover Owner Daily Digest Status: O X-Status: In message <9412021811.AA16704@skivs.ski.org> John Brabyn writes: > CD changers are great, but when are they going to give us such a basic > amenity as an armrest on the door? > > John Brabyn ?????????????????????????? My Land Rover came with arm rests in the door. I thought they all did TeriAnn Wakeman Large format photographers look at the world twakeman@apple.com upside down and backwards From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Fri Dec 2 14:26:46 1994 Date: Fri, 2 Dec 1994 15:17:57 -0500 (EST) From: Harry Greenspun To: DEBROWN@srp.gov Cc: lro@team.net, Offroad@ai.gtri.gatech.edu Subject: Re: NEED a CD changer for LR Discovery. In-Reply-To: <199412021503.KAA10277@transfer.stratus.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Content-Length: 402 Status: O X-Status: On Fri, 2 Dec 1994 DEBROWN@SRP.GOV wrote: > SUBJECT: NEED a CD changer for LR Discovery. > HELP!!! I am looking for a CD changer to interface with a '94 Land Rover > Discovery. Rovers North, Atlantic-British, etc., are all selling the changer for between $500-$600. Installation involves opening the box, placing it under the seat, tightening the screws, then plugging in the harness. Harry From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Fri Dec 2 15:48:33 1994 Date: Fri, 2 Dec 1994 12:31:05 -0800 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: Roger Sinasohn From: mcdpw@pacific.pacific.net (Granville Pool) Subject: RE: Ascii Rovers Cc: lro@team.net Status: O X-Status: Uncle Roger thought he'd do something useful with my time, so I came up with a Land-Rover sketch comprised of keyboard characters; I have revised as follows: .---------------------------------. / ___________________ \ ,|________/ _______________ \________|, | .---. | / \ | .---. | | | | | | |'%,| | | | | | | | | | | | | ,---, | | | | | | | | | | ,---, `---'\| `---' | `-----------------' | `---' |/'---' ,'=======| ___ |=======`, |(o) | /__,| '%, (o)| |(o) | `---' _____ | (o)| |.------.| | O | | || ||INDY 1|| | O O | | (GB) || |`------'| `-----' '%, || ||_______|_____________________|_______|| \ ( ) | _ | / \~~~~'----------,|'-'|----,------'~~~~/ |\\~//|_~~~~~~~~~'~~~.___/~~~~~_|\\~//| |\\~//| |\\~//| |\\~//| |\\~//| |_\_/_| |_\_/_| And, I gotta say, I admire and applaud your work! Improving or enhancing it was a lot harder than it looked! I have tried stuff like this before and given up. Nice, work, really. And certainly a valuable use of your time. Do you really have three door hinges? Mrs. Gord'n Perrott, dba Stephanie Cushing, had that set-up and used the two bottom ones with a normal old-style Land-Rover tailgate for a side hinged setup, using only one of the normal old-style tailgate catches on the left side. Really slick, simple, and out of the used parts bin. Do you take your top off and use a tailgate similarly? >P.S. I have been snagging rovers from .sig's, so if anyone's interested, I >could compile them and post them. I'm afraid I've not kept track of the >artists, though. Yeah, Rog, I would like some. Before you send stuff, though, let's discuss. Don't want you to send stuff I won't use. Nice of you to offer, though. Also thanks for your helping Jason with the tires. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ [ Granville Pool (Redwood Valley, CA) Appraiser, R/W Agent, LR aficionado ] [ e-mail: mcdpw@pacific.pacific.net ** Ph:(707)485-7220 H,(707)463-4265 W ] From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Fri Dec 2 15:49:09 1994 Date: Fri, 2 Dec 1994 12:30:41 -0800 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: Mike Dryfoos From: mcdpw@pacific.pacific.net (Granville Pool) Subject: RE: Range Rover owner goes retro Cc: lro@team.net Status: O X-Status: Mike, you wrote (in part): >I don't have a lot of experience with automotive mechanics, so this is >going to be a big learning experience for me. I figured with the old >Rover's reputation as an easy-to-work-on vehicle, this would be a good >place to start. I'm sure I'll have lots of questions for the old hands >among you. Any words of encouragment or warning about what I should be >watching out for now? Any Seattle-area folks willing to provide >hands-on advice to a novice owner? Congratulations on your purchase! Sounds like a good one. A couple of folks in the Seattle area you should connect with, especially Gord'n Perrott. He really knows his Land-Rovers and is a hell of a fellow. I don't have his phone number handy (surely listed); his address is 10537 Interlake Ave. N., Seattle 98133. Another is Benjamin Freeman who is on this list(or was--haven't heard from him in a while), his email address is . Benjamin can also tell you how to reach Gord'n. Gord'n can also tell you about getting into the really great Land-Rover club they have in that part of the country. If you have problems contacting these fellows, let me know. I advise you to avoid Charles Kellogg Northwest Land-Rover Company or some such dba. Other Land-Rover owners in the area will be glad to tell you about their horrifying experiences with Kellogg the corn flake. On the other hand, I have heard only good things about Doug Shipman in Portland, OR. Another Net-Rover commented on the problems with the Dual-Matic hubs and I would second that. I have previously posted a description of my grief with Dual- Matics so won't repeat it here as I am copying this to the list. But email me directly if you want a repeat of the details. Have fun! ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ [ Granville Pool (Redwood Valley, CA) Appraiser, R/W Agent, LR aficionado ] [ e-mail: mcdpw@pacific.pacific.net ** Ph:(707)485-7220 H,(707)463-4265 W ] From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Fri Dec 2 15:49:23 1994 Date: Fri, 2 Dec 94 13:22:02 PST From: brabyn@skivs.ski.org (John Brabyn) To: LRO-Digest@uk.stratus.com, Land-Rover-Owner@team.net, brabyn@skivs.ski.org, jpappa01@interserv.com, twakeman@apple.com Subject: Re: The Land Rover Owner Daily Digest Status: O X-Status: My somewhat facetious remark about armrests was based on looking at the new Defender 90's which don't appear to have them! John Brabyn From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Fri Dec 2 15:49:32 1994 From: dkenner@emr.ca (Dixon Kenner) Subject: Re: Ascii Rovers To: mcdpw@pacific.pacific.net (Granville Pool) Date: Fri, 2 Dec 1994 16:42:02 -0500 (EST) Cc: lro@stratus.com In-Reply-To: <199412022031.MAA28437@pacific.pacific.net> from "Granville Pool" at Dec 2, 94 12:31:05 pm Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 319 Status: O X-Status: > And, I gotta say, I admire and applaud your work! Improving or enhancing it Well, it looks to be a hybrid of some sort. While it has late IIA/III mirrors, it has the earlier taillamps. There is also an extra door hinge which shouldn't be there if it is to be original. An excellent attempt... :-) Rgds, From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Fri Dec 2 17:08:50 1994 From: dkenner@emr.ca (Dixon Kenner) Subject: Re: MSDS, Healy catalogs To: dushinrg@pr.cyanamid.com (Russell G. Dushin) Date: Fri, 2 Dec 1994 16:45:20 -0500 (EST) Cc: lro@stratus.com In-Reply-To: <199412021955.OAA00610@transfer.stratus.com> from "Russell G. Dushin" at Dec 2, 94 02:56:20 pm Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 282 Status: O X-Status: > As per the austin healey catalog....I asked them about it and they > said there were two (one for the sprite, one for the "big" healeys). > Which models share the common electrical components with rovers?? Healy 3000 used the same taillight assemblies as the early NA stuff. From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Fri Dec 2 17:08:55 1994 Date: Fri, 2 Dec 94 13:22:02 PST From: brabyn@skivs.ski.org (John Brabyn) To: LRO-Digest@uk.stratus.com, Land-Rover-Owner@team.net, brabyn@skivs.ski.org, jpappa01@interserv.com, twakeman@apple.com Subject: Re: The Land Rover Owner Daily Digest Status: O X-Status: My somewhat facetious remark about armrests was based on looking at the new Defender 90's which don't appear to have them! John Brabyn From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Mon Dec 5 09:49:19 1994 Date: Fri, 2 Dec 1994 16:21:57 -0800 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: lro@team.net From: mcdpw@pacific.pacific.net (Granville Pool) Subject: Electric Land-Rovers Status: O X-Status: Fellow Net-Rovers: Yesterday, I recieved a nice color postcard in the mail. What was the picture? It was a beautiful properdarkgreen 1971 Land-Rover 88, topless, and engineless. But not motorless. This gorgeous creation of Wilde EVolutions, P.O. Box 938, Jerome, AZ 86331 Phone 1-800-FAST-EVs, is an electric-powered Land-Rover which retains the stock transmission and transfer case and, of course, four-wheel drive. Wilde Evolutions also sent me a copy of an article, just published, from the Winter 1994 issue of _Electric_Car_ magazine. It may still be on the newsstands, although I have looked and couldn't find it in my hodunk town (no great surpize, that). In the article is a photo of the Land-Rover off-roading in Arizona (in Coconino National Forest), as well as a shot of an electified Mazda RX-7, doing a wheelie. Really. How did I hear about Wilde EVolutions? It's a funny thing. They appeared here (in Ukiah, CA) at a solar/alternative energy fair and I had intended to attend but didn't (events intervened, including some Land-Rover stuff). My neighbor was actually involved in the fair but didn't mention the Land-Rover to me. I saw an ad in the Santa Rosa paper for a BMW engine I needed (don't we all, nowadays?) and called about it. In conversation with the guy who was selling the engine, Land-Rovers somehow came up (funny) and he told me about the electric one at the fair and he remembered their phone number (because it's so catchy). Go figure. I hope to hear more from these folks and get them on the list (they are on the Internet but I don't yet have their email address). More later... ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ [ Granville Pool (Redwood Valley, CA) Appraiser, R/W Agent, LR aficionado ] [ e-mail: mcdpw@pacific.pacific.net ** Ph:(707)485-7220 H,(707)463-4265 W ] From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Mon Dec 5 09:50:35 1994 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 1 Dec 1994 17:19:28 -0800 To: mcdpw@pacific.pacific.net (Granville Pool) From: jory@MIT.EDU (jory bell) Subject: Re: Electric Land-Rovers Cc: lro@team.net Status: O X-Status: Granville, >Wilde Evolutions also sent me a copy of an article, just published, from the >Winter 1994 issue of _Electric_Car_ magazine. It may still be on the >newsstands, although I have looked and couldn't find it in my hodunk town >(no great surpize, that). In the article is a photo of the Land-Rover >off-roading in Arizona (in Coconino National Forest), as well as a shot of >an electified Mazda RX-7, doing a wheelie. Really. I read the article.. and have access to the magazine (friend's copy). That magazine is difficult to find even in major cities (recent point of discussion on the EV mailing list). >How did I hear about Wilde EVolutions? It's a funny thing. They appeared >here (in Ukiah, CA) at a solar/alternative energy fair and I had intended to >attend but didn't (events intervened, including some Land-Rover stuff). My >neighbor was actually involved in the fair but didn't mention the Land-Rover >to me. I saw an ad in the Santa Rosa paper for a BMW engine I needed (don't >we all, nowadays?) and called about it. In conversation with the guy who >was selling the engine, Land-Rovers somehow came up (funny) and he told me >about the electric one at the fair and he remembered their phone number >(because it's so catchy). Go figure. The RX-7 is using a 1000 amp DC-brushful motor controllerdesigned/built by a guy I just worked for building its successor (I did the firmware). The RX7 controller was