From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Nov 1 00:57:24 1994 To: lro@team.net Subject: N9Y or N12Y ? Date: Tue, 01 Nov 1994 06:54:16 +0000 From: John Gardener Status: RO X-Status: My V8 currently has N9Y plugs fitted but the Land Rover Workshop Manual says that the engine/carb configuration should have N12Y. I know that its running rich but the N9Y core looks a nice colour (but the walls are sooty. The question ? Do N12Y's run cooler than N9Y's ? If this is the case then I'd expect that without re-setting the carb the N12Y's would get very sooty, yes ? Then it would be a case of turning the mixture down to get the correct core colour back, yes ? From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Nov 1 01:42:40 1994 From: WB6AGE@aol.com Date: Tue, 1 Nov 1994 02:39:25 -0500 Sender: WB6AGE@aol.com To: lro@team.net Subject: Frame Paint Status: RO X-Status: >Can anyone in the states suggest a good quality rush paint for painting my ^M SIII frame ?? I just painted my just sandblasted SII 88" frame with "Hammerite Smoothe gloss black" Use a brush/or spray but put on lot's of coats and be careful with the nooks and crannies. It's a glass loaded paint and has good abrasion resistance. Another option is powder paint. Typical Oregon prices are 75$us for the sandblast, $22 for a half gallon of paint, or $150 for powder paint. Good luck, Bob WB6AGE@aol,com From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Nov 1 03:26:54 1994 Date: Tue, 1 Nov 1994 04:20:04 -0500 (EST) From: "Hal A. Lightwood" Subject: Hello! To: lro X-Envelope-To: lro@team.net Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Mime-Version: 1.0 Status: RO X-Status: I am a new owner of a 1972 SeriesIII 88" Land Rover. This is my first experience with this type of vehicle and I am very happy to have found this mailing list! Bye for now! Hal A. Lightwood From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Nov 1 04:06:48 1994 Subject: Re: '95 Disco features. To: LRO list Date: Tue, 1 Nov 1994 09:50:07 +0000 (GMT) From: Richard Jones Organization: Apricot Computers Limited Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1625 Status: RO X-Status: DEBROWN@srp.gov writes: > > FROM: David Brown Internet: debrown@srp.gov > Computer Graphics Specialist * Mapping Services & Engr Graphics > PAB204 (602)236-3544 - Pager:6486 External (602)275-2508 #6486 > SUBJECT: '95 Disco features. > I've recently spoken to an owner of a '95 Disco, and thought I'd share > my findings with you as for the differences between a '94 and '95. > > o Side impact beams in rear doors added. > o More color choices (more blues added) > o Dis-arming the alarm activates the interior lights. > o Lumbar supports in the front seats. (I REALLY wish I had this!!) > o Wheels more silver color than grey. > > That's all I have found out. Anyone else know anything? o lots of stuff to meet US regulations o new front grille o new rear light arrangement (very poor in comparison to 94 vehicle but conforms to EEC regulations - shame you never see the break lights or indicators sitting in the bumper well below your line of sight :-( o new dashboard o 3.9 V-8 (thinking about it the 3.9 might just have sneeked into the last few 94 models) o improved Tdi o ABS available (option on some standard on others I believe) o electric tilting sunroof(s) -- _ __ Apricot Computer Limited Tel: (+44) 21 717 7171 ' ) ) / 3500 Parkside Fax: (+44) 21 717 0123 /--' o _. /_ Birmingham Business Park / \_<_(__/ <_ BIRMINGHAM B37 7YS Email: richardj@apricot.co.uk Richard Jones United Kingdom ..!uknet!apricot!richardj From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Nov 1 04:43:10 1994 X-Authentication-Warning: tornadic.sw.stratus.com: Host localhost.stratus.com didn't use HELO protocol To: lro@team.net Cc: caloccia@lectroid.sw.stratus.com X-Copyright-1994: William Caloccia, All Rights Reserved. Subject: RR clutch master cylinder Date: Tue, 01 Nov 94 05:41:17 -0500 From: William Caloccia Status: RO X-Status: So I lost any pedal in my clutch, and found there was no fluid, and looked and found there was what seemed to be fluid from the clutch slave cylinder. Replaced that, bleed that, then bleed the top line from the master cylinder (which goes UP -- going over near the top of the bulkhead), and bleed the master cylinder, and it still doesn't 'hold' pressure. It isn't losing fluid any more. The pedal can be 'pumped up' Holding the pedal in (even a ten seconds) the clutch will engage. Makes getting it into revers a royal pain. So I figure the seals are gone within the master cylinder ... Does that sound reasonable ? Now for you UK folk - If I get parts from unipart can I get the same manufacturer (lockheed or girling, etc.) as from the LR parts ? I noticed the slave was lockheed, which is what I could have gotten for half that at the local parts store (which I can walk to from work). If I don't ask for a lockheed or girling one, will I get some naff part ? -Bill From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Nov 1 06:32:20 1994 Date: Tue, 01 Nov 1994 08:24:14 -0500 From: maloney@wings.attmail.com (maloney) Phone: 201-564-2073 Subject: New ABP Catalog & SI Frame To: LRO@stratus.com Content-Type: Text Status: RO X-Status: The new ABP catalog just arrived. It isn't quite up to RN standards but it is light years ahead of the old one, and MUCH better organized. The new flyer is out too. No surprises on prices in either. If you don't get a catalog delivered (Haven't placed an order recently), they are $5 with a $10 parts certificate. For the person who just bought the Series I that needed frame work, there is an ad in their classified section for a Series I 80" frame, "rust free" (if it wasn't in Arizona I would be sceptical) and bulkhead (doesn't say if the bulkhead is rust free also). No price listed, Dave @ 602-432-2473. Bill Wayne, NJ USA 88IIA & 109 Wagon maloney@wings.attmail.com From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Nov 1 08:21:57 1994 Date: Tue, 1 Nov 1994 09:15:07 -0500 (EST) From: Jon Humphrey To: lro@team.net Subject: 65/88-4 Sale Cc: lro@stratus.com Status: RO X-Status: I don't know if anyone would be interested but I will post this to see. Here in Pittsburgh there is a 65 IIA 88 wagon with a safari roof for sale. I looked at it and I can't use it cause mines a 109 PU. And I have nowhere to put it if I did get it. Paint is rough but the frame looks pretty good and the body is straight. Interior is good. The down side is that the engine is apart. And the owner sez the pistons are frozen because he had it in a garage where someone was venting a clothes dryer. It's all there though, it might be good for some one to have for parts or restoration. >From what he told me, some one offered him between $500.00 and $1,000.00 and at the time he thought it was worth more. I think now he would go for anything cause Ithink he has to move it. I would think $500.00 is the right range, maybe $750.00. If your interested his name is: David H. Ertman 539 South Graham St. Pittsburgh, Pa. 15232 Phone 412-683-1902 or you can email me and I'll give him the message. Thanks for your time Jon From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Nov 1 07:46:23 1994 Date: Tue, 01 Nov 94 09:26:59 EST From: "Lapa, Hank" Encoding: 29 Text To: LRO@team.net Subject: Splitfire & Over-the Road Status: RO X-Status: All, I've had Splitfire plugs in my 2 1/4 petrol for 2-3 years with no complaints. Just returned from my second "long" trip -- long weekend to Jamestown/Newport, Rhode Island. About 8 1/2 hours each way with various distractions, but spent most of the highway time with the speedo needle off the scale, passing almost as many cars as passed me. (I have overdrive, FWHs, 8:1 head, and Weber 2-barrel with otherwise original 34-year old drive train, engine bored out to .040 over.) Driving up Manhattan's west side, the uniform in the NYPD car kinda stared, but the cabbies seemed not to notice anything unusual. My other long trip, again from the DC area, was to Hartford, CT, to transport paintings from one museum to another in the Baltimore area. One really big item wouldn't quite fit in the 109, ever though the rear athwartships bench had been removed. Solution: unfasten the bar supporting the front seatbacks on the passenger side so that it hangs from the driver side only -- item then slid forward all the way to the seat box. My odometer recently stopped working. Does that affect the accuracy of the speedometer? Is this most likely a problem with the instrument or with the cable ends' engagement? Cheers, Hank From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Nov 1 08:41:28 1994 Date: Tue, 01 Nov 1994 10:30:47 -0500 From: maloney@wings.attmail.com (maloney) Phone: 201-564-2073 Subject: Speedo Repairs To: LRO@stratus.com Content-Type: Text Status: RO X-Status: Hank asks: >> My odometer recently stopped working. Does that affect the accuracy of the speedometer? Is this most likely a problem with the instrument or with the cable ends' engagement? >> Hank, The problem is internal to the speedometer. If you want to repair it a good source for repair of any Smiths or Jaeger instruments is: Nisonger 570 Mamaroneck Ave, Mamaroneck, NY 10543 914-381-1952 I remember someone a while back who had them rebuild their speedo. It was either $90 or $110, I've forgotten which. I understand they can recalibrate your speedo to suit non-standard tire/wheel/differential combinations as well. (Sorry I couldn't respond direct. My mail package didn't give me a usable return address). Bill maloney@wings.attmail.com From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Nov 1 10:10:39 1994 From: Mike Rooth Subject: Re: Splitfire & Over-the Road To: hlapa@Zeus.signalcorp.com (Lapa Hank) Date: Tue, 1 Nov 94 16:05:02 GMT Cc: lro@transfer.stratus.com In-Reply-To: <9410017837.AA783712100@Zeus.signalcorp.com>; from "Lapa, Hank" at Nov 1, 94 9:26 am Status: RO X-Status: Hank, Reckon we'll start a lineshoot book.For stories like"There I was upside down,and nothing on but the radio":-) You're in it *unless* you confess to the Pratt&Whitney you have bolted to the roof rack, and the fact you hgot booked for low flying. The probability is the speedo just gave up at that speed,hid its head in its hands and said "I darent look". The odometer is driven via a worm and wheel arrangement inside the speedo head,I think.Chances are that either the worm or wheel have stripped.Shouldnt affect the accuracy though. If its any consolation,mine hasnt worked for the last three years. Cheers Mike Rooth From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Nov 1 10:33:29 1994 From: "Bryan White" Date: Tue, 1 Nov 1994 08:29:43 -0800 To: land-rover-owner@stratus.com Subject: subscribe Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Mime-Version: 1.0 Status: RO X-Status: subscribe From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Nov 1 10:54:39 1994 From: BwanaE@aol.com Date: Tue, 1 Nov 1994 11:51:43 -0500 Sender: BwanaE@aol.com To: vance@xnet.ssl.berkeley.edu Cc: lro@team.net Subject: mojave road Status: RO X-Status: Vance: Pres. Clinton yesterday signed the desert conservation bill into law. I don't know how soon this will affect the Mojave Road.... I'll be writing to " Friends of the Mojave" to purchase Dennis Casebier's guidebooks, and will ask them about the road's status.I'll post the answer on the net . Regards, Eric. From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Nov 1 12:18:05 1994 To: lro@stratus.com From: azw@aber.ac.uk (Andy Woodward) Subject: First oil change Date: Tue, 1 Nov 1994 18:13:59 UNDEFINED Status: RO X-Status: /Okay, enough rejoicing. My question: / Being the loving owner that I am, I intend to change the oil after the /first 1000 miles (which will be momentarily). I have been persuaded by /the rec.autos.tech crowd to go with synthetic. What's the best weight to /use? The dealer suggested 10W40 or 15W40, but the only synthetic I can /find is either 5W30, 10W30, or 15W50! The manual implies you can use /most, provided the temperature doesn't hit the extremes ( I live in /Maryland). Rec.motorcycles has this discussion in extreme depth every few hours........and motorcycle engines are far more choosy than lorry engines. Also motorcyclists are generally much more technically aware than car drivers - certainly, I get FAR more useful tech tips for teh lorry from rec.motorcycles than from rec.auto.tech (which I dont even bother to read any more......)!!!!!. The concensus is that synthetic should NOT be used for the first few thousand miles or teh breaking process will not complete properly. Furthermore, the benefit of synthetic is not proven even then. Better to simply use a normal dead-dinosaur-tea adn change it twice as often as teh manula states, changeing teh fiter at teh stated intervals. +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Just another roadkill on the Information Superhighway +++++++++++++++++++++++ None-%er #1 +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Nov 1 12:22:27 1994 Date: Tue, 1 Nov 1994 10:17:50 -0800 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: lro@team.net From: mcdpw@pacific.pacific.net (Granville Pool) Subject: Re: Water storage Status: RO X-Status: TeriAnn Wakeman writes: >There is an expidition equiped 110 2 door living in the Pacific Northwest that >has a pair of 20+ gallon stainless water tanks sitting in the space between the >front seats and the rear wheels. This is where the inside mounted spare tyres >go on 109 pickups. Lots of space there and keeps the center of gravity low. > >If those of you who have 88s or four door LRs look underneath your body, you >may find some wasted space that you can stick a water tank in. Another point to consider, which reinforces the efficacy of TeriAnn's suggestions, is polar moment of inertia. When you place weight near the ends of a vehicle, every time you change directions, that weight has to be swung around from side to side, making the vehicle more unstable, harder to control, more so if you are on any sort of side slope. By keeping the weight concentrated toward the center, you minimize this problem and make the vehicle handle much better. This is why Land-Rovers (at least the old ones) are "mid-engined," that is, have the engine mounted completely behind the front axle centerline. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ [ Granville Pool (Redwood Valley, CA) Appraiser, R/W Agent, LR aficionado ] [ e-mail: mcdpw@pacific.pacific.net ** Ph:(707)485-7220 H,(707)463-4265 W ] From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Nov 1 12:24:56 1994 Date: Tue, 1 Nov 1994 10:18:36 -0800 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: lro@team.net From: mcdpw@pacific.pacific.net (Granville Pool) Subject: LRs are the best British cars (forward) Status: RO X-Status: I found this posting on the British Cars list and thought all you fellow Net-Rovers would enjoy it, so I copied it to this list: >Date: Sun, 30 Oct 94 13:56:16 EST >From: Brian Willoughby >Subject: Why Land-Rovers are the best British cars ever made > >I have read with a great deal of interest all of the currently trendy >Land-Rover bashing that has been littering these paperless pages of writ. I >have noted that the one thing that so many LBC owners pride themselves on is >the manner in which their cars leak oil. I have even heard of MG owners >arguing over whose car leaks the most. Somebody (perhaps here) once said that, >like a dog, this is the way in which British cars mark their territory. Well, >most LBC's only leak oil from three sites: the crankcase, the gearbox and the >rear differential. That is fine. Though most Land-Rovers leak from not only >these three areas, though also from their transfer cases, their front >differentials and both swivel pin housings. And that is why they are the best >British cars ever made. LBC's leave their mark like a toy poodle, though > >Land-Rovers leave theirs like a bull elephant. Yes, this is one-up-manship at >its most elemental. Remember, all British cars leak oil, though Land-Rovers >leak their oil with distinction. Why do you think the Queen owns a fleet of >them? > >Brian Willoughby, owner of a 1960 Land-Rover Series II Station Wagon (88"). > >As friend once warned me, "Never take up bank-robbing in that thing. You may >get away, though the trail it leaves behind will lead right to you." Hope that >all of this is taken in the tongue-in-cheek manner in which it was intended. >bawill01@ukcc.uky.edu > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ [ Granville Pool (Redwood Valley, CA) Appraiser, R/W Agent, LR aficionado ] [ e-mail: mcdpw@pacific.pacific.net ** Ph:(707)485-7220 H,(707)463-4265 W ] From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Nov 1 12:54:50 1994 Date: Tue, 1 Nov 94 11:47:22 MST From: rhcaldw@nma.mnet.uswest.com ( ROY CALDWELL ) To: lro@stratus.com Subject: The Engine is In! Status: RO X-Status: Hey Gang! THE ENGINE IS IN! :~) Will rebuild the Weber tonight after work. She should be running tonight. Had trouble getting a carb rebuild kit. Have not found a cross-ref number so I can get the kit from a local source. Nor a cross-ref no. for the K-N airfilter element. Bummer stuff. When she is running under her own power I will try and post a full report on my rebuild adventure. Roy - Rovers in the Rockies - From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Nov 1 13:15:00 1994 To: lro@team.net From: azw@aber.ac.uk (Andy Woodward) Subject: Yuppie scum Date: Tue, 1 Nov 1994 19:08:57 UNDEFINED Status: RO X-Status: / I'm sure there are plenty of yuppie D90 owners whose /trucks /will never see dirt under the tires, but I would venture that none who are on /this /list fall into that catagory. Sounds exactly like me...........I try never to take mine off teh road nowadays in case I break it.. I got it cos it's teh only thing on teh market I can leave to someone in my will...... But, since I have been living in it up in teh mountains for a couple of months, am I forgiven? +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Just another roadkill on the Information Superhighway +++++++++++++++++++++++ None-%er #1 +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Nov 1 13:21:09 1994 To: lro@team.net From: azw@aber.ac.uk (Andy Woodward) Subject: Cheapo 90 chassis Date: Tue, 1 Nov 1994 19:16:20 UNDEFINED Status: RO X-Status: /because there is no demand.And Dixon is right,I'm afraid.Given his /conditions,and ours,the modern chassis just dont last as long.There /is some *very* funny steel about.There are already articles on putting /new rear ends on young 90 and 110 models.Not for nothing was the phrase /"British Racing Rust"coined!If there are two things our climate is /famous for its the ability to rust,and the incidence of arthritis. A freind of mine who was a Warden for Newborough Desert nature reserve took his 90 on teh beach regularly as part of his job. The chassis fell in two in teh middle inside a year!!!!!!!!! Not impressed. Having said that, My 90 is 10 years old, gets Waxoyled all over the outside of teh chassis every year (takes about 15 minutes) adn all over the inside every 5 (no idea how long cos I get it done by someone with e HIGH pressure injector...). There is NO rust on it other than a few superficial flakes - even on teh outriggers. If you see some, you just spray a bit on from a plant sprayer carried round for the purpose, adn bingo - no further problem. +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Just another roadkill on the Information Superhighway +++++++++++++++++++++++ None-%er #1 +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Nov 1 13:34:41 1994 To: lro@team.net From: azw@aber.ac.uk (Andy Woodward) Subject: 90s and Real Use(tm) Date: Tue, 1 Nov 1994 19:24:23 UNDEFINED Status: RO X-Status: > The fact that some (most) can't af one is irrelevant. As for myself and the > other two D90 owners I know here in Portland, we use ours as God intended, > in the muck. I didn't buy the thing to look at it in the garage and wipe it > with a diaper, I use it. / / You are one of the first that I have heard that does. All the power / to you, it is nice to hear this. My limited experience has been the / opposite. However, I would ask, unlike most on the list, and just Round here they are all used by hill farmers. What creases me up is teh way that one of teh most fragile bits of em are teh steering bars - all nice and exposed in front of teh axle. The Poser^H^H^H^H^HCounty Staion Wagons come with bashbars in front of these. Pity none ever go off teh road. The commercials, that are heavily used by farmers who habitually run them into rocks, trees, sheep etc dont come with bashbars. Landrover market research wins another goldfish. Guess what accessories are selling like hotcakes to local farmers? +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Just another roadkill on the Information Superhighway +++++++++++++++++++++++ None-%er #1 +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Nov 1 13:35:57 1994 To: lro@team.net From: azw@aber.ac.uk (Andy Woodward) Subject: Re: Babes that like Land Rovers? Date: Tue, 1 Nov 1994 19:31:19 UNDEFINED Status: RO X-Status: /hear any more disparaging remarks. I forgot to mention that she didn't /like the idea of more leaves on the inside than the outside. I had /parked topless under a tree for a week, during the transition from /soft top to hard top. Just got the top on that morning. And NO /SEATBELTS! I like freaking teh yuppies out at pressure washes. You pulll up behind them, adn watch their eyes go alll big when you open the doors adn hose it down inside, completely ignoring all teh muck on teh outside. You can hear the shorting our noises echoing round their heads......... +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Just another roadkill on the Information Superhighway +++++++++++++++++++++++ None-%er #1 +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Nov 1 13:55:25 1994 To: lro@team.net From: azw@aber.ac.uk (Andy Woodward) Subject: Re: To Lead or Unlead Date: Tue, 1 Nov 1994 19:41:19 UNDEFINED Status: RO X-Status: /The latest from the English (and I chose the name carefully) government is /that a *3 year* study by an appointed committee has found that "the rise in /cars is detrimental to the environment" (Mr Rooth! Stop that laughter!) / /The committee proposes (broadly): / /1) The price of petrol should be doubled /2) The investment in new roads should be stopped /3) Public transport should be made cheaper, better and more frequent / /The government has taken the report and "will respond after a thoughtful /and carefull revue". When asked how soon this response would be, the /minister said that it would be a "considered and thoughtful response, /thus not immediately" I think we all know how they will decide. In favour of 1) adn against 2) adn 3). /Don't you just love 'em....... Not much. No. +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Just another roadkill on the Information Superhighway +++++++++++++++++++++++ None-%er #1 +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Nov 1 15:33:59 1994 From: mtalbot@interserv.com Date: Tue, 1 Nov 1994 11:46:34 -0800 To: LRO@team.net Subject: RR reversing lights, and Brake lights.. etc Status: RO X-Status: <---- Begin Included Message ----> Subject: RR reversing lights, and Brake lights.. etc To: lro, LRO@TEAM.NET I read the thread about dim RR reversing lights. Just wanted to relay a problem I had on my 88 RR. I changed both brake lights and side lamps for inspection, after that I had problems with the engine cutting out under heavy braking. After calling Rovers North, they told me of problems with fitting non-standard brake lamps, with different voltage. If you fit a higher voltage the computer senses it and shuts down as it thinks there is a short somewhere. I changed to 12w 4v and all is fine. Hey, I can't explain it either but it cured my RR. Makes me wonder just what we will do when the New RR gets here, LRO found electronic problems with it on a test drive (LRO NOV). Whilst I'm here, I called LRO and gave them @#$% for the late arrival of LRO-OCT. They are going to try and get the mag here by 5th of each month. I'm on a role so I will keep going. For those of you who remeber, my Land Rover rental biz is picking up steam, few renatls for next year. I have just bought two more SIII's. One has completly nackered. The frame split in half when I went to collect it !! anyway that is now in bits behind the shed. Anyone looking for SIII parts, let me know, I have a spare SIII gearbox if any wants one, $175.00. Good rear body for $200.00. That's my lot for now.. <---- End Included Message ----> From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Nov 1 14:04:41 1994 To: lro@team.net From: azw@aber.ac.uk (Andy Woodward) Subject: Re: Picking on Land Rovers Date: Tue, 1 Nov 1994 19:57:06 UNDEFINED Status: RO X-Status: > The original question is how usable is a Land Rover on the road and is it > suited for taking long trips. SO far I'm the only one saying they are usable > on long trips, and even usable on the road. Make that two. Much to my surprise (comfort was not on my list of priorities when buying teh Lorry) I found that it was more comfortable than any other car I had ever driven on all day trips! I have a 90 with teh original minimalist square foam block seats. These, ,combined with teh superb suspension, give no aches at all after 16 hours in teh saddle. Unlike anything else I've driven. The suspension? Put it this way. When I moved into Sheffield, I took teh spare wheel off teh rear door adn put it in the back to prevent having to buy new one every day. I forgot to put teh nuts back n teh muonting. I then drove 12 miles over some really crap roads (south Yorkshire roads must be the worse 'surfaced' roads in teh world!!) to look at a house. Then I drove back. Getting out, I noticed the nuts were missing. Oh SHIT! Then I just about fell over - they were still sitting there ON THE REVERSING LIGHT HOUSING!!!!!!!!!!!! I'll not hear a bad word for 90 suspension........ With a deisel, I'm not going anywhere fast, but I get there eventually no matter what the road can throw at me, adn I get there relaxed. +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Just another roadkill on the Information Superhighway +++++++++++++++++++++++ None-%er #1 +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Nov 1 14:30:19 1994 Date: Tue, 01 Nov 94 15:21:41 EST From: Brian Willoughby Subject: NBC's Tom & Roseanne Arnold Biography To: land-rover-owner@TEAM.NET Status: RO X-Status: Did everyone with access to NBC watch the made-for-TV movie about Roseanne and Tom Arnold? If not, there was a great shot of a Defender 90 (yellow) and a Range Rover in what was apparently an L-R dealership. After Tom and Roseanne buy their Range Rover, it plays a prominent roll throughout the remainder of the film. If they re-air it, be sure to watch for the Rover(s). See you guys, Brian Willoughby bawill@ukcc.uky.edu From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Nov 1 16:10:14 1994 Date: Tue, 01 Nov 1994 16:28:18 EST From: CXKS46A@prodigy.com (MR ALEXANDER P GRICE) To: land-rover-owner@team.net Subject: New member Status: RO X-Status: We've got a new member on-line (I think)...Robert Davis, ROAV's resident guru on six cylinder engines, both the 2.6 as well as the 3.0 litre P-5's. If you got this Robert, welcome aboard. *----"Jeep may be famous, LAND-ROVER is Legendary"-----* | | | Sandy Grice, Rover Owners' Association of Virginia | | E-Mail: CXKS46A@prodigy.com FAX: 804-622-7056 | | Voice: 804-622-7054 (Days) 804-423-4898 (Evenings) | | 1633 Melrose Pkwy., Norfolk, VA, 23508-1730 USA | *------------------------------------------------------* From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Nov 1 17:05:03 1994 Date: 01 Nov 94 17:43:42 EST From: "Stefan R. Jacob" <100043.2400@compuserve.com> To: land-rover-owner-list Subject: Re: Jon's Steering Relay Status: RO X-Status: Jory Bell (jory@MIT.EDU) was wondering: >I had to buy a new steering relay (whose oil level I should now check). How >often should I have to replenish a new relay's oil (it's been 2 years now). Basically, if the thing doesn't leak and the the top seals are ok you don't have to touch it ever. It doesn't actually *use* oil, it's just in there to preserve the polished shaft surface, and to keep the bushes soaked and running in oil. It might make sense, after the initial filling, to have a look after a few months (or 2 years in this case), as new bushes soak up a certain (minimal) amount of oil, and there might have been the odd air bubble trapped inside when sealing it up that has by now worked its way up and is waiting to be released. It is more important to keep the top and bottom of the relay always thickly covered with fresh grease and to clear away any muck and dirt, because water, dust and grit ingress is the one big relay killer. The relay itself is designed practically wear-free and, once oiled and properly sealed up, will last to all eternity - theoretically. Another netter referred to friends of his who drill a hole through the lenght and horizontally thru the centre of the shaft to facilitate oil filling... I would strongly disadvise this. The steering relay shaft is subjected to incredible torque and material strain and needs all the material and structural strength it can get. And your life depends on it. Imagine the shaft snapping when going around a sharp downhill bend in the Rockies... (and it _can_ break, I've seen one!) Just leave it as it is and take your time with oil filling. Stefan From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Nov 1 17:03:56 1994 Date: 01 Nov 94 17:43:48 EST From: "Stefan R. Jacob" <100043.2400@compuserve.com> To: land-rover-owner-list Subject: Re: Disco skid plates available? Needed? Status: RO X-Status: David Brown (debrown@srp.gov) was wondering: > the engine bay, but what affect would removing the air intake horn have > on the vehicle's computerized air flow system? Well, on an EFi engine I wouldn't touch the air intake system at all. A while ago we - temporarily - fitted a RR EFi with a "high" waterproof air intake out through the bonnet and up at the roof, with an additional cyclon filter. We had trouble getting the beast started, the exaust smoked, and consumption was way up. Still, better than sucking in water or ingesting dust (our fixup was for an offroad-rally). Maybe it would have been possible to correct this by readjusting a few gauges and transistors here or there, but we weren't proficient for that, and couldn't have been bothered anyway. But it does show that tampering with the air intake of an EFi impairs engine performance. Just thought I'd let