recently destroyed in an operator-error situation, and is sitting in Palo Alto waiting to be rebuilt (if it's the one I think it is, I fabricated some parts for it the other night :). There is also a picture of that electric same rover (at least I think it's the same) in Home Power magazine last month. In Palo Alto, there is a ground-up electric racing vehicle utilizing 2 of the 1000 amp controllers. The car (SnoWhite) races autocross and goes well over 100mph (I'd guess it can hit 130-150 and the 0-60 acceleration is outrageous.. something like 3 seconds?!?!). I hope to drive this car soon. I think I put ("Uncle") Roger in touch with the owner of the EV rover (he is also a friend of the guy I was just doing EV work for). Roger has his contract info, etc... >I hope to hear more from these folks and get them on the list (they are on >the Internet but I don't yet have their email address). More later... Sounds good. I just my info from Foers today (I'd sent him a letter). As anticipated, I like his stuff, and would be interested in collaborating with you on a (legal) importation scheme (although I wonder what changes are going to be made to the "new" IBEX). I would still love to see the article you mentioned as well (I just got a brief letter and the offical rundown of the "old" IBEX... with a promise of details on the new when available). Althoug I am most interested in the 100" wheelbase model, the takeoff/departure angles on the 90 were ridiculously appealing! later, -jory From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Mon Dec 5 09:50:59 1994 Date: Fri, 2 Dec 1994 19:06:22 -0800 From: Roger Sinasohn To: lro@team.net Subject: Re: Imposing Winch & Starter Problems Status: O X-Status: > >I received the Rovers North Newsletter today, and noticed a familiar name >from this list had the "most imposing winch". (Dixon Kenner) Very nice! > >Now, in my rover, I seem to have a problem with my starter coming loose >all the time, and jamming into my flywheel resulting in me having to >remove the starter and put it back on every few days to correct the >problem. This is slightly inconvienient, and getting tiresome. >Actually, this is more than slightly inconvenient, it is very very very >annoying. Why am I plagued with this problem?? > > >Hal A. Lightwood 1972 SERIII 88" Maybe because you were a bad boy? (Remember the time you told your folks you got a flat tire on the way home from the computer club meeting, but in reality you were out *drinking* and playing Robotron? oh wait. That was me. Never mind.) --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad sinasohn@crl.com that none but madmen know." Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates San Francisco, California From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Mon Dec 5 09:51:12 1994 Date: Fri, 2 Dec 1994 19:06:44 -0800 From: Roger Sinasohn To: lro@team.net Subject: Re: Range Rover owner goes retro Status: O X-Status: >I don't have a lot of experience with automotive mechanics, so this is >going to be a big learning experience for me. I figured with the old >Rover's reputation as an easy-to-work-on vehicle, this would be a good >place to start. I'm sure I'll have lots of questions for the old hands >among you. Any words of encouragment or warning about what I should be >watching out for now? Any Seattle-area folks willing to provide >hands-on advice to a novice owner? Well, if I can work on it, anyone can. (well, with the possible exception of my mother.) Anyway, things are simple, and if you've done any working on your car, you can handle it. Good luck, and congratulations! --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad sinasohn@crl.com that none but madmen know." Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates San Francisco, California From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Mon Dec 5 09:51:18 1994 Date: Fri, 2 Dec 1994 19:06:50 -0800 From: Roger Sinasohn To: sinasohn@crl.com, lro@stratus.com Subject: Re: Rita, Rita, (Kilo)Metre Maid Cc: sinasohn@netcom.com, sos@mercury.sfsu.edu, babs@uclink2.berkeley.edu Status: O X-Status: >My sister Rita is supposed to be on her way home from college in Rhode >Island (by way of Maine -- it's a horse thing), but we haven't heard from >her for a couple of days... No big deal, but my lunatic mother loves to >panic, so I thought I'd put a note on the net. Well, it turns out she's goofing off with a friend somewhere in New York. Sorry for the trouble! --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad sinasohn@crl.com that none but madmen know." Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates San Francisco, California From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Mon Dec 5 09:51:30 1994 From: LANDROVER@delphi.com Date: Fri, 02 Dec 1994 23:10:28 -0500 (EST) Subject: Re: Rita, Rita, (Kilo)Metre Maid To: sinasohn@crl.com, lro@team.net X-Vms-To: INTERNET"sinasohn@crl.com" X-Vms-Cc: INTERNET"lro@team.net" Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Status: O X-Status: So Roger... this east-west mixed up thing runs in the family, eh? Roger sez... > A favor to ask... If anyone see's a college girl in a white subaru wagon > with straps holding down the bonnet and a ton of stuff, (hopefully) headed > east on hwy 80 from Maine to California, Could you sorta make sure she's > pointed in the right direction? If she's heading EAST on 80 we'll be sure to get her turned around!! Cheers ;-) Michael Loiodice E-MAIL landrover@delphi.com 166 W.Fulton St. VOICE (518) 773-2697 Gloversville NY, 12078 1972 Ser III 88 Petrol (Fern) 7 1971 Ser IIa 88 Petrol #:-}> 1965 Ser IIa 88 Petrol From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Mon Dec 5 09:51:54 1994 From: LANDROVER@delphi.com Date: Fri, 02 Dec 1994 23:10:57 -0500 (EST) Subject: Re: REDLINE FOR A 2/14 PETROL IN A 1971 To: wz@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca, lro@team.net X-Vms-To: INTERNET"wz@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca" X-Vms-Cc: INTERNET"lro@team.net" Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Status: O X-Status: Wade worries about over-revving and asks... > does any one know what the red line setting should be at on a 2 1/4 > petrol engine in a 1971 IIa 88", if it matters I have 30x9.50x15" tires > with no overdrive (but I wish I did) I took a look in the old crusty Haynes manual.. didn't see anything like "maximum" but it does say "BHP at 4,250 rpm" and "Piston speed at 4,280 rpm". That sounds pretty fast to me for an engine with connecting rod clearances you measure with your fingers... :) Any faster and the pistons will be screaming "let us out! let us out!". You got a tach?? What's it sound like at 4250??? Cheers Michael Loiodice E-MAIL landrover@delphi.com 166 W.Fulton St. VOICE (518) 773-2697 Gloversville NY, 12078 1972 Ser III 88 Petrol (Fern) 7 1971 Ser IIa 88 Petrol #:-}> 1965 Ser IIa 88 Petrol From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Mon Dec 5 09:52:22 1994 Date: Sat, 03 Dec 1994 07:39:13 -0600 (CST) From: "Michael H. Ramage" Subject: 109 Sw To: lro@stratus.com X-Envelope-To: lro@stratus.com X-Vms-To: LANDROVER Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Status: O X-Status: I have a 109 station wagon for sale, 1967 with chevy six. The frame is solid but rusty, lots of neww mechanicals etc. E-mail me directly with an offer (all offers considered) or request for more info Ramagem@carleton.edu Michael Ramage (THe truck is in New York State, by the way) From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Mon Dec 5 09:52:44 1994 Date: Sat, 3 Dec 1994 14:54:07 GMT From: venters@atm.ox.ac.uk (Peter Venters - Tel. [+44] (0)1865 272920) To: lro@atm.ox.ac.uk Subject: Series One upper tailgates Status: O X-Status: On Thu, 1 Dec 1994 20:04:56 jpappa01@interserv.com wrote, re: DEFENDER 90 UPDATES: ... And in equally exciting news... the (gasp!) ALUMINUM HARDTOP DEFENDER 90 is now in the port and being shipped to dealers... PRICE? N/A. BODY COLOR SIDES, ALPINE WHITE TOP SECTION. GET THIS -- SERIES ONE (ONE!!) UPPER TAILGATE LID!! YES! LR HAD TO DIG UP THE TOOLING FROM SOME PRIVATE CITIZEN IN UK WHO PURCHASED SAME A JILLION YEARS AGO! WOW! I LOVE IT... ... Does anybody know about production of Series One upper tailgates - are they really making them again - and if so are they available in the UK for anything less than the price of a night at the Ritz? Peter PS My Series One doesn't have any armrests. From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Mon Dec 5 09:52:56 1994 Date: Sat, 3 Dec 1994 08:40:19 -0800 (PST) From: Paul Sinasohn Subject: Re: Rita, Rita, (Kilo)Metre Maid -FOUND!!!! To: Roger Sinasohn Cc: lro@stratus.com, sos@mercury.sfsu.edu, babs@uclink2.berkeley.edu In-Reply-To: <199412020700.AA22206@crl10.crl.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Status: O X-Status: She's been located, staying with her friend Amy in New York. She forgot to call us, she was having too much fun. She will be continually reminded that her family and friends were worried, until she agrees not to forget again. This may take several years. Thank you all for your concern and assistance. ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- Paul Sinasohn sinasohn@netcom.com CAL '80 Bass and Business Mgr - Richter Scale, the No-Fault Acappella group Motto: There's a fine line between a groove and a rut!! Where are YOU?! On Thu, 1 Dec 1994, Roger Sinasohn wrote: > A favor to ask... If anyone see's a college girl in a white subaru wagon > with straps holding down the bonnet and a ton of stuff, (hopefully) headed > east on hwy 80 from Maine to California, Could you sorta make sure she's > pointed in the right direction? > > My sister Rita is supposed to be on her way home from college in Rhode Island > (by way of Maine -- it's a horse thing), but we haven't heard from her for a > couple of days... No big deal, but my lunatic mother loves to panic, so I > thought I'd put a note on the net. > > BTW, she'll definitely wave back. > > Thanks in advance! > > --------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad > sinasohn@crl.com that none but madmen know." > Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates > San Francisco, California > > From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Mon Dec 5 09:53:26 1994 Date: Sat, 3 Dec 1994 09:48:54 -0800 (PST) From: James B Russell Subject: LPS To: Land-Rover-Owner@Team.net In-Reply-To: <199412030755.HAA29253@chunnel.uk.stratus.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Status: O X-Status: I have used LPS-3 for years and like it. I know a lot of seaplane owners use it -- particularly those who splash down in salt water from time to time such as in Puget Sound. Don't know how it compairs with Waxoyl though. One thing, be sure to get the LPS-3. They also make LPS-1, a very light weight stuff, LPS-2, kind of like WD40, and then LPS-3. I also like their Instant Cold Galvanize, basically a zinc rich primer, but be sure to shake it very, very well and then shake it some more since it can clog up quite easily. And not just the nozzle, the tube inside the can gets blocked and you end up with a nearly full can of stuff you cant get out. Jim Russell ==== jrussell@netcom.com (Seattle -- San Francisco) From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Mon Dec 5 09:54:58 1994 From: mtalbot@interserv.com Date: Sat, 3 Dec 1994 13:10:09 -0800 To: Land-Rover-Owner@team.net Subject: Re: Hybrids Status: O X-Status: All, A few days ago someone posted a message about Hybrids. Just wanted to share what I'm doing to one of my 88's I basically want a Defender 90, but as usual, can't seem to convince the wife that $30K + for one is a good idea. So, I bought another 88, 73 SIII. Good body frame really shot, no not the Vinalhaven rover, another one from Maine. My plans are as follows : Arrow Service in the UK are building a SIII coil sprung chassis with used 90 axles, Range Rover diffs, Range Rover 5 speed gearbox mated to a RR V8 (Carb). >From this I will mount a SIII bulkhead (currently under repair by me). Arrow are going to supply D90 doors, D90 front end, grille, bonnet. From there they are going to ship to me. Total cost, $5,500. Once here I will mount the bulkhead, and start building up from the parts I have from my SIII. Those that want to look for D90 chassis here can forget it, they don't exist. I did read that the east coast rover co were advertising coil sprung chassis for $6,000 !!! Total cost for me to get this chassis with engine and box, and fit parts from my SIII. Approx $6,500. I think that is a great bargin and certainly is cheaper then a new D90 !!! Hey, I could get four of them at those prices. Mark From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Mon Dec 5 09:55:50 1994 Date: Sat, 3 Dec 1994 18:47:39 -0600 (CST) From: David John Place To: LANDROVER@delphi.com Cc: morgan@nature.Berkeley.EDU, lro@team.net Subject: Re: Waxoyl equivalents? In-Reply-To: <01HK2CX5KBZQ91WMCV@delphi.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Status: RO X-Status: I have been using LPS for many years now. It has a very interesting ability to climb up inside the doors of old vehicles. You spray it into the doors like rustproofing and a few days later it will appear up near the top. I like it because it is only about $25.00 per gallon in Canada, and it replaces WD40 in my shop at a much lower cost. I buy it from machine shop supply houses up here in Manitoba. It comes in a Blue plastic jug. The jug says general purpose lub, penetrating, water replacing. It protects up to 1 year. It is made by Holt Lloyd Corp of Tucker Georgia 30084. It was worth reading the label. In 15 years, I never noticed you were to shake well before applying. I guess the bottom half of the product I have out there is going to do a real great job! For the most part it is WD40 and is used exactly the same way. If you figure out the cost of the spray tins vs the gallon of LPS, you will always buy LPS as I do and use a hairspray bottle to apply it to nusts and bolts etc. I hope this helps. Dave VE4PN From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Mon Dec 5 09:56:21 1994 Date: Sat, 3 Dec 1994 18:22:43 -0600 (CST) From: David John Place To: Andrew Steele Cc: lro@stratus.com Subject: Re: Series II or III frame dimension for snow plow In-Reply-To: <9411290053.AA12586@dayton.wright.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Status: RO X-Status: I have had 3 snow plows on my 88 type LRs and I found that if you didn't use the undercarriage part, the plow was too close to the vehicle and you couldn't articulate it left and right. If you use a simple A shaped part from the undercarriage to the plow I found you could attach it to the springs themselves with a 1/2 inch thick steel block with two short extensions into which you put a large agricultural "D" ring pin. This made a nice quick disconnect arrangement. I have used hydraulic lifting and angle slaves on mine, but the last one worked well using the winch with a short "A" frame over the bumper to give a bit o height for the lift. I just looked in the Haynes manual page 164. It lists the distance from the outside of the frame to the opposite outside as 787 mm or 31.0 inches. I hope that is of some use to you. Dave VE4PN From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Mon Dec 5 09:57:24 1994 Date: Sat, 3 Dec 1994 20:11:11 -0600 (CST) From: David John Place To: "Stefan R. Jacob" <100043.2400@compuserve.com> Cc: lro Subject: Re: 2nd Gear pops out In-Reply-To: <941130124608_100043.2400_EHK26-2@CompuServe.COM> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Status: O X-Status: I have had the same problem with my 2nd gear and I solved it for the most part by making the detent spring which presses against the detent ball longer. These balls are the ones which are on the top, the left and the right of the gearbox case and have an "L" shaped piece of black metal over them with a rubber washer between the spring and the metal. They just push a ball bearing into a detent mark on the shift shafts that you move when you shift gears. If the spring gets weak, the shafts move without resistance and the shifter pops out of gear. If you look at page 86 of the Haynes manual and picture 10.8a you will see the detent ball and spring. Figure 10.8b and 10.9 show the other two balls. Make sure you set the second gear stop bolt shown in 10.11 as well or your will not be fully engaged in gear and it can pop out of gear when you remove the load. I only have problems now when I shift. The gearshif sort of pops back into my hand when I shift from 1st to second but it never comes out of gear when I decelerate as it used to. Remember you can make the spring so tight you have to pull the shifter out of gear so this should solve your problem for no outlay of $. Hope this helps. Dave VE4PN From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Mon Dec 5 09:59:21 1994 Date: Sat, 3 Dec 1994 20:26:33 -0600 (CST) From: David John Place To: "Stefan R. Jacob" <100043.2400@compuserve.com> Cc: lro Subject: Re: equipment / chains In-Reply-To: <941130124516_100043.2400_EHK26-1@CompuServe.COM> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Status: O X-Status: The best set of chains I ever used were a type that had triangle shaped pieces of metal that were placed permanently inside the bead of the tire just before inflation. the chains themselves had an attachment which allowed you to put the chains across the face of the tire from bead to bead when needed and then removed when the surface improved. The metal hook for want of a better term didn't seem to change the tire on the highway etc. I don't know if you can still get them. I let most of them go with my last Rover and now I use the full wheel type. By the way, I saw a neat trick for putting the chains on which I will try this winter. You get a piece of