you know. Stefan From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Nov 1 17:02:05 1994 Date: 01 Nov 94 17:43:56 EST From: "Stefan R. Jacob" <100043.2400@compuserve.com> To: land-rover-owner-list Subject: Rover: Jobs, investment, model strategy Status: RO X-Status: Here's another extract from a news clipping of the british daily 'The Guardian' of Oct. 20, 1994: ================================================================= ... ... Rover ... announced plans to take on 1,450 new staff as part of a five-year #1.5 billion investment drive. Up to 4,500 more jobs could be created as a result, with suppliers and dealers benefitting from increased output. ... Some 300 production workers are to be hired at the Solihull Land Rover plant where total staff has already been increased by 1,300 in the past 18 months. ... ... Rover's total workforce will rise to just under 35,000. The company has produced 50,000 more cars in the first nine months of the year than in the same period of 1993. John Towers, Rover's chief executive, said that he expected production to reach 490,000 this year and exceed 500,000 in 1995 ... The planned increase in production also reflects Rover's improving export performance ... ... The success of the Land Rover Discovery in the US has seen export sales rise 127 per cent this year. ... However, uncertainty remains over the long-term model range following the #800 million BMW takeover in February. Bernd Pischetsrieder, BMW chairman, said that the company was still developing a strategy for Rover Models. ... ================================================================= Enjoy, Stefan From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Nov 1 17:02:44 1994 Date: 01 Nov 94 17:44:06 EST From: "Stefan R. Jacob" <100043.2400@compuserve.com> To: land-rover-owner-list Subject: Re: Picking on Land Rovers Status: RO X-Status: ...I'll make it as short as possible, just the raw data should be enough to impress any Land Rover critic: Two years ago we (one 110, one 83'RR and my 73' S.III 109 Station) set off on a 5-week trip through the Near-East. My vehicle preparations: None. Just the regular as-is no-frills S.III 2.25 petrol that I had been driving daily and to work for the past couple of years. I threw a field bed, sleeping bag and a few plastic water canisters in the back (oh yes, and I did have one of those canvas water bags!), got in, turned the key, and then we drove through Austria, Hungary, Romania, Bulgaria, across Turkey, through Syria and Jordania, took the ferry in Aqaba over to the Sinai, had a look around Sinai, drove up past Suez, crossed the canal and continued to Cairo, rovered round the Pyramids, then down the Nile valley past Luxor and Assuan, through the desert all along the Assuan (formerly Nasser) Lake to Abu Simbel and Wadi Halfa (border to Sudan), no dice for entering Sudan, so back again through the desert to Assuan, then across the eastern desert highland to the Red Sea, up along the Red Sea to Suez; liked Sinai, so again over to Sinai and down to Sharm-el Sheikh, then back via Cairo through the desert to El-Alamein, had a look around (still plenty of war trash lying around), along the mediterranean coast to Alexandria, short on time, so we took the ferry back to Venice/Italy, with short stopovers on Crete and in Athens. From Venice back over the Alps (already snowing) to Germany. Well over 7,000 miles in just 5 weeks, under occasionally punishing conditions. My regular original factory-built plain vanilla 20-year old S.III 109 without any add-ons or 'expedition gear' whatsoever, fitted with near-bald old Avon Range Master tires, went through that trip without coughing, sputtering or stalling even once, and never got stuck either. Just a normal, interesting, totally trouble-free journey. So much for long distance travel in an old Land Rover. Now lets hear it from the Broncos and Blazers... Stefan From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Nov 2 06:30:48 1994 Date: Tue, 01 Nov 94 17:56:03 EST From: "Lapa, Hank" Encoding: 23 Text To: m.j.rooth@lut.ac.uk Cc: LRO@team.net Subject: Speed and speedo Status: RO X-Status: Mike, Having seen the letters in the LRO mag about how motorists in the mother country seem to resent a fast Land-Rover going down the highway, skepticism is entirely justified. All I know is that my needle doesn't wobble at all from zero to well over 75. There was very much a time when the thing couldn't get out of its own way, on slopes, cold days, days of the week ending in "y" and so on. Seem that wires being routed to plugs in the wrong order had something to do with it. Also, when I finally got around to adjusting the distributor angle (clear to the stop!) to get the best idle, a big improvement was noted. When the wifey comes home from Okinawa for a few days, I'll have her pace me moving along the big slab; I may even fix a level in the car to ensure there's no gravitational assist. If the radiator panel does indeed glow from atmospheric friction, all pilgrims coming to see her (the Rover, not the wife) owe me a pint of Sam Adams. If it lies significantly, visitors are still welcome and I'll buy the Guiness. Til then, "That wasn't a German Starfighter; that was an American Rover!" Best Regards, Hank ;-) From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Nov 1 17:55:31 1994 Date: Tue, 1 Nov 1994 17:47:44 -0600 (CST) From: David John Place Subject: Re: First oil change To: Andy Woodward Cc: lro@stratus.com In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Status: RO X-Status: A friend of mine who participated in early tests of synthetic oils which prompted the Canadian Government to specify it for northern vehicles says for low temps there is nothing like it. He watched tests in Alert at the North Pole with the stuff. Vehicles left out overnight started with it but real stuff was like candy cane mix after a night out. He said they determined it was a good lubricant. My mechanic friend says don't use it till the rings are seated but after that use it always. You want to let the pan drain right out and change the filter because some brands don't like to mix together. Dave VE4PN From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Nov 1 18:20:01 1994 Date: Tue, 1 Nov 1994 16:16:01 -0800 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: lro@team.net From: mcdpw@pacific.pacific.net (Granville Pool) Subject: The Last Ibex?? Status: RO X-Status: Hail, fellow Net-Rovers, and greetings! I wish to pass along to you, my fellow netters, the warm greetings of John Foers. Who? John is the founder and president of Foers Engineering, on the parental side of the pond. And Foers Engineering is (or was...) the maker of the rare and wonderful Foers Ibex. A what? For those who did not already know and whom I have not already bored with my lust for the Ibex, it is a simpler, more rugged, *no nonsense* kit-built, Land-Rover-based special, with a full spaceframe with rollcage to replace the Land-Rover's ladder frame. Available in 90" (actually 92.9", of course), 100", and 110", in open, pick-up, and full hard-top versions, even a four-door station wagon version of the 110". The spaceframe is hot-dip galvanized after construction, then fabricated aluminum body panels are bolted and/or riveted onto the spaceframe. Easily repaired and pretty much all body panels can be replicated at any capable sheetmetal shop. I had seen scant reference to the Ibex in LRO and, in the July issue (I think) one for sale (with a photo, under "something different"), but no articles. So I asked the net for more information. John Brabyn responded. He happened to have an issue of another mag with an article on the Ibex. He sent me a copy. I wrote to Foers for more information because, if the article was to be believed, here was something really awsome and reasonably priced. I specifically asked about using Range Rover components, as I figure that is the only way I can reasonably manage to do one in the U.S. (to acquire a wrecked U.S. spec. Range Rover, with good title, and keep it registered as a Range Rover). Besides, I want the 3.9l EFI V-8, 4-speed auto, and viscous coupling, along with, hopefully, the ABS, self-leveling, power-steering, and air-conditioning. Yeah, gnarly, but civilized. Travel in comfort to the trails, then kick ass. *YES* c|:{o> Well, John Foers wrote me back a very nice letter, making clear that he enjoyed getting my letter. He said he really got a good chuckle over picturing an international network of Land-Rover experts [his words, more or less, indicating this list] discussing his "elusive machine." Charming, I thought. He also informed me that the very last Ibex, as currently configured, is currently being built. The last one? Am I too late? No. He will be switching over to start production of a new creation, basically the same, starting in January 1995. He said that I was the very first on the American continent to know about the new one, and you, fellow netters, are next. He said that, inflationary forces notwithstanding, the prices should be about the same and that performance will not be compromised. And that is saying something: He asked if I had ever gotten a stock Defender 90 cross-axle (I wish!) and then tried to open and close the back door. He says, with the Ibex, that is no problem. We're talking rigid here! Hear, hear! I *do* plan to have one, in the next couple of years... and, no, I don't work for Foers, although I'd like to! Cheers, Granville From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Nov 1 19:02:17 1994 Date: Tue, 01 Nov 1994 19:56:03 -0500 From: Andrew Steele Subject: "Last Gasp Ralley" Details To: lro@stratus.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Status: RO X-Status: Hello, I called one of the sponsers of the Ralley, Cherly Ritchie, this evening ans she so go ahead and post the details so here goes: (summarizing from the six page mailing) BLUE RIDGE LAND ROVER CLUB The Mooore's and the Ritchie's invite you to attend a "Last Gasp Rally" in Parkersburg, WV, 11-13 November 1994. Please meet us at the offices of Parkersburg Distributing Co., U.S. Rt 50 East at Dry Ridge Road (2 miles east of I-77/US Rt 50 intersection) for a 9:00am departure on Saturday, 12 November. Bring your Rover, your appetite for food and your appetite/aptitude/attitude for off road adventure. We intend to drive on numbered and un-numbered county roads, that may or may not be passable. Adventure begins on concrete to get to the excellent adventures. They state that they do intend to get dirty. Spoiler removal is recommended for Range Rovers. Please include working fire ext, first aid kit, CB radio if possible. They will have a couple of shovels and saws, but any other equ is appreciated. (winches etc.) Cost will be $5.00 per vehicle - that will cover the dash plaques and dinner. (Obviously they under estimate how much I eat, so in good faith, should I register a shadow?) Hosts will provide lunch except for drinks. Friday evening get-together at the Parkersburg Distributing Co - liquid refreshments, "finger-food", gossip and Rover videos, shown on big screen TV. Distribution Co will be working, so please use caution around the forklifts and trucks (I wonder if they sanction betting for fork-lift races?) Breakfest is on your own at a number of restaurants at the I-77/US Rt 50 interchange. Shoneys, BobEvans, McDonalds, Burger King, Omelet Shop and Mountaineer Family restaurants. _--------------_-------------_---------------_--------------------_ Please mail registration, including: Name Address Phone # in party Rover Model plus $5 payable at time of the Rally to: David or Cherly Ritchie (304) 422-0531 office (304) 428-3068 home or P.O. Box 507 Parkersburg, WV 26102-0507 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- I forgot to note above that they may develop an off-road track through 30 acres of Dave Ritchie's hillsides and woods. Accomidations: Stables Motor Lodge (recommended by hosts) - wv (800) 255-1682 usa (800) 782-2536 $31.95 to $44 for a two person "executive" suite Econo Lodge (304) 422-5401 $31.95 to 39.95 Best Western (800) 528-1234 $32 to 45. Red Roof (800) 843-7663 $34.99 to 48.99 Holiday Inn (304) 485-6200 $70 for one person $76 for two all of the above at, or close to the I-77 & Rt 50 interchange. The hosts are promising enough trees, rocks, hill, valleys, dirt and mud to keep winter withdrawl symptoms to a minimum. **** I am posting this summary with permission of the Rally Host's. To the best of my knowledge, none of them have E-mail capabilities. **** Hope to see everyone I met at Virgina, and those who didn't show (Dixon). Andrew 87 RR and Lum. Dayton, Ohio From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Nov 2 02:41:44 1994 From: LANDROVER@delphi.com Date: Wed, 02 Nov 1994 03:36:52 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Re: New ABP Catalog & SI Frame To: maloney@wings.attmail.com, lro@team.net X-Vms-To: INTERNET"maloney@wings.attmail.com" X-Vms-Cc: INTERNET"lro@team.net" Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Status: RO X-Status: Bill just got new reading material for the privy... > > The new ABP catalog just arrived. It isn't quite up to RN standards but it is> > > light years ahead of the old one, and MUCH better organized. The new flyer is> > The *have* included a new section, just before the price list. Very clever, these guys... The new section is a LR part# to ABP part# cross-ref. It seems to me that they realized probably most all of thier customers have either factory shop manuals *or* Rovers North catalogs, both which have detailed drawings with Land Rover part numbers. The new ABP catalog has real small drawings which are practically useless. So they (ABP) saved money by NOT including drawings, figuring everyone could use something else for reference... Cheers Michael Loiodice E-MAIL landrover@delphi.com 166 W.Fulton St. VOICE (518) 773-2697 Gloversville NY, 12078 1972 Ser III 88 Petrol (Fern) From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Nov 2 02:43:29 1994 From: LANDROVER@delphi.com Date: Wed, 02 Nov 1994 03:37:51 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Re: Splitfire & Over-the Road To: hlapa@Zeus.signalcorp.com, lro@team.net X-Vms-To: INTERNET"hlapa@Zeus.signalcorp.com" X-Vms-Cc: INTERNET"lro@team.net" Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Status: RO X-Status: Hank Lapa sez.... > > My odometer recently stopped working. Does that affect the accuracy > of the speedometer? Is this most likely a problem with the >instrument > or with the cable ends' engagement? > If the Speedo still works but the odometer quit, then chances are it's a problem with the odometer mechanism itself. The cable drives a shaft in the speedometer. Said shaft has a gear which meshes with a gear on the odometer. The shaft also spins a magnet arangement on the end which makes the speedometer needle move. In theory, the odometer could sieze up and cause the gears to strip and your needle could still operate. I would think that if the odometer froze, the cable would twist and break. You sure the speedometer actually works?? With enough vibration, the needle will move around the dial by itself. Really! Cheers Michael Loiodice E-MAIL landrover@delphi.com 166 W.Fulton St. VOICE (518) 773-2697 Gloversville NY, 12078 1972 Ser III 88 Petrol (Fern) From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Nov 2 04:13:18 1994 From: Steve Methley Subject: RR clutch and visiting San Francisco..... To: lro@team.net (landy list) Date: Wed, 2 Nov 94 10:10:59 GMT Mailer: Elm [revision: 70.85] Status: RO X-Status: Bill wrote: >Subject: RR clutch master cylinder >Date: Tue, 01 Nov 94 05:41:17 -0500 >From: William Caloccia > >So I lost any pedal in my clutch, and found there was no fluid, and >.......(replaced slave).... >So I figure the seals are gone within the master cylinder ... >Does that sound reasonable ? Beyond a doubt. BTW, did you get my mail, you live just down the road from me? >Now for you UK folk - If I get parts from unipart can I get the same >manufacturer (lockheed or girling, etc.) as from the LR parts ? Yes, but these items are quite reasonable from the LR parts dept, at least for my '79 - they have slashed the prices of some parts for older vehicles and you may be pleasantly surprised. San Francisco: ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ I'm going to be out there 13, 14 and 15 this month. Do we have any members? I met Dixon the last time I went to Canada and really appreciated him showing me around for an evening. Some of you may recognise me from the list from a year or two back (Hi!), maybe I'll get round to posting a summary for others to read. Cheers, Steve. (ex V8 lightweight, presently '79RR) From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Nov 2 09:42:18 1994 To: lro From: John Hong/C/HQ/3Com Date: 2 Nov 94 7:49:14 EDT Subject: IBEX is sharp!! Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain Status: RO X-Status: I saw one at the Derbyshire rally last year - I'd coin the word "pragmaTECH" to describe it. Space age looking yet very accessible. Fit and finish were superb. Minimal overhangs with a very clean exterior - nothing unnecessary poking out where it could get torn off scrubbing through brush. No joke about new panels from any sheet metal shop - the balance between ease of fabrication and esthetics was brilliant IMHO. On the home front, my beastie is running good again - sigh! Life is good. I really would like to do the frame up thing soon though - I'd be interested in hearing from any folks who have rented "self storage" space (or other rental space) for this task. John From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Nov 2 06:31:14 1994 Date: Wed, 2 Nov 1994 07:22:54 -0500 (EST) From: "Hal A. Lightwood" Subject: Washing a LR? To: lro X-Envelope-To: lro@team.net Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Mime-Version: 1.0 Status: RO X-Status: Is it out of the question to try and make my LR a litle cleaner looking? Or is this against some sort of code? Every LR I have seen seems to look like it was never washed, painted or cleaned whatsoever. The guy that my father bought his LR from said he had never washed it, and had never been washed before to his knowledge. My father never washed it for the 15 years he had it, and now that he has given it to me, I feel as though I shouldn't break this tradition. Is this a common? Do Land Rovers every get washed? Hal A. Lightwood From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Nov 2 06:37:39 1994 Date: Wed, 2 Nov 1994 07:28:22 -0500 (EST) From: "Hal A. Lightwood" Subject: Clutch/Gear Problem To: lro X-Envelope-To: lro@team.net Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Mime-Version: 1.0 Status: RO X-Status: I have a problem with my Clutch and/or gearbox. I cannot put it in reverse unless I first put it in 3rd or 4th first. If I don't do this it will make a terrible grind before it grudgingly slips in. This is also starting to happen occasionally when I put it in 2nd. I don't use first, due to the fact there is a tooth missing (or two). Could this occur due to the clutch plate being worn down? Or possibly the slave fluid leaking? It does leak and I have to keep it topped up all the time. Also, does anybody have a spare SeriesIII gearbox or misc gears for one? I need to replace that gear with the broken tooth. Hal A. Lightwood From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Nov 2 08:18:17 1994 From: dkenner@emr.ca (Dixon Kenner) Subject: Re: Washing a LR? To: halightw@FLASH.LakeheadU.CA (Hal A. Lightwood) Date: Wed, 2 Nov 1994 09:11:10 -0500 (EST) Cc: lro@stratus.com In-Reply-To: from "Hal A. Lightwood" at Nov 2, 94 07:22:54 am Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1526 Status: RO X-Status: > Is it out of the question to try and make my LR a litle cleaner looking? > Or is this against some sort of code? Every LR I have seen seems to look > like it was never washed, painted or cleaned whatsoever. The guy that my > father bought his LR from said he had never washed it, and had never been > washed before to his knowledge. My father never washed it for the 15 > years he had it, and now that he has given it to me, I feel as though I > shouldn't break this tradition. Is this a common? Do Land Rovers every > get washed? While some might regard those that wash a Land Rover as a Philistine, there are parts of a Land Rover that you should wash with great diligence. Happily for all of us, the areas that should be washed are not easily visible to the great unwashed masses, because as we all know, our Land Rovers look far better covered in mud than they do all prettied up. So where to clean... Clean the frame thoroughly after every mud run. Use a pressure washer on the frame if you have one. Leaving mud and dirt on the frame will just create nice pockets of moisture to attract rust, and later holes, in the frame. While you are at it, wash off the wiring loom where it appears in the fenders, above the rear cross member etc. The older looms have a woven covering on them. Keeping it wet only reduces life expectancy. Basically there is a need to wash the Land Rover, but only in the areas that matter and were it doesn't affect the look of the vehicle. Rgds, Dixon From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Nov 2 08:36:17 1994 From: Mike Rooth Subject: Re: Clutch/Gear Problem To: halightw@FLASH.LakeheadU.CA (Hal A. Lightwood) Date: Wed, 2 Nov 94 14:33:15 GMT Cc: lro@transfer.stratus.com In-Reply-To: ; from "Hal A. Lightwood" at Nov 2, 94 7:28 am Status: RO X-Status: Hal, On the basis of "cheapest first" I'd replace the slave cylinder.It certainly IMO would produce the effect you describe.Mine did,but then mines a 11A with the halfsynchro box,and I cant remember off hand whether the 111 box has synchro on reverse as well. As for washing,as Andy Woodward remarked puzzle the Yuppies at the high pressure hose wash......get out and get it clean underneath, bugger the top,it wont rust(but *they* dont know). Cheers Mike Rooth From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Nov 1 04:33:25 1994 From: LANDROVER@delphi.com Date: Tue, 01 Nov 1994 02:12:35 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Re: Tom Coren... coming to the Last Gasp To: PREID@csi.compuserve.com, lro@team.net X-Vms-To: INTERNET"PREID@csi.compuserve.com" X-Vms-Cc: INTERNET"lro@team.net" Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Status: RO X-Status: Last Gasp Rally???? R.P. Reid asks Tom... > > Tom: > > I saw by your sig that you were in VA. You coming to the Last Gasp Rally in W> > . > Va on the 11-12 November? > > Is anyone from the list going? > Where is it??? Inquiring minds want to know.... Cheers Michael Loiodice E-MAIL landrover@delphi.com 166 W.Fulton St. VOICE (518) 773-2697 Gloversville NY, 12078 1972 Ser III 88 Petrol (Fern) From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Nov 1 01:15:14 1994 From: LANDROVER@delphi.com Date: Tue, 01 Nov 1994 02:12:49 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Re: High-wattage reverse lights, gea To: dushinrg@pr.cyanamid.com, lro@team.net X-Vms-To: INTERNET"dushinrg@pr.cyanamid.com" X-Vms-Cc: INTERNET"lro@team.net" Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Status: RO X-Status: Russell is suddenly concerned about what is behind him...... > > > > As an alternative, you could check out your local Central Tractor (or > > whatever similar agricultural store) and pick up a tractor flood light. > > Mount the bugger up high on the back somewhere. Tons of light! > > > Hmm....sounds like just what Nigel needs......along with a toggle > switch, of course (since I don't *think* I have a built in reverse > light switch I'll have to go "manual"). When did LR's come through > with reverse lights, I wonder? Gheeze, I don't even think I have > a license plate illumination device on daNige......life was just so > easy in those days....... > I'm not sure of the year but I suspect the late Ser IIa's probably had to have reverse lights for the US market. No plate lamp?? How old *is* Nigel anyway?? > .....and a horn, too, mounted on the column (but the switch is busted > and I have to connect two wires together to warn oncomers) > And here I thought you had some guy with a red flag walking 20 feet in front of you.... :) Cheers Michael Loiodice E-MAIL landrover@delphi.com 166 W.Fulton St. VOICE (518) 773-2697 Gloversville NY, 12078 1972 Ser III 88 Petrol (Fern) From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Nov 2 10:23:52 1994 From: ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Subject: digests of past LRO dialog... To: lro@transfer.stratus.com (Land-Rover-Owners FORUM) Date: Wed, 2 Nov 1994 10:14:25 -0600 (CST) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1315 Status: RO X-Status: I have posted this offer here before, but there are several new people on the LRO list. If you have FTP capability, old LRO "digests" are available for aquisition and late-nite browsing: Ray Harder *********************************************************************** ** anonymous ftp notes -- note this works, other methods should too. ** *********************************************************************** NOTE: Digests 92.8 thru 93.10 were collected by Mark Grieshaber and shared with me. Digests 93.10 (late) thru current were collected by Ray Harder. Obtaining LRO digests procedure: -- change to the proper directory on the receiving machine. -- issue the ftp command -- "ftp lulu.cc.missouri.edu". -- at the prompt, the user is anonymous and the password is anything, but the convention is the sender's user/node. -- have ftp cd to the LRO subdirectory -- "cd pub/lro" -- change to the proper directory on the receiving machine (if you didn't do it above -- "lcd Mail" (for example). -- issue the "mget *" ftp command to transfer the files. -- issue the "quit" ftp subcommand. -- Use your mailer to browse the files or print them for late night enjoyment. -- enjoy. *********************************************************************** From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Nov 2 11:00:01 1994 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 2 Nov 1994 10:46:22 -0600 To: lro@transfer.stratus.com From: hiner@mail.utexas.edu (Greg Hiner) Subject: Re: Clutch/Gear Problem Status: RO X-Status: >I have a problem with my Clutch and/or gearbox. I cannot put it in >reverse unless I first put it in 3rd or 4th first. If I don't do this >it will make a terrible grind before it grudgingly slips in. This is also >starting to happen occasionally when I put it in 2nd. I don't use first, >due to the fact there is a tooth missing (or two). Could this occur due to >the clutch plate being worn down? Or possibly the slave fluid leaking? It >does leak and I have to keep it topped up all the time. > I have a question that might pertain to this and pardon if I show some ignorance here. Is there a possibilty for movement to be transfered from the engine to the gearbox even if the clutch is working properly? Does the tip of the shaft coming out of the front of the gearbox turn in a pilot bush at the center of the flywheel? I seem to remember something like that from when I had the engine out. And if something got screwed with that bush could there be some torque transfered even though the clutch was working properly? I have the same problem as above but not all the time. I have a new clutch master and a good slave. Any thought on the above . . .? Greg From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Nov 2 10:54:32 1994 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 2 Nov 1994 10:46:24 -0600 To: lro@transfer.stratus.com From: hiner@mail.utexas.edu (Greg Hiner) Subject: New Range Rover Status: RO X-Status: I was looking at a picture of the new Range Rover and much to my surprise I realized that one of my favorite oil leaking/seal eating areas is gone - no swivel pin housings. The new Range Rover has the same axle set up one sees on the American 4x4s or at least that is how it appears. (I believe that Rovers used to have fully floating axles and now they are just semi-floating - is that a correct technical term?) Also the diff pumpkins are no longer off set to the right but are now off set to the left. I guess this marks the end of some of the parts swaping that can go on between Rovers (that is if my assumption that the 90/110/RR shared some of the same axles is correct). Greg From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Nov 2 11:01:13 1994 To: lro@team.net From: azw@aber.ac.uk (Andy Woodward) Subject: Uniprat bits Date: Wed, 2 Nov 1994 16:54:51 UNDEFINED Status: RO X-Status: /Now for you UK folk - If I get parts from unipart can I get the same /manufacturer (lockheed or girling, etc.) as from the LR parts ? I noticed the /slave was lockheed, which is what I could have gotten for half that at /the local parts store (which I can walk to from work). Cant say explicitly about brake parts, but I needed a headlight unit, adn went to the local Landrover place, which also dealt with Rover adn hence Uniprat. After teh traditional 1/2 hour wait while all teh staff wandered around pretending to be busy, the bloke at teh counter tells me that teh LR unit is exactly the same part as teh Uniprat bit for a Mini - you just pay 3 times teh price to get it wrapped up in a Landrover box. Guess what I bought. +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Just another roadkill on the Information Superhighway +++++++++++++++++++++++ None-%er #1 +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Nov 2 11:33:01 1994 Date: Wed, 2 Nov 94 09:25:10 -0800 From: "TeriAnn Wakeman" Reply-To: "TeriAnn Wakeman" To: halightw@FLASH.LakeheadU.CA, lro@apple.com, lro@team.net Subject: Re: Washing a LR? Status: RO X-Status: In message "Hal A. Lightwood" writes: > > Is it out of the question to try and make my LR a litle cleaner looking? > Or is this against some sort of code? Every LR I have seen seems to look > like it was never washed, painted or cleaned whatsoever. The guy that my > father bought his LR from said he had never washed it, and had never been > washed before to his knowledge. My father never washed it for the 15 > years he had it, and now that he has given it to me, I feel as though I > shouldn't break this tradition. Is this a common? Do Land Rovers every > get washed? > Mine gets washed. Anytime it gets into salty water or beach sand, I take it to a car wash and spray the frame & underside of the car. Whenever the Land Rover is filled with manure, garbage, or livestock, it gets parked facing uphill afterwards. The tail gate gets dropped and the bed hosed out. Just before I go to a British car field meet in the Land Rover, she gets a