cloths hanger wire and bend it so you have a "U" shaped piece of wire with a sharp point which can grab both sides of the tread. You attach the chains to this hook and lay them out in front of the wheel you which to put the chain on. You drive forward, and the hook pulls the chain around the tire as you drive. when you have completed one revolution of the wheel the chains are all the way around and ready to be clipped together. You then put "bungee" cords across the chains to keep them tight on the tire and the job is done. We haven't had enough snow yet to try it but I will let you know if they work as well for me as the fellow I saw using them. One other neat trick I saw being used by some commercial fishermen on Lake Winnipeg was to mount disker blades just in front of the front wheels attached to the bumpers of the Land Rover. The hung down to about mid tire height and were offset to the outside. When the fellows drove out on the lake to lift their nets, the disc would throw the snow out of the way and they didn't need chains or other help to go in very deep snow. Normally the snow is so bad that Bombardiers, a tracked vehicle with front skies is used. The fellow I knew, actually a woman, used an 88 Land Rover with a truck cap for this work and it never failed. You might try this with removable wheel discs and see what it will do for you. Dave VE4PN From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Mon Dec 5 10:00:27 1994 Date: Sat, 3 Dec 1994 21:30:32 -0600 (CST) From: David John Place To: Jason LaBranch Cc: lro@team.net Subject: Re: A few thoughts on Winches In-Reply-To: <9412012008.AA12308@yeola.sybgate.sybase.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Status: O X-Status: That part about the boy being killed by the winch cable makes me want to remind people that if nothing else put your jacket on the cable so that if it breaks it acts like a break in the wind and will slow down the cable. I now use an extension cable on my electric winch and I sit inside when I have a real winch job to do. I also use stainless cable only. I know it costs, but it doesn't rust out and get brittle like steel cable out in the elements does. For the fellow trying to decide on a winch, I have all kinds and I still prefer the PTO type because you can shift the gearbox and change speeds. It also is a true reverse system with variable speeds. I used one to put up ham radio towers, and it was great. The old style Warn was quite good and now I am using a military aircraft starting motor with relays to give in and out. It is cheap and has great pulling power. I think I will send a picture of my 88 to Al Workhorse and people can see the type it is. I had a good look at the new Defender on Friday and I noticed it has an American type receiver socket on the rear. Why dont you put the same type of socket on the front under the bumper and use one winch to pull from rear or front? I find I most often want to get back to hard ground not pull myself further into trouble and a rear winch is better for this. A "Jackall" the name we use in Canada for the high jack fited with a square receiver which will fit into that hole will make jacking a lot safer. The vehicle won't wobble on the jack with it in the square hole. Dave VE4PN From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Mon Dec 5 10:01:10 1994 From: "T.F. Mills" Subject: LR current cite (5 in 1) To: lro@team.net Date: Sun, 4 Dec 1994 01:32:01 -0700 (MST) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 831 Status: O X-Status: OPEN ROAD, Road & Track's seminannual 4x4 magazine, has no less than 5 articles of interest in its Fall/Winter 1995 issue: Lamm, John "La Ruta Maya" p. 22-33 Lamm, John "Fraser Island, wherein life's a beach 75 miles long" p. 80-84 [there's a red Disco in 6 of the 10 photos] Bornhop, Andrew "Range Rover 4.0 SE, more dignified than ever in an adverse world" p. 88-93 Spell, Tim "Camel cruise: filthy accomodations, first-class adventure" p. 124-129 [perhaps the most comprehensive story on the Camel Trophy 94 to appear in print in the US] Murray, Spence "Of camel toes & sand traps" p. 130-131, 134 [how to drive in sand; no mention of LR, but 2 of the 3 photos are Rovers] T. F. Mills tomills@du.edu University of Denver Library 2150 E. Evans Ave. Denver CO 80208 USA From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Mon Dec 5 10:01:19 1994 From: mtalbot@interserv.com Date: Sun, 4 Dec 1994 07:57:05 -0800 To: Land-Rover-Owner@team.net Subject: Re: Wide wheels and tyres Status: O X-Status: All, I wnat to put 16 X 7 white spokes on my Land Rover, anyone recommend any good wheels and possibly tyres (TIRES) to fit on them. I was thinking BF Goodrich all terrain. Any used those ? Anyone have an idealy of the widest tyre that will fit on a 7" rim ? I was thinking 265x70 Mark From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Mon Dec 5 10:01:25 1994 From: mtalbot@interserv.com Date: Sun, 4 Dec 1994 07:56:59 -0800 To: Land-Rover-Owner@team.net Subject: Re: Red line in a Land Rover Status: O X-Status: All, Heck who cares, getting the thing over 55 mph is the only redline !!!! Mark From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Mon Dec 5 10:01:41 1994 From: mtalbot@interserv.com Date: Sun, 4 Dec 1994 07:56:52 -0800 To: Land-Rover-Owner@team.net Subject: Re: Common parts Status: O X-Status: All, Land Rover reversing lights are the same as MGB's. Also, the lamp assemblies are STANDARD B.L parts. Almost all B.L models from 67 to 75 should fit Land Rovers Mark From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Mon Dec 5 10:02:50 1994 Date: 04 Dec 94 17:21:08 EST From: "Stephen O'Hearn" <72700.3262@compuserve.com> To: Land Rover Digest Subject: 90 Armrests / Tape vs. CD Status: O X-Status: No armrests :( Can't rest your arm on the door top with the side windows either :( This has caused me to keep both hands on the steering wheel more :) This in turn has adversely affected my wave response