complete cleaning inside & out. She likes to present herself as best as possible to the British car public. It gives me a chance to get up on the roof and scrape off the moss and lichens growing up there, and to evict the spiders from inside the car. So she normally gets a complete scrubbing down just before the Portland All British Field meet and a quick hose down just before the Palo Alto all British field meet the following Sunday. I don't see the point in keeping a car dirty just for the sake of it being dirty. TeriAnn Wakeman Large format photographers look at the world twakeman@apple.com upside down and backwards LINK: TWAKEMAN 408-974-2344 TR3A - TS75519L, MGBGT - GHD4U149572G, Land Rover 109 - 164000561 From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Nov 2 11:51:03 1994 From: "Mugele, Gerry" To: LRO Subject: Can I join in? Date: Wed, 02 Nov 94 09:44:00 PST Encoding: 8 TEXT Status: RO X-Status: Hey! I'm one of the Land Rover afflicted; owned a total of 3 of the beasts for the last 25 years. Got a new 88 in '69 and sold it to another British Hardware fan in '77...he still has it. Had a 67 88 pickup for a couple years but it was too much of maintenance hog. Bought my current '72 88 in '77....and love it dearly. Gerry Mugele From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Nov 2 12:18:36 1994 From: LANDROVER@delphi.com Date: Wed, 02 Nov 1994 13:06:59 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Re: Washing a LR? To: halightw@FLASH.LakeheadU.CA, lro@team.net X-Vms-To: INTERNET"halightw@FLASH.LakeheadU.CA" X-Vms-Cc: INTERNET"lro@team.net" Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Status: RO X-Status: Hal ponders the age old question.... > Is it out of the question to try and make my LR a litle cleaner looking? - snip - > washed before to his knowledge. My father never washed it for the 15 > years he had it, and now that he has given it to me, I feel as though I > shouldn't break this tradition. Is this a common? Do Land Rovers every > get washed? > Well Hal, the truth of the matter is... We only wash the part that matters... What is underneath the beast! Maybe, occasionally a sprinkling of water on the windscreen.. just so you can see out of the encrusted grime. To paraphrase a saying "A clean Land Rover is the sign of a sick mind!" Now Maloney... no comments on how I apply this philosophy to the critters in my beard!!! Cheers Michael Loiodice E-MAIL landrover@delphi.com 166 W.Fulton St. VOICE (518) 773-2697 Gloversville NY, 12078 1972 Ser III 88 Petrol (Fern) From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Nov 2 12:16:17 1994 To: azw@aber.ac.uk (Andy Woodward) Cc: lro@team.net Subject: Re: Cheapo 90 chassis In-Reply-To: Your message of "Tue, 01 Nov 1994 19:16:20 -0400." Date: Wed, 02 Nov 1994 09:36:04 -0800 From: Mike Fredette Status: RO X-Status: Andy and others write: //because there is no demand.And Dixon is right,I'm afraid.Given his //conditions,and ours,the modern chassis just dont last as long.There //is some *very* funny steel about.There are already articles on putting //new rear ends on young 90 and 110 models.Not for nothing was the phrase //"British Racing Rust"coined!If there are two things our climate is //famous for its the ability to rust,and the incidence of arthritis. / /A freind of mine who was a Warden for Newborough Desert nature reserve took /his 90 on teh beach regularly as part of his job. The chassis fell in two in /teh middle inside a year!!!!!!!!! Not impressed. / /Having said that, My 90 is 10 years old, gets Waxoyled all over the outside of /teh chassis every year (takes about 15 minutes) adn all over the inside every /5 (no idea how long cos I get it done by someone with e HIGH pressure /injector...). There is NO rust on it other than a few superficial flakes - /even on teh outriggers. If you see some, you just spray a bit on from a plant /sprayer carried round for the purpose, adn bingo - no further problem. My questions are these. First, is there anyone across the pond who KNOWS for a fact, that the steel currently used in Land Rover frames is inferior to that used in the older Series vehicles. And in what way is it inferior, ie what exactly is it that makes it supposedly rust faster than the older stuff. It's still the same gauge, ie just as thick, and with the wax injection now used, "should" I say SHOULD last even longer than the old rigs. At this point, all I've heard is just rumour and heresay that the British steel is not what it used to be. Perhaps someone has a connection with a bloke at one of the steel mills who could tell us that, "yes we have changed the alloy of the steel to an inferior grade that will rust faster but what the hell, it costs us less to make." OK, next question. Did the friend who regularly drove his Defender on the beach ever take the time to clean it afterwards. I would venture to say that no vehicle, old Land Rover, or new, can stand constant exposure to that kind of environment without some corrosion problems. And if no preventive measures were taken, washing to remove the salt, oiling to prevent further corrosion, then of course his frame would rust through. No rocket science required. Last question is regarding the Defender suspension. In the US, in order to evade an import tarrif on import SUV's, Land Rover I HEARD had put heavier rear springs on the D90 to raise the gross vehicle weight above the cutoff margin of 6000 pounds. I asked a few folks at the dealer and Rover's North and they tentatively confirmed this saying this was the reason for the stiffness and slight loss of articulation, and that the anti-sway bar had a negligable effect. Ie; removing it would not improve the articulation much. I was told that if I put on some "standard" rear coils, presto, a nice supple suspension would be mine. Well, I ordered a set of "standard" springs, and started in, removing the left rear first. You can see where this is going right? It was the same as the "standard" one I had standing by to replace it with. And the funny thing is, Rover's North has a set of "heavy duty" coils listed below these "standard" models. So, are the "standard" rear coils in the UK and elsewhere of a lighter spring rate than those used in the US? If so, what is the proper Land Rover part number to look for. The ones listed here are NRC9448 and NRC9449 for "standard", NRC9462 and NRC9463 for "heavy duty". The reason for all this blabbering is that on some trails, I'm lifting an axle where I previously did not in my Series lll. Comments please. Rgds Mike Fredette 94 Defender 90 From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Nov 2 12:00:23 1994 Date: Wed, 2 Nov 94 09:47:35 -0800 From: "TeriAnn Wakeman" Reply-To: "TeriAnn Wakeman" To: halightw@FLASH.LakeheadU.CA, lro@apple.com, lro@team.net Subject: Re: Clutch/Gear Problem Status: RO X-Status: In message "Hal A. Lightwood" writes: > > I have a problem with my Clutch and/or gearbox. I cannot put it in > reverse unless I first put it in 3rd or 4th first. If I don't do this > it will make a terrible grind before it grudgingly slips in. This is also > starting to happen occasionally when I put it in 2nd. I don't use first, > due to the fact there is a tooth missing (or two). Could this occur due to > the clutch plate being worn down? Or possibly the slave fluid leaking? It > does leak and I have to keep it topped up all the time. > > Also, does anybody have a spare SeriesIII gearbox or misc gears for one? I > need to replace that gear with the broken tooth. > > Hal A. Lightwood > > Your clutch is not completely releasing. Most likely cause is air in your clutch hydrolic system. Its a bear to bleed unless you do a power bleed. Air normally gets into the system because the fluid is leaking past the seal in your slave cylinder. You might consider this an oppertunity to look over the system and check out the mechanicals as well. The rod needs to be properly adjusted, as well as the pedal part up top. The lower mechanical linkage pins can wear & holes can elongate. The lower mechanical clutch linkage on my LR was so badly worn than it took up almost 1-1/2 inches of pedal travel. If yours are badly worn, parts are cheapish & will restore that area to new. There is a collar with a pin at each end that transmits the rotation to the clutch plate. If one of those pins is starting to shear, it would add a lot of slop. Generally a good pressure plate and hydrolics can make up for badly worn mechanicals. But badly work mechanicals will make weak hydrolics noticable very quickly. I would look at the slave cylinder for any signs of leakage before bleeding. If you see it, pick up a new Gurling unit or have the old one resleaved. They never seem to be long term reliable after rebuilding. Be careful not to over tighten the threaded connections. The cylinder will strip easily & use new copper seals. gravity bleeding never seems to get all the air out of the system. TeriAnn Wakeman Large format photographers look at the world twakeman@apple.com upside down and backwards LINK: TWAKEMAN 408-974-2344 TR3A - TS75519L, MGBGT - GHD4U149572G, Land Rover 109 - 164000561 From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Nov 2 13:01:49 1994 From: dkenner@emr.ca (Dixon Kenner) Subject: November LRO To: lro@stratus.com Date: Wed, 2 Nov 1994 13:52:43 -0500 (EST) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 175 Status: RO X-Status: Amazing, an LRO the month before the cover date. Got the November LRO on Monday. A first! Now to see what is contained in this issue that will be of interest. Rgds, From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Nov 2 13:16:48 1994 To: lro@team.net From: azw@aber.ac.uk (Andy Woodward) Subject: Re: Cheapo 90 chassis Date: Wed, 2 Nov 1994 19:13:06 UNDEFINED Status: RO X-Status: >OK, next question. Did the friend who regularly drove his Defender on the beach >ever >take the time to clean it afterwards. I would venture to say that no vehicle, >old Land >Rover, or new, can stand constant exposure to that kind of environment without >some >corrosion problems. And if no preventive measures were taken, washing to remove >the salt, >oiling to prevent further corrosion, then of course his frame would rust >through. No rocket >science required. No, course not. It was a company vehicle...... But even so, that's a lot quicker Hara-kiri than you would expect from a Landrover in those conditions. Lots of Series 3s have been abused much worse for much longer (e.g. coastguard vehicles). +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Just another roadkill on the Information Superhighway +++++++++++++++++++++++ None-%er #1 +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Nov 2 15:43:27 1994 From: /G=Hui/S=Ben/OU2=IL02M/OU=ILBH/P=MOT/A=MOT/C=US/@email.mot.com Date: 2 Nov 94 15:36:54 -0600 To: land-rover-owner@stratus.com Subject: HEADLINES "ROVER PLUNGES OVER CLIFF" Status: RO X-Status: Over the weekend a group of youths were up in the whisler area(north of vancouver b.c., canada) having fun in snow on one of the thousands of logging roads in b.c. nothing really particular with the exception that they were driving a lwb landrover. as the story goes they were turning around on this single lane logging road and the driver accidentally went over the cliff!!!. 100meters straight down, 300 feet. 5 people in the truck flipping all over. when they landed in the bushes below one girl walked away with only scratches, the driver had a broken leg and arm. and well the other three didnt make it. call it a miracle that anyone survived, maybe its because of the rover?? i really wonder how well they may of faired if they were in jeep. From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Nov 2 16:42:22 1994 Date: Thu, 3 Nov 94 09:35:03 +1100 From: lloyd@bruce.cs.monash.edu.au (Lloyd Allison) To: lro@team.net Subject: new subscriber, let's see if this works Status: RO X-Status: speedo's - I had one seize many years ago at 80K miles. the little shaft carrying the finger that pokes the numbers round seized and the drive cable twisted itself to pieces. It was relatively easy to dismantle, clean, lubricate and reassemble. synthetic oil - I have heard (so this is at least 3rd hand) that once using synthetic oil, you should not revert to non-synthetic oil. I have also read that the Army Perentie 110's use Castrol FMX in the transfer case (original RR transfer case with some mod's). lastly, I am looking for images of Land-Rovers for a world wide web page, esp' series 2 and 2A, and anything "special" or rare such as Fwd Control, light-weight, conversions, ... I have a scanner but please don't send photographs without discussing it via email first! From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Nov 2 17:53:50 1994 Date: Wed, 2 Nov 1994 18:50:19 -0500 (EST) From: Gregory Brown To: caloccia@sw.stratus.com Cc: Land Rover Messages to Digest Subject: RR Clutch Master Cylinder Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Status: RO X-Status: Bill, one of two things maybe wrong. Either you still have air in the system, hydraulic clutches are a pain in the a.. (is this digest sensored?), or your seal to the reservoir is bad. I am not familiar with the design of the RR clutch master but the series master has an end seal that keeps fluid from going back into the reservoir. In the RR case, if it is designed like a brake master cylinder, the seal crosses a port that leads to the reservoir and thus seals off the reservoir so pressure can build. In this design a second seal is used to keep reservoir fluid from leaking out by the pushrod. Anyway try bleeding the unit again, if it still creeps in to engagment rebuild of replace. Greg Brown 71 Series IIA 88 From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Nov 2 18:48:36 1994 From: Russell Burns Subject: Re: November LRO To: dkenner@emr.ca (Dixon Kenner) Date: Wed, 2 Nov 94 16:43:01 PST Cc: lro@stratus.com In-Reply-To: <9411021852.AA06135@emr1.emr.ca>; from "Dixon Kenner" at Nov 2, 94 1:52 pm Status: RO X-Status: I think they ship two months issues at the same time. Any thing to make a buck. Russ > > > Amazing, an LRO the month before the cover date. Got the November > LRO on Monday. A first! Now to see what is contained in this issue > that will be of interest. > > Rgds, > > From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Fri Nov 4 07:44:44 1994 From: LANDROVER@delphi.com Date: Thu, 03 Nov 1994 01:45:09 -0500 (EST) Subject: Re: Clutch/Gear Problem To: halightw@FLASH.LakeheadU.CA, lro@team.net X-Vms-To: INTERNET"halightw@FLASH.LakeheadU.CA" X-Vms-Cc: INTERNET"lro@team.net" Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Status: RO X-Status: Hal writes... > I have a problem with my Clutch and/or gearbox. I cannot put it in > reverse unless I first put it in 3rd or 4th first. If I don't do this > it will make a terrible grind before it grudgingly slips in. This is also > starting to happen occasionally when I put it in 2nd. I don't use first, > due to the fact there is a tooth missing (or two). Could this occur due to > the clutch plate being worn down? Or possibly the slave fluid leaking? It > does leak and I have to keep it topped up all the time. > OK.. You say you do have a leak in the hydraulics.. So chances are very good that you are not getting enough travel out of your slave cylinder to disengage the clutch - and grind-grind-grind you go. At the very least, you need to rebuild the master and/or the slave cylinder. For a bit more money (and a better chance of long-term success) go for a new master & slave. Order them from someplace in England. Even with air shipment, they will be cheaper than buying just a slave cylinder from somewhere in the US. A word of caution.. Use Castrol brake fluid ONLY!! Everyone has horror stories about using the wrong kind of fluid and screwing up the seals. Adjustments.. With a Ser III the only adjustments you have are on the master cylinder. The important one is for the pushrod clearance. With the clutch pedal all the way up you should have about 1/16" clearance between the pushrod and the cylinder piston. There are two nuts on the pushrod, one on either side of the top end of the clutch pedal. If you pull off the master to rebuild or replace it, you'll be removing one of the nuts. Take note of it's relative position and start from there for the adjustment when you re-assemble it all. Oh yeah, the adjustment allows a secondary valve in the cylinder to close properly - otherwise you would never be able to pump fluid properly. Worn parts - I think TeriAnne covered that well enough although I believe she was referring to a IIa and not a III. The principals the same, either way. When you pull your tranny to replace it or rebuild it take a good look at the throwout lever and it's pivot points. I've heard the pushrod from the slave can wear down (shorten) but I don't know how long it's supposed to be. > Also, does anybody have a spare SeriesIII gearbox or misc gears for one? I > need to replace that gear with the broken tooth. A couple of days ago, someone posted a message and said they had a Ser III tranny for sale - $175 I think. But, of course I deleted the message so I can't tell you who. Anyone know?? Cheers Michael Loiodice E-MAIL landrover@delphi.com 166 W.Fulton St. VOICE (518) 773-2697 Gloversville NY, 12078 1972 Ser III 88 Petrol (Fern) From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Nov 3 02:23:58 1994 Via: uk.ac.edinburgh.castle; Thu, 3 Nov 1994 08:21:52 +0000 From: Mr Ian Stuart Organization: Vet-lab,The Univ of Edinburgh To: lro@team.net Date: Thu, 3 Nov 1994 08:21:14 +0000 Subject: *December* LRW Priority: normal Status: RO X-Status: Wow! December LRW was waiting for me when I got home! This is 3 days before it hits the shelves here in the UK. ----** Ian Stuart (Computing Officer) +44 31 650 6205 Royal (Dick) School of Veterinary Studies, Edinburgh University. WWW sites: Work -- Play -- #======================================================================# I'm not a computing nerd, I'm a computing geek. |Land Rover owners do Geeks are much higher up the evolutionary chain. | it in the mud. From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Nov 2 17:22:41 1994 From: "Jurgen Klus" Organization: Flinders University of S.Aust. To: LRO@TEAM.NET Date: Thu, 3 Nov 1994 09:42:06 GMT-0930 Subject: EFI Snorkels Priority: normal Status: RO X-Status: Introducing an air intake, or snorkel, to an EFI RR or Discovery is not a real problem, but it needs to be tackled with some thought as to how the system works. The EFI electronics is expecting an air intake system of a specific length. Now, it doesn't measure it itself, does it? What the system is interested in is the apparent length of the intake, that is, its apparent wavelength. Therefore, the snorkel, as opposed to a bit of exhaust pipe cut and bent to fit, must achieve the same wavelength as the electronics is expecting. Any deviation from that will result in the electronics throwing up. TJM in Austalia has a snorkel for the Discovery 3.5 ltr V8i engine. I assume that a retailer or manufacturer where you live sells them to. Of course, if you have a diesel, it doesn't give a damn what length anything is, just so long as it gets plenty of air. (Reminds me of some women I know, oops, I shouldn't have said that, sorry!) That's my thoughts, anyway. Jurgen Klus Tel 618 201 2413 Fax 618 201 3877 When the going gets tough..the tough get Land Rover! From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Nov 3 08:54:26 1994 Date: Thu, 3 Nov 1994 14:47:34 GMT From: kjartan@ejs.is (Kjartan) To: land-rover-owner@stratus.com Subject: Foers Ibex Status: RO X-Status: There was a discussion a couple of days ago regarding the Foers IBEX and I just remembered what a hardtop IBEX looks like and want one, at least at the moment B^). Does anyone have information on: prices for the 110 in.four door hardtop, implications of using Range Rover parts, whats included like electrics, darhboard, seats etc. . fax number at Foers. etc... Thanks. Kjartan Bergsson Iceland (85' RR, 2door, auto, 33x12.5x15 tires.) kjartan@ejs.is From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Nov 3 09:10:40 1994 From: Russell Burns Subject: New Defender 90 To: lro@stratus.com Date: Thu, 3 Nov 94 7:02:55 PST Status: RO X-Status: Well I have a new commuter vehicle. It is going to take a some work to get the noise level down to usable levels. I have already raised the seat 1.5" for more leg room, and even my wife who is only 5' thinks this is a great improvment. To reduce the noise I am hoping the following will help. 1: Hardtop. If LRNA can ever deliver it. 2: Less aggresive tires maybe AT instead of the BF Goodrich MT that are installed. 3: Sound deading materials on the bed, and doors. About 90 frames. Does any one know what this factory wax junk injected into the frame feels like. The inside of both the RR, and the 90 frames feel like bare metal to me... And onto transmissions.. Since this was a demo model it came with the older transmission, the LT77s(?), and not the RS380(?). after brousing through the owners manual I noticed the Transmission fluid was ATF fluid. Is this the proper fluid for older LT77s(?) transmissions? Also in the manual it states "after washing the vehicle, inspect the paint for damage" ( I told you washing ruins the paint). Well hopefuly with a hardtop, and a little work I will be able to survive my 100 mile a day commute.. Russ From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Nov 3 09:10:55 1994 From: Russell Burns Subject: large tires To: kjartan@ejs.is (Kjartan) Date: Thu, 3 Nov 94 7:06:14 PST Cc: lro@stratus.com In-Reply-To: <199411031447.OAA01614@soho.ejs.is>; from "Kjartan" at Nov 3, 94 2:47 pm Status: RO X-Status: Kjartan, How do those 33x12.5x15 tires work? Did You have to make any modifications to your RR for clearance? Russ 91 RR 94 90 > > There was a discussion a couple of days ago regarding the Foers IBEX and I just remembered what a hardtop IBEX looks like and want one, at least at > the moment B^). > Does anyone have information on: > prices for the 110 in.four door hardtop, > implications of using Range Rover parts, > whats included like electrics, darhboard, seats etc. . > fax number at Foers. > etc... > > Thanks. > Kjartan Bergsson > Iceland > (85' RR, 2door, auto, 33x12.5x15 tires.) > kjartan@ejs.is > From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Nov 3 09:58:52 1994 From: Mike Rooth Subject: Re: Flames for Ian Stuart & assorted BS To: maloney@wings.attmail.com (maloney) Date: Thu, 3 Nov 94 15:54:32 GMT Cc: lro@transfer.stratus.com In-Reply-To: ; from "maloney" at Nov 3, 94 10:59 am Status: RO X-Status: Okay,Maloney(sigh) let's begin....A,B,C........You,know,its called the ALPHABET.And all the little shapes are a *sound*.Now,"O" is for "Owner",and "W" is for "World".Go on,say it after me....Next lesson will be on the subject of proer joined-up writing..:-) So Ian got his Dec Land Rover WORLD.There is absolutely zilch chance of anyone getting the Land Rover Owner early.No way. Just to make your day,though,I got Land Rover World early too.From my newsagent.Delivered.Which was *really* surprising,because I hadnt ordered it.Are they trying to tell me something?I usually go round and buy it off the shelf.Looks like a bit of creative marketing to me. Worth having though,the best issue so far.Lots of Series Ones,article on the Brockhouse trailer,*another* new Editor that makes three so far,and an example of fast track promotion inasmuch as the staff writer taken on about five months ago is now Assistant Editor.So,William my boy, there's hope for you yet.Let the muse take hold(I should have a bath first) burst into purple prose,take the odd piccy,shove it in the post,and bingo, LRW's North American Asst Ed!The New World's answer to Pete Wilford. Or Marge Proops(look it up).Who's doing what to Who in the back of What. Brings a whole new dimension to approach and departure angles! Cheers Mike Rooth (Well,you cant be allowed a monopoly on Pampas Grass Fertiliser) From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Nov 3 09:11:58 1994 Date: Thu, 03 Nov 1994 10:59:14 -0500 From: maloney@wings.attmail.com (maloney) Phone: 201-564-2073 Subject: Flames for Ian Stuart & assorted BS To: LRO@stratus.com Cc: denis@oswego.Oswego.EDU Content-Type: Text Status: RO X-Status: Ian writes: >> ...bla bla bla bla I just go my December LRO bla bla bla... >> You really are annoying. :-) I just got my October issue last Friday :-(. I called Craddocks just after I got it to order that really cool Land Rover watch with the white face and they were all sold out. The fellow on the phone said they have no plans to produce any others (could this have anything with LR getting their panties in a bunch about other vendors using the LR name/logo?). Boy, it sure has been quiet lately. Waterbag, beer, babe, flames, or even "Disco, Defender, RR S#!+" messages would be welcome. Did anyone learn the name of that x-rated movie where the driver runs his Rover into a cliff and, as those British workshop manuals so quaintly put re waterpump replacement, "offers himself up" to his female passengers? Normally I would NEVER buy a disgusting piece of trash as this, but in this case I could make an exception (Was it in english? Subtitles?). While we're at it, does anyone know the issue of Playboy where the center "spread" was shot in the back of a soft top 88? I'd like to see if I could locate a back issue for my, er, Land Rover Library. A "whole lotta nothin" from Baloney Wayne, NJ USA maloney@wings.attmail.com From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Nov 3 10:11:58 1994 From: Mike Rooth Subject: Re: New Defender 90 To: burns@cisco.com (Russell Burns) Date: Thu, 3 Nov 94 16:05:58 GMT Cc: lro@transfer.stratus.com In-Reply-To: <199411031502.HAA29304@lint.cisco.com>; from "Russell Burns" at Nov 3, 94 7:02 am Status: RO X-Status: Russ, How did this factory wax thing start?I've never seen any reference to it outside this list.I'm not saying they *dont* do it,but I've never seen anywhere state they *do* either.Over here,its the first thing a caring owner does,bung the chassis full of Waxoyl,and give it a good going over outside,too,but I dodnt realise it was a factory process.Just curious Mike Rooth From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Nov 3 10:22:01 1994 To: lro@team.net From: azw@aber.ac.uk (Andy Woodward) Subject: Re: Washing a LR? Date: Thu, 3 Nov 1994 16:15:49 UNDEFINED Status: RO X-Status: /Is it out of the question to try and make my LR a litle cleaner looking? /Or is this against some sort of code? Every LR I have seen seems to look /like it was never washed, painted or cleaned whatsoever. The guy that my /father bought his LR from said he had never washed it, and had never been /washed before to his knowledge. My father never washed it for the 15 /years he had it, and now that he has given it to me, I feel as though I /shouldn't break this tradition. Is this a common? Do Land Rovers every /get washed? ON NO ACCOUNT WASH A LANDROVER!!!!!!!! They use a special detergent-soluble aluminium. The only way to make em last is to build up a protective layer of mud. Do not flout teh wisdom of generations. +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Just another roadkill on the Information Superhighway +++++++++++++++++++++++ None-%er #1 +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Nov 3 10:22:05 1994 To: lro@team.net From: azw@aber.ac.uk (Andy Woodward) Subject: Re: Washing a LR? Date: Thu, 3 Nov 1994 16:18:57 UNDEFINED Status: RO X-Status: / Clean the frame thoroughly after every mud run. Use a / pressure washer on the frame if you have one. Leaving mud and dirt Be very careful where you aim pressure washers. They can blast water past seals into places it really shouldnt be........... +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Just another roadkill on the Information Superhighway +++++++++++++++++++++++ None-%er #1 +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Nov 3 10:31:39 1994 To: lro@team.net From: azw@aber.ac.uk (Andy Woodward) Subject: Re: Washing lorries Date: Thu, 3 Nov 1994 16:24:46 UNDEFINED Status: RO X-Status: I suppose I should put teh flamethrower away for a few moments. I pressure wash mine ONCE A YEAR ONLY (in Autumn - before the salt season) to minimise possible damage to bearings due to water blast past seals. I do this on a dry day, so that nothing is kicked up from the road on teh way home. It is then parked till COMPLETLEY dry and then Waxoyled. It is then left untouched till next Autumn - except that whenever I am doing anything to the lorry - even checking the tyres, if I see any rust, I give it a squirt from a little plant sprayer filled with Waxoyl diluted with deisel to spray smoothly. Works for me. +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Just another roadkill on the Information Superhighway +++++++++++++++++++++++ None-%er #1 +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Nov 3 10:33:32 1994 To: lro@team.net From: azw@aber.ac.uk (Andy Woodward) Subject: Re: Washing lorries again (sorry) Date: Thu, 3 Nov 1994 16:31:07 UNDEFINED Status: RO X-Status: /possible to the British car public. It gives me a chance to get up on the /roof and scrape off the moss and lichens growing up there, and to evict the /spiders from inside the car. So she normally gets a complete scrubbing down I cant beleive you said that!!!! Scraping teh roof of lichens? WHre's your environmental awareness? Mine has a good garden going. The helps teh CO2 balance of teh atmosphere, adn aslo helps it blend with teh background better than teh base white when I'm bivouacing somewhere I shouldnt. The spiders are part of a balanced ecosystem. I love my spiders. I dont have problems with mosquitos when I'm sleeping in it. /I don't see the point in keeping a car dirty just for the sake of it being /dirty. No, you misunderstand, it should be dirty for the sake of laziness. Any time you get goes on teh mechanicals. +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Just another roadkill on the Information Superhighway +++++++++++++++++++++++ None-%er #1 +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Nov 3 10:40:16 1994 To: lro@team.net From: azw@aber.ac.uk (Andy Woodward) Subject: HEADLINES "ROVER PLUNGES OVER CLIFF" Date: Thu, 3 Nov 1994 16:37:44 UNDEFINED Status: RO X-Status: /100meters straight down, 300 feet. 5 people in the truck flipping all over. /whenthey landed in the bushes below one girl walked away with only scratches, /the driver had a broken leg and arm. and well the other three didnt make it. /call ita miracle that anyone survived, maybe its because of the rover?? i How much use are roll cages? I've seen an number