time :( Tape vs. CD: I'd stick with a tape player, they are cheaper, more robust, and tapes are easier to handle while driving. Sure a changer takes care of this but I'm not so sure one can handle an abusive environment (dust and moisture which get everywhere). Regarding contamination of tapes I have found that CD's aren't too tolerant of being scratched. Wishing I was treading lightly on the Donner Summit... Stephen O'Hearn '94 Defender 90 From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Mon Dec 5 10:02:58 1994 From: "Jurgen Klus" Organization: Flinders University of S.Aust. To: LRO@TEAM.NET Date: Mon, 5 Dec 1994 09:36:54 GMT-0930 Subject: Disco height Priority: normal Status: O X-Status: Could a few of you Discovery owners do me a favour? I think my Discovery is a bit low at the front. Could you please post the distance between the very top of the front axle and the bottom of the rubber bump stop? It needs to be a V8i, preferrably 3.5 ltr, 5 speed. (Although I don't think the 3.9 weighs any more!) Thanks. Jurgen Klus Voice 618 201 2413 Fax 618 201 3877 From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Mon Dec 5 10:03:09 1994 From: sohearn@interserv.com Date: Sun, 4 Dec 1994 16:18:03 -0800 To: land-rover-owner@team.net Subject: An Internet Wave to All Status: O X-Status: Sorry, but I couldn't help playing with my new way to access the Internet. I hope you'll all forgive me! Treading Lightly... Stephen +----------------------------------------------------+ | Stephen O'Hearn Land Rover | | '94 Defender 90 The Best 4x4xFar | +----------------------------------------------------+ From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Mon Dec 5 10:03:50 1994 Date: Sun, 4 Dec 1994 23:17:44 -0800 From: Roger Sinasohn To: jory@mit.edu, mcdpw@pacific.pacific.net Subject: Re: Electric Land-Rovers Cc: lro@team.net Status: O X-Status: From Jory (>) and Granville (>>) >>Wilde Evolutions also sent me a copy of an article, just published, from >>Winter 1994 issue of _Electric_Car_ magazine. It may still be on the >>newsstands, although I have looked and couldn't find it in my hodunk town >>(no great surpize, that). In the article is a photo of the Land-Rover >>off-roading in Arizona (in Coconino National Forest), as well as a shot of >>an electified Mazda RX-7, doing a wheelie. Really. > >I read the article.. and have access to the magazine (friend's copy). That >magazine is difficult to find even in major cities (recent point of >discussion on the EV mailing list). > >There is also a >picture of that electric same rover (at least I think it's the same) in >Home Power magazine last month. I found two copies of _Electric_Car_ magazine at the magazine *kiosk* (near the food court) in Serramonte Shopping Center. One is mine, the other is available for whoever wants it for cover cost + shipping. I'm *drooling*! From the article, it sounds like they've sorta made the Rover a stock conversion. Anyone know what they want for it? (he says wincing in anticipation.) If I remember rightly, Drive Electric in Sacto charges (I think) around $9,000 for the conversion alone. > >I think I put ("Uncle") Roger in touch with the owner of the EV rover (he >is also a friend of the guy I was just doing EV work for). Roger has his >contract info, etc... There were two addresses on the message you forwarded me... One responded saying it was t'other who owned the rover; I never heard from them. Anyway, the supposed owner of the electric rover is brickard@olympus.net. Thanks for keeping me posted! (he says, dreaming about that engineless 88 in PA.) --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad sinasohn@crl.com that none but madmen know." Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates San Francisco, California From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Mon Dec 5 10:07:04 1994 Date: 05 Dec 94 06:29:05 EST From: Leslie from Florida & Liverpool <100042.254@compuserve.com> To: Subject: Landy bits Status: O X-Status: TeriAnne- I have talked with a few people about the cabinets and everyone says the same - you will have to have them made. Unfortunately very few dormobiles (if any) get junked and the people that have them hang onto them! I can get someone to make them out here, but I thik once they are shipped it isn't worthwhile. I can get the dimensions if that is at all helpful. I saw your interest in the fire trucks. Here is some info on two: 109 IIa FORWARD CONTROL Conversion Fire Truck - Less than 17,000 miles. Red. 2 seats in front for officer & driver and 3 seats in the back for crew. Panels straight and frame excellent. Bell, Siren, Horn, Hose reel - all the goodies. 250 gallon/minute pump. 3 intakes - Hydrant / Suction(from pond) for 454 litre onboard tank. The third intake will draw 250 gallons/minute and shoot it back out again. Searchlight, Suction hoses, Delivery hoses, nossles, tools, standpipe, even original uniforms and black helmets can be sourced.\ 1961 Austin Gypsy Fire Tender. (rare!) Chassis # 5944! All service history, original log book, just released from indoor factory service with 1000 original miles on the clock. Main unit includes water tank, hose reel, spotlight, siren, light. Body, frame, and interior all in excellent condition. INCLUDES TRAILER with uniforms, helmets, hoses etc. If your interested, send an email and I'll get you more info. Anything else you might want me to check out? ------------------------------------------------------------------ Pierce Pintle trailers don't exist for less than 250 pounds and a excellent one seems to be closer to 400. Even at the auctions. Most things Land roverish are significantly cheaper in England, but trailers doesn't seem to be one. I guess it is because they are very utilitarian, and there is a lot of need for that out here. Oh well. Hope you have fun with the SI fire tender anyhow. It should be arriving mid December. __________________________________________________________________ Dixon (and everyone else who asked) Getting back to you on Hydraulic winches. I have a genuine Landrover hydraulic winch rated at 15,000 lb with everything, including the pipes, pump, mounting plate, instructions for installation, etc. I also have a genuine Landrover 110 winch. It includes everything - the bumper includes a bull bar mounting plate that surrounds the winch. Email for more info. _____________________________________________________________________ J Pappas Welcome to the list. How is Mass right now. Pretty cold I imagine. (Of course it is not exactly wam here in Liverpool) Anyway just wanted to say hi and where is my newsletter?! _______________________________________________________________________ Steve The IIa 88 - "Guinness" should be in Florida just after Xmas if you want to view it. Just leave me an email as to what day. _______________________________________________________________________ *********************************************************************** If anyone is interested in recieving a current availability parts and vehicles list please email: 1) name and email address 2) snail mail address 3) fax/ph # 4) interests - ie 109, 88, SI-II-III, winch, cylinder head, etc I will try to help anyone on the net to find difficult things to find!! *********************************************************************** Hope you all had a good turkey day. Hard to believe Xmas is only 3 weeks away! Cheers Leslie From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Mon Dec 5 10:07:17 1994 Date: Mon, 5 Dec 1994 09:50:23 -0500 (EST) From: Harry Greenspun To: Land Rover BBS Subject: Diff. Oil Change Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Content-Length: 258 Status: O X-Status: I'm gearing up to change the oil in the diffs, but have run into an obstacle. Does anyone know where to get the mysterious 13 mm square drive wrench? Whatever happened to the "stripped down with a screw driver and crescent wrench?" Harry 94 Discovery From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Mon Dec 5 10:07:24 1994 From: Russell Burns Subject: Re: Diff. Oil Change To: hgreensp@welchlink.welch.jhu.edu (Harry Greenspun) Date: Mon, 5 Dec 94 7:05:55 PST Cc: lro@stratus.com In-Reply-To: ; from "Harry Greenspun" at Dec 5, 94 9:50 am Status: O X-Status: I find the .5 in drive on my socket wrench does the job. It works on the Defender, and the Range Rover. Russ > > I'm gearing up to change the oil in the diffs, but have run into an > obstacle. Does anyone know where to get the mysterious 13 mm square drive > wrench? Whatever happened to the "stripped down with a screw driver and > crescent wrench?" > > Harry > 94 Discovery > > From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Mon Dec 5 10:08:51 1994 Date: 05 Dec 94 10:03:10 EST From: "Stefan R. Jacob" <100043.2400@compuserve.com> To: lro Subject: Selling my 109 ? Status: O X-Status: > Stefan: still haven't sold that LHD SIII eh ? ...well, no. And now, after the first 'V8-euphoria' has settled, I don't think I will. Ok, a S.III 109 4-cyl. and a '87 RR EFi are two different worlds, and, needless to say, the Range is a luxurious and powerful piece of machinery, and very able off-road as I've found out myself. But now that I've got to know "both worlds" and own both of these beasts, I can say this much: The Range, with all its perfection, comfort and power, doesn't have nearly the charm, charisma and spirit of the 109. The Range doesn't have... a soul! Like with the 109, I would sometimes talk to it, either angry if it did some monkey business, or then again even patting it on the bonnet after it got me through a very tight spot or a difficult situation, delivering incredible power and performance after all these years... Now with the Range, I would feel *silly* talking to it; after all, it's just a ... machine! Say what you like, a Range (or Disco, for that matter) simply doesn't have, and never will have, the 'personality' of a Series. This has nothing to do with performance, or durability, or corrosion or whatever, it's totally futile to embark on such discussions. It has to do with emotions or, as TeriAnn once coined, 'being strange' and therefore cannot be grasped by reason or logic. So, for the time being I've laid up the 109 in a barn nearby to give it a dry, salt-free rest for the winter (yes, I have changed all the liquids and covered the springs with grease), and next year, who knows, I might treat it to a new galvanized frame (perhaps coil-sprung??). No, I don't think I'll sell it after all. Unless, of course, someone comes along and makes me the proverbial * offer I can't refuse *. And what would I do with all that money? Buy a Series, naturally... Raving mad, Stefan From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Mon Dec 5 10:09:46 1994 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 5 Dec 1994 10:58:07 -0500 To: lro@team.net From: Chrisste@cerf.net (Chris Stevens) Subject: NOW A LAND ROVER OWNER Status: O X-Status: As many of you may have noticed, I am now the proud owner of Bill's 69 SIIA 88. This is my first LR so I'm bound to have a lot of questions. First, though, I have to learn how to get in second gear. As I told Bill, it took us (the LR and me) about 10 hours to make the trek from Troy, NY to Baltimore last Friday. We arrived about 1 am Saturday after an uneventful trip. That is if you call cruising at 50 mph on I-88, I-81, and I-83 uneventful. I did get my share of honks and strange hand signals. Just wanted to the introduction. Chris Stevens BCG Corporate Communications (410) 583-1722 (410) 583-1935 (FAX) Chrisste@cerf.net R 1 3 2 H "Land Rover's first, becuase +--|--| | | Land Rovers last." 2 4 4 L '69 S.IIa 88" From ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Mon Dec 5 10:10:26 1994 Date: Mon, 05 Dec 1994 11:57:53 -0500 From: maloney@wings.attmail.com (maloney) Phone: 201-564-2073 Subject: Harry's Plugged To: LRO@stratus.com Content-Type: Text Status: O