of hartop SWBs on their roofs. They seem to sit there with their little wheels in teh air, looking all crestfallen till someone takes pity and pushes them back over.......... Always been in soft mud tho (we have a lot of that here.....) +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Just another roadkill on the Information Superhighway +++++++++++++++++++++++ None-%er #1 +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Nov 3 11:09:49 1994 From: Mike Rooth Subject: Fuel Thoughts To: lro@transfer.stratus.com Date: Thu, 3 Nov 94 17:04:17 GMT Status: RO X-Status: The recent thread on fuel prices worldwide prompted the following. A couple of weeks ago,on the weekly trog out to the supermarket, my wife (ever on the lookout for a bargain)pointed out that we had just passed(yeah,well,we all have 'em)a filling station with diesel at 47.9p per litre.So the next week I got filled up there. Its ELF fuel,French firm I think,and was adverised as reduced odour (SMELL,Maloney,means it dont pong),reduced emissions,more MPG etc. Well,the diesel smokes a littl;e less when hot,more when cold,seems to be a bit more economical,and the fuel certainly doesnt smell much at all.But.But.Its started spark throwing.Imagine a LNWR G7 0-8-0 doing thirty MPH with 500 tons trailing,transatlantic try a NYC Mowhawk with four times the load,uphill and you've got the picture. Much though I love the steam locomotive,I'm not sure I want the Land Rover to do a passable imitation of a badly drafted example. I think what is happening is that the fuel is decoking the bloody thing out of the exhaust pipe.Since I'm a firm beleiver in leaving a quarter inch of carbon round the piston periphery when decoking, to keep the seal,I dont think I'll continue with this brand,cheap or not.I dont think science has yet come forth with an additive that *will* leave me this carbon ring.And further,if a valve shuts(or trys to) on one of these lumps of carbon,that's my engine gone. Hasa anyone else had any odd experiences with modern so called hi-tech fuels? Cheers Mike Rooth From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Nov 3 11:17:32 1994 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 3 Nov 1994 11:04:51 -0600 To: lro@transfer.stratus.com From: hiner@mail.utexas.edu (Greg Hiner) Subject: Grade 8 hardware? Try Cat! Status: RO X-Status: I saw this note on the Brit list and I thought it might be of interest. Greg >From: TVRVixen@aol.com >Date: Thu, 3 Nov 1994 10:59:17 -0500 >Sender: TVRVixen@aol.com >To: british-cars@autox.team.net, M.I.N.I@supernet.ab.ca >Subject: Grade 8 hardware? Try Cat! > >Someone on the Brit-cars list stated that Grade 8 hardware quality is not >very consistant. > >>manufactured to a much higher standard than SAE grade 8 bolts. >>One can never be too sure about any SAE bolts >>(the standards are good, but adherance to them is poor). > >If you are interested, a great source of high quality nut, bolts and lock >washers at reasonable prices is you local Caterpillar dealer. They have a >catalog which list the sizes, threads, grip length, etc. and they should have >them all in stock. The lock washers are really great. Cat uses a minimum >Grade 8 bolt for everything, including holding on license plates. > >I also really like their "Liquid Gasket Material". It is a redish brown >color. Try a can while you are there. > >Maybe I am biased, or just experienced? I worked as a mechanic for a Cat >dealer for 7 years. > >Don From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Nov 3 14:53:21 1994 Via: uk.ac.edinburgh.castle; Thu, 3 Nov 1994 17:06:34 +0000 From: "Ian Stuart, Faculty" Organization: Vet-lab,The Univ of Edinburgh To: lro@team.net Date: Thu, 3 Nov 1994 17:06:15 +0000 Subject: "The sheer size and ..... look like toys" Priority: normal Status: RO X-Status: For those of you who get copies of LRW, T.F. Mills' article is published. Starts on page 58/59 and is very good. No picture of his 109, but check out the picture of the "caves" on page 63. An excellent article and some beautifull pictures! (Do you fancy comming over to do some of the SLROC events?) ----** Ian Stuart (Computing Officer) +44 31 650 6205 Royal (Dick) School of Veterinary Studies, Edinburgh University. WWW sites: Work -- http://www.vet.ed.ac.uk/ Play -- http://tardis.ed.ac.uk/~ian/ #======================================================================# I'm not a computing nerd, I'm a computing geek. |Land Rover owners do Geeks are much higher up the evolutionary chain. | it in the mud. From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Nov 3 19:43:51 1994 Date: Thu, 3 Nov 94 09:39:25 -0800 From: "TeriAnn Wakeman" Reply-To: "TeriAnn Wakeman" To: lro@stratus.com Subject: Tip from Scotty Status: RO X-Status: I was chatting with Scotty over the phone yesterday evening and he passed me a tip and asked that I forward it to the group. Back in the days when he ran a Land Rover authorized warrenty repair shop, he recieved a bulliton from Land Rover saying not to park Land Rovers facing down a steep hill. The primary input shaft on the front of the transmission does not have a regular oil seal. It instead has scrolling that activly pushes the oil back into the gear box when the Land Rover is tilted downward enough that the transmission oil level reaches the input shaft. This works well when the Land Rover is moving but does not work when the car is parked. Transmission oil will flow down along the shaft and go onto the clutch disk. Left facing a steep downhill long enough, the clutch can start slipping. The heat of the clutch will dry the oil and create a glaze that causes clutch jidder. He mentioned that a few clutch disks were replaced on warrentee because people parked regularly facing down hill on some of the San Francisco hills. I believe he said that the problem occures when the slope gets to be about 25 or 30 degrees. so a slight downhill slope is OK. If you park on a steep slope always aim the nose of your Land Rover uphill. TeriAnn Wakeman Large format photographers look at the world twakeman@apple.com upside down and backwards LINK: TWAKEMAN 408-974-2344 TR3A - TS75519L, MGBGT - GHD4U149572G, Land Rover 109 - 164000561 From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Nov 3 11:57:48 1994 From: "Russell G. Dushin" Subject: Re: Fuel Thoughts To: M.J.Rooth@lut.ac.uk (Mike Rooth) Date: Thu, 3 Nov 94 12:47:14 EST Cc: lro@team.net In-Reply-To: <9411031704.AA03169@hpc.lut.ac.uk>; from "Mike Rooth" at Nov 3, 94 5:04 pm Mailer: Elm [revision: 66.36.1.1] Status: RO X-Status: Mike Rooth asks: > Hasa anyone else had any odd experiences with modern so called > hi-tech fuels? I've seen them beat the piss outa the seals on a two stroke....and if you recall, dem's neccessary, else you suck air and tranny oil into the combustion chamber, thence sieze up good. My two stroke is more or less parked these days (it's in "appreciation mode") but a bro of mine runs a dozen or so (all on the road) on a regular basis (even in winter-and you thought *you* had a cold ride). He goes north for gasoline, just outa the "NY-metro area", where pollution control isn't a fad yet, to buy the good-'ol (but unleaded) stuff that just ain't available down here no more. rd/nige/'79 RD400F (the bro owns a fleet of late sixties/early seventies yamaha twins) From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Nov 3 12:14:13 1994 Date: Thu, 3 Nov 94 11:04:47 MST From: rhcaldw@nma.mnet.uswest.com ( ROY CALDWELL ) To: lro@stratus.com Subject: Engine not running! Status: RO X-Status: Well here is the story. My new engine won't run. This is the situation. Electrically things are fine, the plugs spark the points are set and open and close, the timing mark is correct with the 1 and 2 valves closed, fuel to the carb and the starter cranking. Yes the distributer drive dog is pointing at the no. 1 cylinder at TDC. When I try to start it, it for all the world sounds like it is trying to fire back through the carb. That would indicate that the time chain and cam are off. That has been checked several times. When I go to TDC the 1 and 2 valves are closed the distributer rotor is pointing dead at no. 1. What have I done wrong? There must be something! Help, help, please?? Roy - Rovers in the Rockies - Not under power yet, Damm! From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Nov 3 12:15:53 1994 To: Mike Rooth Cc: lro@transfer.stratus.com Subject: Re: New Defender 90 In-Reply-To: Your message of "Thu, 03 Nov 1994 16:05:58 GMT." <9411031605.AA20580@hpc.lut.ac.uk> Date: Thu, 03 Nov 1994 10:10:05 -0800 From: Mike Fredette Status: RO X-Status: Mike Rooth asks, Russ, How did this factory wax thing start?I've never seen any reference to it outside this list.I'm not saying they *dont* do it,but I've never seen anywhere state they *do* either.Over here,its the first thing a caring owner does,bung the chassis full of Waxoyl,and give it a good going over outside,too,but I dodnt realise it was a factory process.Just curious Well I've got a video from 1990 put out by Land Rover North America that details how to sell a Range Rover to a prospective sucker and in the video they have several shots of the factory. One of these shows and describes how the factory injects a hot paraffin wax solution into the frames for corrosion protection. So it's been going on at least since 1989 when the video was made, how long before that, if at all, is open to speculation. RGDS Mike Fredette 90 Range Rover 94 Defender prospective sucker From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Fri Nov 4 03:05:03 1994 Date: Thu, 3 Nov 94 10:28:15 -0800 From: "TeriAnn Wakeman" Reply-To: "TeriAnn Wakeman" To: azw@aber.ac.uk, lro@team.net Subject: Re: Washing lorries again (sorry) Status: RO X-Status: Andy, You build a solid case for maintaining the ecosystem...BUT I don't see any pride in going around looking as dirty and as unkept as you can. I let my 109 go as long as I do between washings because her paint is so bad that you would hardly notice, and there is no pavement where I live. If you let the dirt build up, your clothes would get dirty just coming in contact with the car. I like to be able to climb in & out without having to change clothes thank you. I am actually near to doing another unspeakable thang to my beloved 109..paint her. After my TR3 gets her new paint it will be the Land Rover's turn. I'm thinking of a nice bronze green with limestone top and wheels. Once she gets painted, she will recieve more regular washings and ....GASP waxings!! I don't use my car like Dixon and the other people who want to see if their car will survive drowning and being bashed against obsticals. Some times I have felt that I do not fit into this group because I am not constantly trying to find ways to see if I can break my Land Rover. My Land Rover has served faithfully as my farm lorrie for 14 years. Carying feed, livestock, manure, helping to string fence and other chores. She is now a semi-retired pensioner. She gets used to carry the dog about, and on Land Rover camping/photography trips. I try not to abuse her because I can't afford to have her broken at 14 thousand feet in the White montain country, or in the desert, or on a lonely strech of the coast. I want her to be able to bring me home. I take less chances with her because she worked hard for me over the years and I don't want to hurt her. She enjoys wading and climbing over hills, but we do it carefully. I don't see anything wrong with not wanting my Land Rover to look like a slob. She has shown up to a number of meets over the years being the car with the worst paint there. AT least she was clean. Hopefully a year from now she will be clean and have nice paint. My seat covers may be mostly duct tape over split nagrahyde, but at least I keep it reasonably clean. I guess I'm paying her back for all the work she has done for me over the years. I'm going to get around to installing a rear petrol tank and reinstalling the winch on the new bumper as thanks for getting me home from Portland with a broken layshaft and a nonfunctional chain tensioner caused by someone pouring dirt down her oil filler tube. There has been a number of threads about Land Rovers as a possible "Babe" magnet. Sorry guys, I don't know any women who would want to come into contact with a really dirty Land ROver unless she is dessed for the occasion and in a mood to get dirty. Just one woman's view, TeriAnn Wakeman Large format photographers look at the world twakeman@apple.com upside down and backwards LINK: TWAKEMAN 408-974-2344 TR3A - TS75519L, MGBGT - GHD4U149572G, Land Rover 109 - 164000561 From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Nov 3 12:15:19 1994 Date: Thu, 03 Nov 1994 13:30:19 -0500 From: maloney@wings.attmail.com (maloney) Phone: 201-564-2073 Subject: Flames For Ian & Other BS To: M.J.Rooth@lut.ac.uk, LRO@stratus.com, denis@oswego.Oswego.EDU Content-Type: Text Status: RO X-Status: Mike writes: >> Okay,Maloney(sigh) let's begin....A,B,C........You,know,its called the ALPHABET.And all the little shapes are a *sound*.Now,"O" is for "Owner",and "W" is for "World".Go on,say it after me....Next lesson will be on the subject of proer joined-up writing..:-) >> Mike, Thanks for the clarification. I feel much better now. Ben Smith and I had a conversation about you before he left for CA. We have a question. In all of the British shows we see on Public Television here, when the Brits go out in the yard or whatever, they are always wearing a jacket and tie (and usually a vest or sweater underneath). Even the farmers. It doesn't matter whether they are plowing fields, shovelling poop, or catching bull semen (Yup, I caught that episode of All Creatures. Very, Very funny). So our question is, do YOU put on your best duds to putter in the barnyard, deliver newborn cattle, or better yet, for changing the canister oil filter on your IIA? Inquiring netters want to know. Bill maloney@wings.attmail.com From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Nov 3 12:45:37 1994 To: rhcaldw@nma.mnet.uswest.com ( ROY CALDWELL ) Cc: lro@stratus.com, mfredett@ichips.intel.com Subject: Re: Engine not running! In-Reply-To: Your message of "Thu, 03 Nov 1994 11:04:47 MST." <9411031804.AA04228@mtnoca.helena_noc> Date: Thu, 03 Nov 1994 10:30:55 -0800 From: Mike Fredette Status: RO X-Status: roy Check first that your plug wires are routed to the proper cylinders. It sounds like they are not. Rgds Mike Fredette From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Nov 3 12:54:14 1994 Date: Thu, 3 Nov 1994 13:48:45 -0500 (EST) From: Steven M Denis Subject: Re: Flames for Ian Stuart & assorted BS To: maloney Cc: LRO@stratus.com In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Status: RO X-Status: Umm Bill? *I* happen to have a pristine copy of that ummmm "periodical" with the 88 soft top...(looks quite firm,actually..... 8-} ) I'll start the bidding at ummmmm a copy of Oct 90 Lro...the one with the picture of NOTAJEEP in it......Deal? (sorry Jan, sorry Jan, sorry TeriAnne....but it *is* a ummm "interresting use of a land rover.....) steve.......... "HEY! NICE JEEP,MISTER!"..........."Look,Kid,it's a ..Oh never mind..." "NOTAJEEP"-1967 109 Station Wagon Steven M. Denis " "-1957 107 Station Wagon PO Box 61 " "-1964 109 Pickup Erieville,New York USA " "_1967 109 NADA SW 13061 From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Nov 3 13:03:13 1994 Date: Thu, 03 Nov 1994 14:36:39 -0500 From: maloney@wings.attmail.com (maloney) Phone: 201-564-2073 Subject: Mike "Sparky" Rooth To: M.J.Rooth@lut.ac.uk, LRO@stratus.com, denis@oswego.Oswego.EDU Content-Type: Text Status: RO X-Status: Sparky gets food for his oilburner: >> Its ELF fuel,French firm I think,and was adverised as reduced odour (SMELL,Maloney,means it dont pong) >> HMMM... pong... sorry Mike, it wasn't in the American Heritage Dictionary and I don't speak or read English. No comprendo. Unless you meant "amore" instead of "odour", in which case "pong" could mean something entirely different. >> Well,the diesel smokes a littl;e less when hot,more when cold,seems to be a bit more economical,and the fuel certainly doesnt smell much at all.But.But.Its started spark throwing.Imagine a LNWR G7 0-8-0 doing thirty MPH with 500 tons trailing,transatlantic try a NYC Mowhawk with four times the load,uphill and you've got the picture. Much though I love the steam locomotive,I'm not sure I want the Land Rover to do a passable imitation of a badly drafted example. >> Oh, Oh, I think we've got a railhead here. Mike, folks pay good money on this side of the pond to make their vehicles spark. They put special hi-carbon skid plates underneath, lower the suspension, and shower loads of sparks going down the street. You got all the benefits without having to invest in any of the suspension mods. Seriously, it sounds like you may have major carbon build up in your combustion chambers and a little ELF in your tank might do your lump some good (must be quite a sight at night). Bored in Short Hills Bill maloney@wings.attmail.com From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Nov 3 13:45:53 1994 From: "Russell G. Dushin" Subject: Re: New LRs waxed? To: mfredett@ichips.intel.com (Mike Fredette) Date: Thu, 3 Nov 94 14:38:08 EST Cc: lro@team.net In-Reply-To: <9411031810.AA31919@pdx242.intel.com>; from "Mike Fredette" at Nov 03, 94 10:10 am Mailer: Elm [revision: 66.36.1.1] Status: RO X-Status: Mike Fredette writes: > > Mike Rooth asks, > > Russ, > How did this factory wax thing start?I've never seen any reference > to it outside this list.I'm not saying they *dont* do it,but I've > never seen anywhere state they *do* either.Over here,its the first > thing a caring owner does,bung the chassis full of Waxoyl,and give > it a good going over outside,too,but I dodnt realise it was a factory > process.Just curious > > > Well I've got a video from 1990 put out by Land Rover North > America that details how to sell a Range Rover to a prospective sucker > and in the video they have several shots of the factory. One of these > shows and describes how the factory injects a hot paraffin wax solution > into the frames for corrosion protection. So it's been going on at least > since 1989 when the video was made, how long before that, if at all, is > open to speculation. My friend's 110 (#5 of the 500) appeared to only have cosmoline on the frame when it arrived, although we never did peek within it. rd/nigel From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Nov 3 13:54:54 1994 Date: Thu, 3 Nov 1994 14:45:21 -0500 (EST) From: Jan Hilborn To: Steven M Denis Cc: maloney , LRO@stratus.com Subject: Re: Flames for Ian Stuart & assorted BS In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Status: RO X-Status: On Thu, 3 Nov 1994, Steven M Denis wrote: > > Umm Bill? *I* happen to have a pristine copy of that ummmm "periodical" > with the 88 soft top...(looks quite firm,actually..... 8-} ) > I'll start the bidding at ummmmm a copy of Oct 90 Lro...the one with the > picture of NOTAJEEP in it......Deal? > > (sorry Jan, sorry Jan, sorry TeriAnne....but it *is* a ummm "interresting > use of a land rover.....) don't apologize to me... I was editing the Rovers North newsletter when that particular ummm "periodical" got sent in for Land Rover sightings. And, no, i don't still have it (although it may still be around Rovers North) so don't start writing me silly poems to try and weasle it outa me. jan From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Nov 3 13:35:37 1994 Date: Thu, 03 Nov 1994 15:15:39 -0500 From: maloney@wings.attmail.com (maloney) Phone: 201-564-2073 Subject: Re: Engine Not Running To: LRO@stratus.com Content-Type: Text Status: RO X-Status: Roy, First check the firing order - 1-3-4-2 counterclockwise. Next try switching your wires, to make it 180 degrees out from what it is now. I realize you have done the proper timing checks but the firing through the carb sounds exactly like it being out 180. Give it a try, just for kicks. Bill maloney@wings.attmail.com From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Nov 3 18:34:47 1994 From: mtalbot@interserv.com Date: Thu, 3 Nov 1994 16:30:01 -0800 To: LRO@team.net Status: RO X-Status: All, Has anyone tackled the task of replacing the roof side window channels. Mine have so much #$%@ growing in then, its impossible to open the windows even a crack. I tried to remove one side and after bending and grinding out the old channels, destorying the retaining Alum side trim. I got the windows out alomg with the bottom retainer. Now to put them back, I know where to get the replacment channels, what about the aluminum lip that holds the lower retaining tray ???? Anyone offer any help. Rgds Mark From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Nov 3 23:29:35 1994 Date: Thu, 3 Nov 1994 21:28:08 -0800 (PST) From: Morgan Hannaford To: mtalbot@interserv.com Cc: LRO@team.net Subject: Re: your mail In-Reply-To: <199411040030.AA00265@interserv.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Status: RO X-Status: Yup, I messed with that about 3 months ago. I was tired of people saying I had a "chia-rover", regarding all the Bryophytes sprouting out of the channels. You got a bit pain in the rear on your hands. I had to redrill all the window channels to match the old screw holes. I too had to originally just tear out/break the old channels, the screws were either too corroded or I just couldn't find then in the microcosm of the channel. I'm sure you can dig up a derelict truck for the needed part or send Rovers North a small fortune and they'll find you one. Good luck, Morgan H. On Thu, 3 Nov 1994 mtalbot@interserv.com wrote: > All, > > Has anyone tackled the task of replacing the roof side window channels. Mine > have so much #$%@ growing in then, its impossible to open the windows even a > crack. I tried to remove one side and after bending and grinding out the old > channels, destorying the retaining Alum side trim. I got the windows out alomg > with the bottom retainer. > > Now to put them back, I know where to get the replacment channels, what about > the aluminum lip that holds the lower retaining tray ???? Anyone offer any > help. > > Rgds Mark > > From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Fri Nov 4 01:25:43 1994 From: LANDROVER@delphi.com Date: Fri, 04 Nov 1994 02:21:24 -0500 (EST) Subject: Re: Flames for Ian Stuart & assorted BS To: maloney@wings.attmail.com, lro@team.net, denis@oswego.edu X-Vms-To: INTERNET"maloney@wings.attmail.com" X-Vms-Cc: INTERNET"lro@team.net" INTERNET"denis@oswego.edu" Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Status: RO X-Status: Bill is bored... > While we're at it, does anyone know the issue of Playboy where the center > "spread" was shot in the back of a soft top 88? I'd like to see if I could > locate a back issue for my, er, Land Rover Library. > Bill... I believe that Steve Denis had that issue.. (Gasp! Not Steve!) or maybe it was just the centerfold... Cheers Mike From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Fri Nov 4 02:25:52 1994 From: LANDROVER@delphi.com Date: Fri, 04 Nov 1994 02:21:52 -0500 (EST) Subject: Re: Engine not running! To: rhcaldw@nma.mnet.uswest.com, lro@team.net X-Vms-To: INTERNET"rhcaldw@nma.mnet.uswest.com" X-Vms-Cc: INTERNET"lro@team.net" Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Status: RO X-Status: Roy... I'll cast vote #3 for your plug wires reversed. You probably have #1 in the right place but you've got the rotation reversed. I did that on the Triumph about 20 years ago... Sat up all night trying to figure out why the bugger only ran on 2 cylinders... :) Cheers Michael Loiodice E-MAIL landrover@delphi.com 166 W.Fulton St. VOICE (518) 773-2697 Gloversville NY, 12078 1972 Ser III 88 Petrol (Fern) From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Fri Nov 4 02:15:45 1994 Via: uk.ac.edinburgh.castle; Fri, 4 Nov 1994 08:13:31 +0000 From: Mr Ian Stuart Organization: Vet-lab,The Univ of Edinburgh To: lro@transfer.stratus.com Date: Fri, 4 Nov 1994 08:12:57 +0000 Subject: Re: Sad man Ian Priority: normal Status: RO X-Status: > So Ian got his Dec Land Rover WORLD.There is absolutely zilch chance > of anyone getting the Land Rover Owner early.No way. I've subscribed to both, I'll let you know when LRO arrives. (I know, I'm a sad man with no real intrests in life -- all I seem to think about are LandRovers, Computers, Goblins (RPG, not vacuum cleaners), my Hi-Fi and my wife. Please have pity on me :-) ----** Ian Stuart (Computing Officer) +44 31 650 6205 Royal (Dick) School of Veterinary Studies, Edinburgh University. WWW sites: Work -- Play -- #======================================================================# I'm not a computing nerd, I'm a computing geek. |Land Rover owners do Geeks are much higher up the evolutionary chain. | it in the mud. From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Fri Nov 4 03:18:33 1994 To: lro@team.net From: azw@aber.ac.uk (Andy Woodward) Subject: Re: Washing lorries again (sorry) Date: Fri, 4 Nov 1994 09:17:11 UNDEFINED Status: RO X-Status: Terriann says:- >I am actually near to doing another unspeakable thang to my beloved 109..paint >her. After my TR3 gets her new paint it will be the Land Rover's turn. I'm >thinking of a nice bronze green with limestone top and wheels. Once she gets >painted, she will recieve more regular washings and ....GASP waxings!! You cruel adn heartless woman! How could you do such a thing to a Landrover that has served you so selflessly? I cant bear to read this. >My seat covers may be mostly duct tape over split narahyde, but at least I No wonder Naugas are extinct. I didnt see a single one when I was out your way a few years back. >There has been a number of threads about Land Rovers as a possible "Babe" >magnet. Sorry guys, I don't know any women who would want to come into contact >with a really dirty Land ROver unless she is dessed for the occasion and in a >mood to get dirty. I dont know any that want to come into contact with a cleean one :( Or maybe it's me, women have such strange tastes........... +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Just another roadkill on the Information Superhighway +++++++++++++++++++++++ None-%er #1 +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Fri Nov 4 05:55:50 1994 From: Robert Meredith Subject: painting landrovers To: land-rover-owner@team.net Date: Fri, 4 Nov 94 11:53:32 GMT Mailer: Elm [revision: 70.85.2.1] Status: RO X-Status: Folks, Terri Anne mentioned repainting her landrover and I'm interested in doing this myself at some time in the next year. This is because it is presently green and I'm hoping to travel in it to some countries where I gather green landrovers might possibly be considered as being something military. So I'm thinking about repainting it white. Any ideas on the best way to do this so as not to replace a reasonable paint job with a crap one??!!! I look forward to your ideas, Cheers, Rob Meredith. From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Fri Nov 4 07:56:14 1994 Date: Fri, 4 Nov 1994 08:51:19 -0500 (EST) From: Steven M Denis Subject: Re: Flames for Ian Stuart & assorted BS To: ROY CALDWELL Cc: lro@stratus.com In-Reply-To: <9411032031.AA04402@mtnoca.helena_noc> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Content-Length: 1093 Status: RO X-Status: Actually,Roy,Bill M. must have 6 or 8 copies....those are the ones left over from when he wall papered his room...("Would you like to come up and see my etchings?.." Ok I'll check and see if I can find it...I may just have the photo in question and not the mag.It's ot l k ge a subscription... I *think* it was May of 1988....real sure it was may somthing...... I first saw this "artwork" at the ABP rally...A large group of guys were *carefully* examining the photo....several of the Rover widows came to peer over their sholders......they were really disgusted....the guys were ignoring the "neck-ed" lady and were checking out the ropes on the canvas roof....."So *that's* how they do that!" ...The ladies response? "You guys are really *SICK*!" steve...... "HEY! NICE JEEP,MISTER!"..........."Look,Kid,it's a ..Oh never mind..." "NOTAJEEP"-1967 109 Station Wagon Steven M. Denis " "-1957 107 Station Wagon PO Box 61 " "-1964 109 Pickup Erieville,New York USA " "_1967 109 NADA SW 13061 From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Fri Nov 4 08:20:19 1994 From: Mike Rooth Subject: Re: painting landrovers To: robm@hpman010.uksr.hp.com (Robert Meredith) Date: Fri, 4 Nov 94 14:08:43 GMT Cc: lro@transfer.stratus.com In-Reply-To: <9411041153.AA00470@hpman010.uksr.hp.com>; from "Robert Meredith" at Nov 4, 94 11:53 am Status: RO X-Status: Rob, If you dont want to spend a fortune,I've found its eminently possible to repaint a Land Rover with the common or garden paintbrush.When I did mine,I used ICI Autogloss synthethic. It would be untrue to say that the finish was as good as a good spray merchant could get(At a good spray merchant's price)but the finish is very acceptable,the paint is wonderfully glossy,and you get *much* more on the vehicle than you would spraying.Also,the brushes wash out in White Spirit.Masking is rudimentary(Door handles,indicator and side lights)and the rad grille and headlamp surrunds should be removed.But you *do* need a warm,dry day,without wind,or suitable similar conditions indoors. The danger comes from the female side who tend to use the argument"If you've got time to paint the Land Rover what about the bathroom/kitchen/perm any one out of five,that's needed painting for one/two/n years". TeriAnn, So your seats are tired?Recover 'em.All you need is some suitable vinyl,a sewing machine needle suitable for leather, and a staple gun to fasten the covers on to the seat bases,which are harder than Tank Armour and into which you just *cannot* drive a nail.Well,not mine,you couldnt.If I can do it,I'm sure you can. See OVLR for details:-) Cheers Mike Rooth From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Fri Nov 4 08:36:12 1994 From: dkenner@emr.ca (Dixon Kenner) Subject: Re: Washing lorries again (sorry) To: twakeman@apple.com Date: Fri, 4 Nov 1994 09:32:16 -0500 (EST) Cc: lro@stratus.com In-Reply-To: <9411031828.AA29040@apple.com> from "TeriAnn Wakeman" at Nov 3, 94 10:28:15 am Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 2316 Status: RO X-Status: > I am actually near to doing another unspeakable thang to my beloved 109..paint > her. After my TR3 gets her new paint it will be the Land Rover's turn. I'm > thinking of a nice bronze green with limestone top and wheels. Once she gets > painted, she will recieve more regular washings and ....GASP waxings!! I don't know about the waxings, unless it is the frame